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26-Jan-08, 07:46 PM
|  | Willia6 fan Subscriber | Join Date: Jun-06 Location: Victoria Gender:  | | | Quote:
Originally Posted by ravensgait  where Intergrades as an example DiamondXJungle are fertile. | Please tell me that's only to fire people up? 
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[WFC] Member of the willia6 fan club
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26-Jan-08, 07:58 PM
|  | Regular Member | Join Date: Jul-06 Location: sydney, northern beaches | | | Quote:
Originally Posted by Miss B The problem is that it's a hybrid. And yes, German Giants are quite sought after... in America. The same place where many Australian python species are regularly cross-bred  Same with the P. vitticeps and P. henrylawsonii cross - the Vittikins. The Yanks will cross-breed just about anything Doesn't make it right... | Miss B, im sure you already know, that i am more than understanding your statments.  but hey its fun to feel smart.
i speak regularly to someone who soon will be reciving six or seven p. barbata's which are pure barbata from germany. these are extremely rare and sought after, and i am terribly glad to say that this person (continuelly un-named as per their orders) most likely will not be breeding them, rather for studies. (nice studies, not jabby needles etc. etc.)
these animals most likely will not effect, or reach US stock as the saught after barbata blood.
beardie hybrid blood is overwhelmingly saught after due to its tendancy to form healthier, faster, stronger, larger animals. if this is true (purest thoughts aside) is it not 'ok' for the US stock which is incredibly weakened by adeno, and lack of 'fresh genes' and inbreeding etc. etc. to become strengthened by this hybrid blood.
hybridisation, 'can' have a positive effect on such stock. although i would like to see 'our' animals, naturally 'healthy' stay seperated from vitticeps and barbata.
i personally suggested the 'lending' or this persons barbata genes (breeding loan) as a means of funding their research, assuming these german barbata's are adeno free. as breeders will pay top dollar. but supprisingly and somewhat comfortingly the idea was passed off as unnecessary.
please do not PM me, or kick up dust about this un- named person, i will not name them.
within Australia, hybridisation of Pogona, is unnecessary considerign our 'healthy' and strong stock. soemone will probably end up doing it, hopefully unsuccessfuly. within the area of pythons, some find these interesting and favourable. i would like to see our australian animals remain their own species. diamonds, stay diamonds, coastals stay coastals.
some look ugly, some are look alright. i wouldnt buy them as we are more than capable of purchasing clean species specific animals.
to some extent i also beleive selective breeding can be unethical, when the animal is no longer itself. it become unscaled, or lesser scaled. eg the silk or leather backs. we havent had unscaled diamondXcoastals, so the majority wouldnt care to bicker on the subject.. 
miss b, i agree, just because some or alot of people do or use something, doesnt make it right. its not just the yanks, we have european, and other global members with hybrids as well. theres an irish guy isnt their?
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2.2.1 : Central Bearded Dragons (Pogona Vitticeps) (5) 1.0.0 : Black Soil Bearded Dragon (Pogona Henry Lawsonii) (1) 0.3.0 : Northern Spiny Tailed Geckos (Strophurus Ciliaris) (3) 0.0.1 : Ocellate Ridge Tailed Monitor (Varanus Acanthurus) (1) 1.2.0 shingleback skinks (3)  ....another 1.1.0 Rick Walker Red Bd's on their way.
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26-Jan-08, 08:03 PM
|  | Subscriber | Join Date: Nov-06 Location: SE QLD | | | |
Just a quick question ....How do we know that the snakes we are getting now a pure blood. Even some WC snakes overlap in the areas where they live. People have been breeding snakes for a long time and how many are really pure blood. I am not saying crossing is ok, its just a question I dont know the answer for.
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member of the jungle carpet lovers club
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26-Jan-08, 08:07 PM
| | Regular Member | Join Date: Jul-06 Location: sydney, northern beaches | | | Quote:
Originally Posted by jay76 Just a quick question ....How do we know that the snakes we are getting now a pure blood. Even some WC snakes overlap in the areas where they live. People have been breeding snakes for a long time and how many are really pure blood. I am not saying crossing is ok, its just a question I dont know the answer for. | try your hardest to find a breeder that has good records. possibly right back to when they were wildcaught. or at least many many generations. you can never really be entirely sure. if there is a possibility of hybridisation in your breedign stock, or in your snakes. it is ALWAYS best to tell the buyer, as we dont want hidden hybrid blood snakes out classified as pure.
this is probably the biggest problem.
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2.2.1 : Central Bearded Dragons (Pogona Vitticeps) (5) 1.0.0 : Black Soil Bearded Dragon (Pogona Henry Lawsonii) (1) 0.3.0 : Northern Spiny Tailed Geckos (Strophurus Ciliaris) (3) 0.0.1 : Ocellate Ridge Tailed Monitor (Varanus Acanthurus) (1) 1.2.0 shingleback skinks (3) ....another 1.1.0 Rick Walker Red Bd's on their way.
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26-Jan-08, 08:13 PM
| | Subscriber | Join Date: Nov-06 Location: SE QLD | | | Quote:
Originally Posted by Kirby try your hardest to find a breeder that has good records. possibly right back to when they were wildcaught. or at least many many generations. you can never really be entirely sure. if there is a possibility of hybridisation in your breedign stock, or in your snakes. it is ALWAYS best to tell the buyer, as we dont want hidden hybrid blood snakes out classified as pure.
this is probably the biggest problem. | I agree. As I said earlier the childrens, spotteds ect were all classed as the same snake up intill a few years ago in QLD so how many people are selling childrens pythons that have something else mixed in with them even if was 3 or 5 generations ago.
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member of the jungle carpet lovers club
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26-Jan-08, 08:33 PM
| | Regular Member | Join Date: Jul-06 Location: sydney, northern beaches | | | Quote:
Originally Posted by jay76 I agree. As I said earlier the childrens, spotteds ect were all classed as the same snake up intill a few years ago in QLD so how many people are selling childrens pythons that have something else mixed in with them even if was 3 or 5 generations ago. | wow, i dint realise that... it is possible these days for breeders to breed their own wild caught, childrens and spotteds. most probably for this very reason. there is a breeder in WA that has alot of wild caught for sale, and often wild caught captive bred clutches. this 'should' guaruntee a pure childrens, or a pure spotted.
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2.2.1 : Central Bearded Dragons (Pogona Vitticeps) (5) 1.0.0 : Black Soil Bearded Dragon (Pogona Henry Lawsonii) (1) 0.3.0 : Northern Spiny Tailed Geckos (Strophurus Ciliaris) (3) 0.0.1 : Ocellate Ridge Tailed Monitor (Varanus Acanthurus) (1) 1.2.0 shingleback skinks (3) ....another 1.1.0 Rick Walker Red Bd's on their way.
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26-Jan-08, 08:39 PM
| | Subscriber | Join Date: Nov-06 Location: SE QLD | | | Quote:
Originally Posted by Kirby wow, i dint realise that... it is possible these days for breeders to breed their own wild caught, childrens and spotteds. most probably for this very reason. there is a breeder in WA that has alot of wild caught for sale, and often wild caught captive bred clutches. this 'should' guaruntee a pure childrens, or a pure spotted. | That would be the only way I think to be shore that you have pure blood reptiles
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member of the jungle carpet lovers club
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26-Jan-08, 09:53 PM
| | Suspended | Join Date: Jun-05 Age: 33 | | | |
Because someone that sell them to you, say that they are pure. Thats how you know!!!! And everybody they deal with they tell that they are locality pure. Word of mouth, what a great way to know you are getting locality pure animals. Trust is really overrated!!!!
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26-Jan-08, 09:58 PM
| | Subscriber | Join Date: Nov-06 Location: SE QLD | | | Quote:
Originally Posted by Morelia_Hunter Because someone that sell them to you, say that they are pure. Thats how you know!!!! And everybody they deal with they tell that they are locality pure. Word of mouth, what a great way to know you are getting locality pure animals. Trust is really overrated!!!! | Thats what I was getting at. It is mostly word of mouth. Unless you were there when the breeder got them as WC it is all word of mouth.
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member of the jungle carpet lovers club
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26-Jan-08, 10:18 PM
| | Regular Member | Join Date: Nov-03 Location: NSW | | | |
This thread was worth reading just for the line about hybridisers being artists, classic.
''Ah Picasso, legend of Eurotrash herpetoculture, you have created a masterpiece python, and in true picasso style i can't tell what the hell it's meant to be''. Lol
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Careful with that axe Eugene.
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26-Jan-08, 10:24 PM
|  | Regular Member | Join Date: Feb-07 Location: Darwin Age/Gender: 32 | | | |
has anyone crossed a woma with a bhp?
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i like all reptiles, i like some people.
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26-Jan-08, 10:55 PM
|  | Regular Member | Join Date: Aug-05 Location: Rugsville..... Gender: | | | Quote:
Originally Posted by Dabool has anyone crossed a woma with a bhp? | not yet but i'm working on it,do you want me to pm you when i have some luck........
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BIGGER THE PYTHON THE BETTER........
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26-Jan-08, 11:13 PM
| | Regular Member | Join Date: Aug-05 Location: Rugsville..... Gender: | | | |
here is some pics of that WOMA X CARPET from the U.S.A what do you's think.
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BIGGER THE PYTHON THE BETTER........
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26-Jan-08, 11:15 PM
| | Subscriber | Join Date: Nov-06 Location: SE QLD | | | |
they the first ones or have they been doing it for a while. Never thought I would see that
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member of the jungle carpet lovers club
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26-Jan-08, 11:20 PM
| | Regular Member | Join Date: Aug-05 Location: Rugsville..... Gender: | | | |
that was the first one but that one was from 06|07 season or 05|06 not a 100%
so there could be more this year.
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BIGGER THE PYTHON THE BETTER........
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