NSW DECCW Code of Practice...

[ShaunMorelia]

But what exactly is the problem with enclosure sizes????
The sizes seem reasonable to me
People who use tubs etc might want to complain but most PET owners would not
Maybe this will slow down the people who just want lots of slitherers but have neither the time or inclination to treat them as pets??
.
.
Uh Oh
{I better hide for a while after that statement I suppose}
..

The current "guideline" sizes are fine IMO.
Its the fact that in 5 years the floor area will be more than double the current and will be enforcable as a minimum.

So if I wanted to keep 1 adult morelia that doesn't grow longer than 2.5m, to comply with the 5 year increase, I would need the floor space area of 1.52sqm. (sqm = square meters)
Altho it does say for "climbing species" that, that area can either be floor area or back wall area.
That said I can have any Morelia spilota ssp that only grows to maximum of 2.5m. in a box that is 1.2H x 1.3W x 0.6D and comply with the future increase.

Another thing of worry is that they will class any reptile that is 12mths or over as an adult and will have to be housed like an adult. (keeping in mind the above measurements)
I have a couple of yearlings that are lucky to push 60-70cm, so housing them in adult sized enclosres wouldn't be beneficial for their future IMO.

[AUSHERP]

legislation like this will just crush the hobby, not many people have space like that. across 100 snakes you're gonna need a mansion of a reptile room.

[Pythoninfinite]

Another thing of worry is that they will class any reptile that is 12mths or over as an adult and will have to be housed like an adult. (keeping in mind the above measurements)
I have a couple of yearlings that are lucky to push 60-70cm, so housing them in adult sized enclosres wouldn't be beneficial for their future IMO.

That's 12 months for snakes - it's six months to adult size for lizards, which is patently absurd for most pet species. This has been designed by clerks... for clerks... not for reptiles or their keepers.

J

[Radar]

I wonder how much longer it is before this pushes into other states? This is not a well thought out change over at all.

[hornet]

That's 12 months for snakes - it's six months to adult size for lizards, which is patently absurd for most pet species. This has been designed by clerks... for clerks... not for reptiles or their keepers.

J

6months for lizards? Yes some species will be pretty close to adult by then but the more commonly kept species still have alot of growing to do at a year of age

[Australis]

longqi,

Judging from your own photos i highly doubt all enclosures would comply,your retics for example. practice what you preach/spam.

[Waterrat]

Longqui, I am not having a go at you but 60x50x30 for an adult chondro is pretty small, in fact, it's very small in my opinion. How can they assume their natural ambush position in a 30cm high enclosure without licking the floor of the cage?

[ShaunMorelia]

Chondros are 60x50x30 minimum with most being larger

Im taking 60x50 being the floor dimensions.
That would give you a floor area of 0.3sqm, which is better than the 0.225sqm current "guideline".

Once these sizes are to change, you will need to meet a floor area or back wall area of 0.563sqm.
And sir, your enclosures would not meet the enforecable requirements that they intend to impose.

[Waterrat]

I didn't know Qld has Regs pertaining to cage sizes. Can you post a link?

[ShaunMorelia]

Hi Waterrat
I said that was the minimum size of the display enclosures
We use them for smaller chondros up to about 2 years old
The adults are housed minimum 1.6x80x40 and even larger for Biaks because they can reach 2metres+

Exactly our point, they are calling 12mth old snakes adults and have to be housed in adult sized enclosures. Not all animals that are that age would be suited to be housed in an enclosure that big.

[-Peter]

and in five years we in NSW will all have to comply with exhibitors requirements.

[Braidotti]

What would the requirements be for a BHP under the new proposed code of practice, since they get to 3m and our ground dwellers ?

[ShaunMorelia]

How can it be pointless crap if these regulations will improve things for the snakes????

Any regulations that will improve housing conditions for reptiles should be welcomed???

I just finished reading all the proposed changes
Nothing in there will be detrimental FOR THE SNAKES
Yes
Some people will complain that they cannot house all their reptiles any more
In that case sell them off and limit their collections to what they can handle
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Did you not read my posts?

What would the requirements be for a BHP under the new proposed code of practice, since they get to 3m and our ground dwellers ?

According to the code they come under the same class as morelia.
1.52sqm floor area.

[hugsta]

How can it be pointless crap if these regulations will improve things for the snakes????

Any regulations that will improve housing conditions for reptiles should be welcomed???

I just finished reading all the proposed changes
Nothing in there will be detrimental FOR THE SNAKES
Yes
Some people will complain that they cannot house all their reptiles any more
In that case sell them off and limit their collections to what they can handle
..


..

I agree, if it is for the benefits of our animals, then fair enough. But there is a minimum to what our animals need and these cage are certainly rediculously large and not needed. In fact, it would cause more problems for most people as most underfeed their snakes and would have an animal no where near adult size in 12 months and putting that small animal into a rediculously large enclosure is most likely going to cause it to stress, stop feeding, hide in the coldest part etc etc and be more detrimental to that animal than it being in an appropriately sized enclosure. Nothing wrong with tubs, they give the animal a great sense of security and wellbeing IMO.

[Pythoninfinite]

This thread is not a debate about the welfare of reptiles, it is about the Code of Practice proposed for introduction in NSW. Your opinions on animal welfare probably don't differ much from those of most other members on this site longqi. If you are unable to distinguish between these two very separate concepts, please butt out.

This is a matter that is extremely important to keepers in NSW, and it will have very wide ranging effects, not just for pet keepers and exhibitors, but those who hold large collections for venom production etc.

Jamie