 Recent Herp Discussion | | | | | | | | Online Users: 171 | | 99 members and 72 guests | | $N@K3$, ad, adbacus, Addicted, AlexB, antaresia childreni, aprice, bowdnboy, Br3ndo, Bredlislave, bredli_lover, Bung-Eye, caustichumor, chunky, dave8208, Dmoore, Dragontamer, dragozz, dude_joel, Enhancepc, Eylandt, falconboy, Feurety, fine_jungles, first_time_owner, froggyboy86, frogmancorey56, funcouple, gold&black..., hallie, havik1018, herpkeeper, herpsrule, hodges, Hooglabah, hozy6, idontlikeurmango, ihaveherps, imalizard, inthegrass, J-L-L, Jackrabbit, jemnesa, Jscott, Jungle_Freak, Katherine, Kenshin, Khagan, Kyro, lauren87, maccy291, Mangles, MatE, matty_sd, Minke, MoreliaMatt, mr black, mrboajangles, MrBredli, Mrs I, mungus, MzSel, m_beardie, nathanandsarah, paleoherp, palmej, Perez, Puggs, Reptile_Boy, Repz, Rocky, saratoga, Shonfield, Smellie, snakecharma, Southside Morelia, swaddo, tahniandshae, TheBoga, trouser_snake6, troycoop, TURBO8, Varanus1, VixenBabe, waruikazi, weedyau, Wench, Whimsey, xshadowx | |  | | 
03-Aug-03, 08:51 AM
|  | Old Administrator | Join Date: Jan-03 Location: Sydney south, NSW Age/Gender: 54  | | | |
If you look at this issue in mature way, you will find that every one of you experts is right in some way. I would recommend you to keep your mind open to other people's view and read articles from different sources. I am keeping in mind that some of the issues will be always argued and who I am to be mister right. God? I can have opinion, but I don't like to push it on other people. I thing same like NoOnes
''''Intergrades breed with intergrades in the wild.
The fact npws says mcdowelli/spilota is because the snake thats exactly what it is, the species is morelia spilota mcdowelli spilota.''''
But if somebody has a different opinion, He is entitled to have it, the same as I have mine, and he is welcome to let us know his view in civilize manner.
People who push they arguments too strongly usually sounds like smart alecs and I personally don't admire most of know-everything people. Modesty will impress me every time.
I hope that you guys can read Slatemans english
|
03-Aug-03, 09:20 AM
|  | Regular Member | Join Date: May-03 Location: Sydeny NSW, Around Dural | | |
Loud and Clear SJ, Couldn't agree with you more 
__________________
Light travels faster than sound, this is why some people appear bright until you here them speak.
|
03-Aug-03, 12:14 PM
| | Regular Member | Join Date: Apr-03 Location: No where | | |
Greebo, spot on.
Thats how some new species are formed, intergrades are just one of the newer species to have come along.
Who knows they may go back a thousand years or more or even less. Not enough research has been done and it wasn't till recently that most poeple recognised them as a species.
I must have miss read your post, who cares theres nothing like a good debate
__________________
The mind is like a parachute, it only works when it\'s open.
|
03-Aug-03, 05:56 PM
|  | Subscriber | Join Date: Jan-03 Location: Cairns | | |
Without wishing to stir this pot too much, I think some people have a misunderstanding about reptile distributions. How can you tell me that there is coastals, then intergrades then diamonds and they do not interbreed put have discontinous ranges that abutt each other? Why, when there is an intergrade or diamond female 1km away, would a coastal male go for the coastal female who is 5km away? How far does a male snake range in search of a female? I don't know but you have to add to this number the amount he or she may travel through the year in search for food. I don't know all the answers but nor do I claim to as some people seem to be doing. If people are going to make these claims, that coastal and intergrade's do not overlap territory nor do diamonds and intergrades, can you please tell me where you are getting this information from?
Any one who goes to North Coast Herp Group would know that they are doing some research into snake distributions. My understanding is they they are finding some very surprising results. hopefully, when this research is finished we will have a better understanding of pythons ranges.
__________________
Fool Injected Physhopath |
03-Aug-03, 06:17 PM
| | Regular Member | Join Date: Apr-03 Location: No where | | | |
Mags my info comes from people around port macquaire (and the time i've spent there) and all have said that diamonds and coastal aren't there it's just intergrades.
Obviously there would be an overlap somewhere at each end. But like i said more research has to be done before it can be fully understood.
Diamonds aren't found on the north coast and coastals aren't found in sydney, they have to stop somewhere, they may well stop either side of the intergrades distribution and never come into contact.
I don't claim to know everything about them but i've had fair bit to do with them over the last few years and what i've stated is my understanding of them, the main point i was trying to make is that they are not hybrids.
__________________
The mind is like a parachute, it only works when it\'s open.
|
03-Aug-03, 07:17 PM
| | Regular Member | Join Date: May-03 Location: Sydeny NSW, Around Dural | | | |
This is confusing...Can someone please explain what the following are:
Hybrids:
Intergrades:
Natural-Intergrades:
__________________
Light travels faster than sound, this is why some people appear bright until you here them speak.
|
03-Aug-03, 11:22 PM
| | Regular Member | Join Date: Apr-03 Location: No where | | | |
From this day forward i vow never to enter into a debate about hybrids or intergrades. Everything i've stated was in my best knowledge and findings and i can no longer bring myself to repeat it :roll:
BB, You will never get a straight answer theres to many conficting opions my suggestion is to go and find out yourself. However i do feel theres has been enough info presented to get a rough idea, i think i even PM you some info a while back, you should have some idea.
__________________
The mind is like a parachute, it only works when it\'s open.
|
04-Aug-03, 06:41 AM
|  | biasedly unbiased Moderator | Join Date: Jan-03 Location: Wagga Wagga NSW 2650 Gender: | | | |
I agree with NO_One. :mrgreen:
__________________
You have the right to an opinion. Unfortunately, you appear to have chosen the wrong one.
|
04-Aug-03, 07:47 AM
| | Old Administrator | Join Date: Jan-03 Location: Sydney south, NSW Age/Gender: 54 | | | |
Me to, no point to argue about this. enough mentioned all ready.
|
04-Aug-03, 09:05 AM
| | Regular Member | Join Date: Mar-03 Location: nsw | | | |
If anyone is really interested in naturally occuring integrades, contact greg hollis from port macquarie/coffs, will look up his email if anyone wants it.
cheers
meg
btw not to enter into the debate but the best snake i ever had was a diamond x brisbane carpet hybrid (hybrid as they are not found in the same regions), which I ended up giving to a little boy with cancer, most placid animal I ever had. So just enjoy your new addition belinda for what it is, a python..........
|
04-Aug-03, 10:23 AM
| | Regular Member | Join Date: Apr-03 Location: No where | | | |
Yeah Meg i got mine off Greg a few years back, he knows his stuff.
__________________
The mind is like a parachute, it only works when it\'s open.
|
04-Aug-03, 01:13 PM
| | Subscriber | Join Date: Jan-03 Location: Cairns | | |
Sure does....
__________________
Fool Injected Physhopath |
06-Aug-03, 09:56 AM
| | Regular Member | Join Date: Jan-03 Location: north queensland | | | | diamond or carpet.
hi everyone..
first of all lets remember that belle started the thread out of her own interest as to what her snake is. she should be infact comended for this. owning a reptile shouldnt be just about having the animal in a cage. as with belle there should be an interest about species, habitat etc.
coastals and diamonds arnt differant species but infact just sub species. crossing sudspecies isnt hybritising its intergrading. Of course this if kept true would have to be done with the right area form under captive conditions.
Intergrades as they have been labeled are a natural crossing of morelia spilota mcdowelli and m.s spliota spilota this has occured in what is beleived the most southern range of coastal carpets and the most northern range of diamond pythons.
For anyone that has the barker book on page 135 it talks about the distrabution of diamonds and coastal carpets and the intergrading of these two species. also uses worell 1963, wilson 1988, gow 1989 as referances for this data as well as others. it also talks about diamonds/intergrades from barrington tops.
we have a freind with animals from barrington tops area that to me looked like diamonds. he considers them to be so and has been breeding these animals together. they are a very dark colouration with alot of black markings, his focas is on retaining the darkest of the offspring with the hope of breeding a black python at some stage in the future. Somthing differant i guess.
have to suport magpie all the way..the presure for food ,habitat with strong species numbers have changed there distrabution location over time and will continue to do so with many species. distrabution maps that were done 10 years ago may infact be out of date with some species. especally with irban sprawl forcing animals out of what was considered there home range. there are many instances of animals being found in locations that was thought they didnt inhabit many years earlyer. and yes this could be happening for many reasons including from interferance from us as people. but the point is they are living and breeding in these new areas and that makes the previous distrabution maps void.
we have also heard about the north coast groups study on reptile distrabution. we also hope they get to finish and publish the data they are collecting as this will indeed re write some of the earlyer beleifs
From what i have heard and seen of greg hollises intergardes you will only get very true and pure blood from his lines. he has a real interest in this form and has been working with it for some time.
just some thoughts..
cheers paul.
|
06-Aug-03, 02:25 PM
|  | Regular Member | Join Date: Jun-03 Location: mid north coast | | |
your snake is beautiful, bb.
i'm sure you love it no matter what it is, and what it might be.
just love it and care for it.
all that should matter is it's health and happiness. 
__________________
a stopped clock gives the right time twice a day
|
06-Aug-03, 03:10 PM
| | Regular Member | Join Date: Jan-03 Location: Sydney | | |
Very interesting Paul. | | |
|
