selected from topic about bigguy's death chondro.

[sxereturn]

I wonder how many people with PNG animals would buy Aussie animals and cross them?

[obee]

the once thought to be limited distribution is a hell of a lot bigger than originally thought.it isn't as isolated as once thought either.if you know that country you would know there is a lot of inaccessable, no go areas,story places that few murrie people even go to within gtp range.i agree with most of what you are saying mate.but i believe there are 2 real reasons why we should keep an animal in captivity.1 education in a zoo situation.2 endangered status in the wild. gtp's are covered in zoo's as far as education.they aren't endangered.
to keep any wildlife is a privalage and to take from the wild when they appear to be doing fine, because you just want to, isn't right.


obee

[obee]

png animals cross aussies has already been done.thats why i was able to get progeny.i for one would never cross.i think you will be waiting for a long time ad.but i'll sell you a genetically tested deemed aussie one for $7500 in a few years.lol


obee

[obee]

i thought taking animals from the wild would be for the benefit of knowledge and saving them, so now it's financial ad.you must remember i am making the best of the gtp captive situation at present.i am not the one who created or assisted this situation.i am just lucky enough to be able to legally keep them.


obee

[Sdaji]

and to take from the wild when they appear to be doing fine, because you just want to, isn't right.

I thoroughly disagree. Hell, I even take wild animals because I want to eat them. We live on this planet and you can't hide from the fact that that means living off it. By living in a house, breathing air and eating food you use up resources which can't be used by anything else. Dare I ask if you drive a car? The world is there for us to appreciate and use. We should use it as much as we possibly can without hurting it. As far as I'm concerned, I own as much of this planet as anyone else (and so do you and so does everyone else) and if some of us want to take green pythons from a population which won't be harmed by taking them, then so we should.

[SnakeWrangler]

Originally Posted by Sdaji

I thoroughly disagree. Hell, I even take wild animals because I want to eat them. We live on this planet and you can't hide from the fact that that means living off it. By living in a house, breathing air and eating food you use up resources which can't be used by anything else. Dare I ask if you drive a car? The world is there for us to appreciate and use. We should use it as much as we possibly can without hurting it. As far as I'm concerned, I own as much of this planet as anyone else (and so do you and so does everyone else) and if some of us want to take green pythons from a population which won't be harmed by taking them, then so we should.

I agree, so long as the wild population isn't harmed in anyway.

[peterescue]

Originally Posted by Baritji

I went to Fogg Dam with that lady a few weeks ago... Most of her released snakes die

They quite probably do but how does anyone know. Are they fitted with tracking devises? Or do the kookaburras etc keep a tally.

[obee]

sdaji i am glad you are a minority with that train of thought.by all means take gtp's from the wild and see where that arguement gets ya in court.lol.i'm not sure from what you said whether you want to keep em or eat em.lol. what animals do you take and eat from the wild out of curiosity?out of the clouds and back to the real world,none of us even truly own the animals we keep.stuff up and they can be taken off you in a heartbeat.a bloke once did what you think is your right and took a gtp from the wild.he made the mistake of letting me and others know and the problem was rectified.that animal is back where it belongs,where it should be and has been long before you deciced you had the right to remove it.i think gtp's will get along just fine where they are sdaji without your help.at this stage they appear to not need anyones help.i thought you wanted to originally help them now your true motives come out you just want em cause you want em.


obee

[michaelh]

Sdaji,

I believe it was your line of thinking that led to slavery. I'll bet if they were worth $50 very few people would give them a second thought re their status.

My vet up here(Cairns) did some voluntary work in the tagging process and says there seems to be a healthy population in the natural environment

Bigguy, very sorry to hear of your loss.

Michael

[SnakeWrangler]

I think sdaji was making an argument as to why a small number should be taken legally to start a colony for private keepers. With this line of thinking we should all stop breeding any reptiles and only view them in the wild, if that is the case obee then maybe you should condiser giving you GTP's to someone who believes they should have them as you clearly don't think you should? I wonder why you were so keen to purchase them, I guess you are very interested in learning about them, maybe you will give your clutches away considering you are not interested in the money. Or better still maybe should prepare each of them for living in the wild again and release considering that is where they belong. I wonder who would be most affected by the allowance to remove some for private breeding colonies, the GTP's or the person who has some of the only legal ones in Australia?

[Sdaji]

Obee, in case it wasn't obvious, I wasn't implying that anyone who wanted to get some Chondros should just rock up to Iron Range and take as many as they wanted. It should be done responsibly and legally. I wouldn't dream of taking wild Chondros illegally, it would be an absurd thing to do with the current situation. My wishes for a captive colony to be established have nothing to do with wanting to keep them personally. There are heaps of species I'd never want to keep but want to see established in captivity, including mammals and birds. The reason I think it would be particularly good with Australian Chondros is that there are many people who would willingly take supremely good care of them at their own expense.

What do I take to eat? Many species of fish, rabbits, insects (laugh all you want), the occasional 'roo and many others. I wouldn't take anything illegally or anything that was from a vulnerable population. Eating farmed meat is bad for the environment, it must be farmed on land which would otherwise be habitat for wild animals. Responsibly taking wild animals is good for the environment as it lessens the need for land to be used by agriculture. Incidentally, I also legally eat wild animals from vulnerable populations (as do most people), usually without realising it at the time. Most of the seafood you buy from the local supermarket or fishmonger is wild caught, and often from over exploited populations (there are also other examples). It's often (usually?) impossible to tell the stuff which has been collected responsibly from that which has been collected irresponsibly. You can get all high and mighty saying you respect the world by not taking a tiny number of green pythons or such but you have your head in the clouds. It is absurd to say on one hand that it's fine to eat wild animals (regularly and in high numbers) but on the other hand say that taking a miniscule number of wild animals for the establishment of a captive population which will bring joy and knowledge to people is bad! We must ackowledge that living on this planet means using its resources. We need to learn to use these resources properly, not avoid using them wherever possible. Anyone who drives a car, wears manufactured clothes, uses a computer etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc and says we should never make use of wild animals is an absolute hypocrite and has their head way up above the clouds.

Michael, I have never said there wasn't a healthy population in Australia and even in this thread I've already said there are probably more than most people think.

I think the GTP's taken from the wild should be given to experienced breeders ie; bigguy (only used your name as an example as you probably have enough on your plate with all your other breedings) ect under the condition that the successful hatchlings be GIVEN away to other EXPERIENCED herpers so the captive population can become larger. That way, in no way, are they benefiting from the ownership of these animals, except for small funding from the government for feeding, accessories ect.

Cheers, Alan.

[instar]

I understood what you said sdaji and i personally agree, thats not to say others dont have valid opinions. Ease up a little bit people, we all want whats left to be here for our kids and theirs, right?

Right!

[Jonny]

I agree with Sdaji,

We have to look at the world around us as a resource that should be managed properly/sustainably. A $ value has to be put on it for it to be preserved otherwise it will be destroyed.