skin problem or more?

[nightowl]

Hi everyone,

In the OPMV thread I mentioned a female python I have which could possibly be infected. She had a Respiratory Infection about 3 weeks ago, which had her blowing bubbles and (believe it or not) coughing OUT mucus (all over the glass!). She reponded to Fortum injections which I finished administering on the 23rd Aug. The day after her last shot she entered the opaque stage of her slough and on the 29th she shed in one piece. These problem scales are not near the injection sites and the one pictured is in the lower part of her body, about 8 inches from the cloaca. There are others further up the body aswell on both sides.

Since she shed she has been in her hide, so I decided to get her out this morning for observation. Her skin is littered with what seems to be 'bleached' scales here and there. Some are patches of 3 or 4 scales but the one in the picture is the biggest. As you can see in the pic, there is a white 'ring' around the area which looks as though the scales are bleached. She hasn't been out of her hide since she shed, so I doubt it is a burn. Could it be a fungal or bacterial infection? Maybe that is what caused her RI in the first place? Or maybe worms? I have never delt with worms so I am not sure what the symptoms are for various types of worm.

Needless to say I will take her to the vet for closer inspection but if anyone in this forum has seen anything like this please let me know. Also, is anythng like this a possible symptom of OPMV? I would not be asking except she could possibly be infected.

Thanks
Shane

[waruikazi]

That's no good mate. Could it be necrosis (dying flesh)? that's all i can think of, but taking it to the vet like you said is the best idea. Best of luck.

[Pythoninfinite]

Looks like scale rot to me Nightowl, definitely something serious going on in the tissue under the skin, and vet attention would be a must. Not sure if it could be related to a viral infection, the symptoms of those are often neurological and respiratory, more than physically evident like that. I'd plumb for fungal or bacterial from the picture, but you'd wonder what would cause the immune system to be compromised enough to get that happening in the first place, especially if the environmental factors of caging, heating etc were OK. Some of the antibiotics use in treating RIs and common infections can be quite toxic to kidneys etc too, so it looks like another trip to the vet eh? Please keep us posted, and good luck!

Jamie.

[nightowl]

Thanks guys. Jamie, I forgot to mention her cage heating and such. she has been kept quite warm since I started the Fortum treatment. 27 degrees at the cool end and 31 under the ceramic emmiter. I had to keep her like this for the Fortum to do its job and she spends most of her time at the hot end. She is still in this temp but I was considering lowering it in the next few days. Her substrate is newspaper and is changed regularly. She has an upside down plastic tub for a hide, a climbing branch and ceramic water bowl.

It has been just over a week since her last injection and 3 weeks since I started her treatment. I will get her to the vet today and see what he says. I will keep you posted and if the unfortunate does happen and she dies, I will be the necropsy done and EM test for OPMV and will also let everyone know here of the results.

Shane

[Pythoninfinite]

Sounds like you've been doing all the right things Nightowl, so good luck to you ... and your critter too of course. The lesions look as though they are quite deeply sub-cutaneous. What a concern for you to have at this time!

Best wishes, Jamie.

[krusty]

what did your vet say about it................

[nightowl]

can't get in to see him til late this arvo or early tomorrow. Will keep you posted.

[RevDaniel]

Goof luck. hope the snake is better soon.

[craig.a.c]

I would be taking it to the vet right away. Looks like it could be scale rot. Get it onto antibiotic injections ASAP.

[Mysnakeau]

Could saltwater do it any good, until you can get to the vet. These reptiles are still a learning experience with me but I know with other animals, especially fish, fungal and some bacterial infections can be successfully treated with salt water. Surely it couldn't hurt a snake?

And how sensitive is a reptile's immune system to antibiotics. You said she's just completed a course of antibiotic injections. I know antibiotics are important for treating ailments but I know in rabbits in particular the antibiotic would also kill their nature gut flora, leaving their immune systems down and free for further complications to get in, until the natural gut flora is restored.

I know I am not the best advisor, but just wanted to add my two bobs worth perhaps so I can compare a reptile's immunity and their response to medications, against other delicate animals. Rabbits aren't that delicate but very few vets know enough about rabbits to know to administer the right medication for problems, then their immune systems drop in the process of trying to ward of the present bug.

Worms? Need to get the snakes eating to be able to worm them, don't you? I certainly couldn't syringe it down my snakes neck, I'd hate to upset her like that.

All the same, I hope she makes a full recovery. Good luck with her.

[Slateman]

Looks like skin rot.
Antibiotic are important in this case and as you said the snake had one run of it now. I hope that you was washing the snake in disinfectant solution at least every second day and dried the skin after the soak. it is important to dry the scales after the wash. Skin rot loves moisture environment. Disinfectant should help to kill the bacteria. Some times if the snake is left long time with out help, this things can get viral and it is harder to treat.

You maybe find out after your snake visit to vet that the scaring is not infected anymore and the snake just need to shed and things will get better from then. Most of the time first lot of antibiotic kills the bacteria and scaring is still there for some time.

Good think for washing the snake is Hibitan disinfectant from coopers. It is used for washing wounds on animals and farmers use it for sheep dipping and washing cows tits. You cam mix 100 ml of Hibitan with 1 litre of water.

[nightowl]

Thanks for the advice guys n gals. I have an appointment 9.15 in the morning and I only just got back from Canberra (Picking up my new pair of Olives! it is midnight now) so I will take her to the vet, possibly start some more antibiotics and bathe her. Would a weak solution of F10 be OK to bath her in?

[Tatelina]

oh dear! Good luck to you!

All these serious things that could happen! rather scary for a newbie that thought they could only catch colds and worms! :S

[nightowl]

So the vet checked her out and seems to think it may be a dermatitis. He isn't experienced with reptiles and openly admits this so it could possibly be skin rot or blistering. The patch in the photo is worse now, with scales in the middle peeling off.

The vet suggests using an iodine spray but what disinfectant is best for snakes skin? They have an Iodine spray there that they use in surgery prepping. Would a betadine scrub be better? Maybe an F10 solution? anyone?

[Kyro]

I'd seriously suggest trying to locate a more experienced herp vet in your area, I know your very isolated but maybe you could ring a local herp society quickly & get some help