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wokka
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Appropriate house insurance could cover them against hail damage.
Solar Electricity
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wokka
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I know I used the expessin Clean energy , but of more importance is RENEWABLE energy. Most fuels are a finite rescouce and so woll eventually run out but solar, wind, tidal and hydro use energy as part of the cycle without reducing the long term availability of the power source.I know of some new "clean" energy technology in the works... These things are not too far off
The trick to maximising the benefit of solar is to recognise the difference between the purchase tariff and feed-in tariff. Here in QLD electricity costs approx 18c/kw and the feed-in is 44c/kw (net). So for every 1kw fed back into the system you're saving 2kw of traditional usage cost. Feed-in ONLY occurs when collection from the panels exceeds the usage at the time. That means, for example (and not taking into account inefficiencies, etc), that if you turn the house off (all power usage, not practical but merely an example) between the prime collection hours (9am - 3pm) with a 2kw system you will collect 12kw of energy, giving you, outside of that time period, 24kw of free energy usage. Hope that makes sense.. lol.
When they say the system is $8000, only costs us $3000 and we have to sell them our recs,
doesnt that mean the 'export' doesnt get earnt until the $5k is paid or forever?
or is it so they make a 'commision' on our recs above the 66c we are paid
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wokka
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The advantage with the NSW system is that we get paid the feed in tarrif of 60 cents for the gross power generated. If you are making an investment only decision in NSW, your own usage is irrelevant.
RECs are Renewable Energy Certificates. They have a value depending upon supply and demand. At the moment the value is down because the solar installations are booming due to Government subsidies. If the whole Carbo trading thing ever takes off Businesses who want/need to pollute will have to by Carbon credits ( which will include RECs).Clean Bussinesses will be able to sell Caron credits. 1 REC is worth 1 kw of pwer although the government is subsidising some RECS which distorts the market. RECS at the moment are about 32cents but some companies offer more if you buy their system as an advertising gimmick.
It's a bit like buying shares in that REC traders hope that the REC value wil increase over time. The big polluters like coal power and Aluminium smelters are trying to get the Government to give them Carbon Credits for nothing with scaremongering about job losses and stuff. That will defeat the whole reason for the scheme. The idea is to put the cost of pollution onto the users of the polluted product rather than making the whole community wear the cost of dirty industries as it does now. You can then chose to use claen products or dirty products which will refect their real cost.
RECs are Renewable Energy Certificates. They have a value depending upon supply and demand. At the moment the value is down because the solar installations are booming due to Government subsidies. If the whole Carbo trading thing ever takes off Businesses who want/need to pollute will have to by Carbon credits ( which will include RECs).Clean Bussinesses will be able to sell Caron credits. 1 REC is worth 1 kw of pwer although the government is subsidising some RECS which distorts the market. RECS at the moment are about 32cents but some companies offer more if you buy their system as an advertising gimmick.
It's a bit like buying shares in that REC traders hope that the REC value wil increase over time. The big polluters like coal power and Aluminium smelters are trying to get the Government to give them Carbon Credits for nothing with scaremongering about job losses and stuff. That will defeat the whole reason for the scheme. The idea is to put the cost of pollution onto the users of the polluted product rather than making the whole community wear the cost of dirty industries as it does now. You can then chose to use claen products or dirty products which will refect their real cost.
RECs represent the solar system's environmental value: how many megawatts of clean energy it will produce. A 1.05kW system over 15 years in Victoria is worth 18 RECs. 18 RECs means 18 megawatts of electricity produced from a clean generating source over 15 years. If you're not producing 18 megawatts of your own clean energy you're buying it from the coal plant. RECs are a tradeable commodity and can fluctuate in value like shares. Green Energy Trading will buy the RECs off you. They then sell them to electricity retailers in bundles of 5000. The government says the retailers must buy RECs to offset the pollution. So in a sense the retailers need to produce clean energy, and in a sense you are providing it to them at a price.
Kristy_07
Very Well-Known Member
Hi, wokka
This is what I was talking about as well. It is a system that "someone I know"
has constructed that is a completely renewable energy source. I'm not really trying to keep it secret - in all reality, it is too complex for me to understand or explain. But there was no misunderstanding the subsequent environmental benefits from switching to this kind of energy. It is essentially a home-hydro system. Their house runs off the small prototype he made, and they put a LOT back into the grid. Last I had heard, London was looking at building a very large one to run in the centre of the city, for an obscene amount of money. I hope that it means that gas and oil, as an energy resource at least, become a thing of the past very quickly.
slim6y
Almost Legendary
Kristy - when you read this you'll re-ask that question to something like - When will an environmental dollar be included:
"Australia's black coal exports were worth around $A55 billion in 2008-09"
And there's no hiding the source Australian Coal Association - The Australian Coal Industry - Coal Exports
So - when you are willing to give up $55bill into your country - then the world can become greener again
(sorry for the pessimistic outlook - but I 100% agree - every house in Australia should have at the minimum solar hot water heating - and that is at the bare minimum!)
jinin
Very Well-Known Member
next year i will probably be moving to Telegraph Point, NSW. The mains power to the property is 2km away, the property is 255 acres... so we will have to get Solar as our only power source. Its good because the majority of sunlight is during the warmer months and the less is in the colder months(Obviously) however when its cold there will be less power, but i wont need any for my reptiles as they will be in hibernation
SLACkra
Very Well-Known Member
Honestly I don't see much of a point of these small setups. If you want to help the environment select to have your energy generated from green energy. Also photovoltaic cells might sound really great but look into solar thermal. Basically its exactly like it is now with burning a fossil fuel to get heat energy except you harness solar energy. They are also able to store this energy very efficiently and produce energy during the night. I had to do an Environmental Impact Statment for a hypothetical solar thermal plant last semester (environmental engineering student) and the technology is sound it just lacks investment and interest.
Photovoltaic might be nice but they can be more expensive. Also in our generally warm climate they don't do as well as they are less efficient in higher temperatures. Solar thermal plants that run with the tower design are basically just a tower where sunlight is focused by ordinary square flat mirrors. The only draw back is the efficiency is the same as coal fired power plant as they use the rankine cycle (steam engine).
Just some food for thought.
Photovoltaic might be nice but they can be more expensive. Also in our generally warm climate they don't do as well as they are less efficient in higher temperatures. Solar thermal plants that run with the tower design are basically just a tower where sunlight is focused by ordinary square flat mirrors. The only draw back is the efficiency is the same as coal fired power plant as they use the rankine cycle (steam engine).
Just some food for thought.
babba007
Well-Known Member
My friend had her solar installed at the end of last year. She was out of pocket $18000, but she puts electricity back into the grid now, so she doesn't get a bill.
I can think of alot of things I can do with 18k though.
I can think of alot of things I can do with 18k though.
Duke
Very Well-Known Member
WAAAA!!!! 90% efficiency! Where are you guys getting your figures from?
Commercial photovoltaic cells have an efficiency of around 20%. 25% for the real fancy ones.
The bottom line is, that you can run off 100% solar energy, but only in a specially designed house, which contains (more importantly) energy minded individuals. The house that Slim mentioned earlier, form memory, was out in the countryside that had nice summer sun to heat up the north facing house, with triple glazed glass to keep the heat in, which covered basically the whole side of the house, so when the cool breezes come in, then you have your "free" air conditioning. Follow it up with a solar hot water system for your bathing needs, wood fires for winter warming, etc etc, and you have yourself a home that doesn't feed from the grid.
But like I said, you need to be on top of your electricity usage to get anywhere close to 100% solar use.
If you're building a new house and can factor in the features I mentioned above, then sure, a PV system is a good investment. But the further south you live, the harder it is to get the valuable sunlight.
Another misconception that appears in this thread is the efficiency around storing of energy. Electricity is VERY inefficient to store. That's why the government keep building bigger power stations. Electricity doesn't want to be stored, so as Australia's (and the world's) electricity consumption increases more stations are needed to supply us with it. Batteries for PV systems are large and expensive, and can't drive your average household for very long. It's like trying to power your computer from a 12V car battery. It can be done, but it won't stay powered on for very long.
/takes breath
But don't let me scare you. If you feel good about "doing the right thing" or want to invest for the long term, then PV are a good option, but they're not the answer to the energy crisis.
Oh p.s. someone made a comment about fossil fuels... Do you know how much energy goes into mining out the rare metals for the cells, and the energy needed to produce the cells?
Commercial photovoltaic cells have an efficiency of around 20%. 25% for the real fancy ones.
The bottom line is, that you can run off 100% solar energy, but only in a specially designed house, which contains (more importantly) energy minded individuals. The house that Slim mentioned earlier, form memory, was out in the countryside that had nice summer sun to heat up the north facing house, with triple glazed glass to keep the heat in, which covered basically the whole side of the house, so when the cool breezes come in, then you have your "free" air conditioning. Follow it up with a solar hot water system for your bathing needs, wood fires for winter warming, etc etc, and you have yourself a home that doesn't feed from the grid.
But like I said, you need to be on top of your electricity usage to get anywhere close to 100% solar use.
If you're building a new house and can factor in the features I mentioned above, then sure, a PV system is a good investment. But the further south you live, the harder it is to get the valuable sunlight.
Another misconception that appears in this thread is the efficiency around storing of energy. Electricity is VERY inefficient to store. That's why the government keep building bigger power stations. Electricity doesn't want to be stored, so as Australia's (and the world's) electricity consumption increases more stations are needed to supply us with it. Batteries for PV systems are large and expensive, and can't drive your average household for very long. It's like trying to power your computer from a 12V car battery. It can be done, but it won't stay powered on for very long.
/takes breath
But don't let me scare you. If you feel good about "doing the right thing" or want to invest for the long term, then PV are a good option, but they're not the answer to the energy crisis.
Oh p.s. someone made a comment about fossil fuels... Do you know how much energy goes into mining out the rare metals for the cells, and the energy needed to produce the cells?
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