ATTENTION reptile keepers from all states

[PMyers]

So you're trying to tell me that they don't check out the figures prior to accepting or rejecting a decision? So what's to stop a party from simply fudging the figures? Of course they already know, and have ready access to these figures. Seems like a sad case of hoop jumping to me.

 

[GeckoJosh]

My name is Johnny Depp, I keep 10 of every species on the NSW license species list, if given the chance I will flood the Vic market with any animal I can

 

[KaotikJezta]

They would check once the submission goes through but I guess they figure if you don't put in the effort you don't really have the research behind you to back the submission.

Junglepython and Katotikjezta's comments make perfect sense I guess.
What would be their reason for needing to know numbers of such kept species and more specifically names?
Would it be to stop an inaccurate submission getting passed?

If they deem that there are not enough animals in private collections they wont bother adding it to the list. They have also removed things from the list due to lack of availability. It's the government, they work in more mysterious ways than god.

 

[Dmnted]

Fair call KaoticJezta..Like the age old saying "You learn something everyday"
Now I'm just waiting for some **#$@!! to ask if they can make the same submission in relation to ball pythons :lol:

 

[PMyers]

They would check once the submission goes through but I guess they figure if you don't put in the effort you don't really have the research behind you to back the submission.

So, yeah... hoop jumping. Better known as "We'll do everything in our power to make this submission as difficult as humanly possible... simply because we can". Bureaucratic Bull^%$t at it's finest

 

[Red-Ink]

So, yeah... hoop jumping. Better known as "We'll do everything in our power to make this submission as difficult as humanly possible... simply because we can". Bureaucratic Bull^%$t at it's finest

A little from column A and a little from column B...

Stops submissions like..

Hey, could I have the oenpelli cuz I thinkz their sick. I fullys knows how to take heaps good carez of them and the likes cuz I've had children pythons befores... Wadya reckons, it would be fully nice if we'z have them first before syds cuz likes wez can sellz them up there and make some maddaz cash.

 

[Snowman]

Why doesn't the DSE just contact the relevant authorities in other states to get these figures?

They are kept on record you know. That's why we do returns...

WA DEC cant give figures based on returns because it's all kept on paper records in fiiling cabinets. They admit that they have no idea how many of each species there are on record at any one time.... Apparently it's too expensive to log it into a data base or do electronic returns.

 

[abnrmal91]

WA DEC cant give figures based on returns because it's all kept on paper records in fiiling cabinets. They admit that they have no idea how many of each species there are on record at any one time.... Apparently it's too expensive to log it into a data base or do electronic returns.

Excel is pretty cheap, these agencies just don't care about anything unless it's making keeping harder

 

[Wally]

WA DEC cant give figures based on returns because it's all kept on paper records in fiiling cabinets. They admit that they have no idea how many of each species there are on record at any one time.... Apparently it's too expensive to log it into a data base or do electronic returns.

Where is all that dirt money going that we here in the east keep getting told about that you guys in the west are positively swimming in?

 

[whyme]

Ummmm, I really, really want a panoptes. PLEASE!!!!!!! P.s. I'm serious!!

 

[vadnappa]

as some have stated, dse will not do this research. i have already approached ALL of the other states departments and included their responses in my submissions, however there are discrepencies between what is on record and what is being held apparently. any one is welcome to contact dse themselves. the stage i am at is.. i put in 17 submissions to the advissory comitee (which is all done through the dse site, if you have a good look) out of those 17 i think about 8 of mine and a couple from other people have been accepted to be discussed. that had to be done by last july. the hearing for these is this march. i was emailed by the comitee to get some solid figures from breeders/keepers. then find someone in that state to approach there department and try and get a official report to submit. so yes basically trying to make it as hard as possible to get anything added. i started theses submissions 8 months ago so any help would be appreciated. if no one wishes to put their name down thats a shame, but understandable. and as for numbers they want more than 20 animals in other states before considering the species. and the most veiwed australian public reptile forum is probably one of the better ways to reach the most people?

 

[waruikazi]

then find someone in that state to approach there department and try and get a official report to submit.

What kind of official report, is this to verify numbers that they have already established there are discrepencies in? And why are they asking for a third party (as in not you, the one who is making the proposal) to do it?

Is this all a way for the DSE to make things as tricky as possible?

I doubt there are more than 20 of most of those species you listed in the NT but i'm happy to approach NTPWS on your behalf. They are usually pretty good to deal with.

 

[GeckoJosh]

Can you please post the species you can currently keep in Vic or a link to the list so we know what you guys are missing out on?

 

[dihsmaj]

Can you please post the species you can currently keep in Vic or a link to the list so we know what you guys are missing out on?

http://www.dse.vic.gov.au/__data/as...tion-for-a-Private-Wildlife-Licence-v11-1.pdf

 

[GeckoJosh]

I dont see P.platurus on there, I keep and breed that species

 

[longirostris]

Just looking at the dragons on your list I would say that it is most unlikely there would be too many people in Australia regularly breeding any of these species. The couple of people that do usually hold onto their youngsters to guarantee continuity of the species in their own collections because most of these species listed are so hard to get and are really only kept by serious enthusiasts. I would be very surprised if there was anything like 20 Canegrass dragons officially on the books in the whole of Australia. If I can be blunt none of these dragon species on your list are actually firmly established in the hobby.

If I was you I would be working to guarantee continuity of species you can already keep that are rapidly disappearing. Species such as Ctenophorus cristatus, pictus, fionni, vadnappa, decressii that many regard as established will soon be exceptionally difficult to acquire because the one person in Australia who consistently breeds these every year is moving out of the hobby and pretty much discontinuing his activities with breeding and raising reptiles.

What about trying to get C. isolepis and fordi going, now there's a challenge for you folks in Victoria and these species are already on you keepers list.

 

[KaotikJezta]

Just looking at the dragons on your list I would say that it is most unlikely there would be too many people in Australia regularly breeding any of these species. The couple of people that do usually hold onto their youngsters to guarantee continuity of the species in their own collections because most of these species listed are so hard to get and are really only kept by serious enthusiasts. I would be very surprised if there was anything like 20 Canegrass dragons officially on the books in the whole of Australia. If I can be blunt none of these dragon species on your list are actually firmly established in the hobby.

If I was you I would be working to guarantee continuity of species you can already keep that are rapidly disappearing. Species such as Ctenophorus cristatus, pictus, fionni, vadnappa, decressii that many regard as established will soon be exceptionally difficult to acquire because the one person in Australia who consistently breeds these every year is moving out of the hobby and pretty much discontinuing his activities with breeding and raising reptiles.

What about trying to get C. isolepis and fordi going, now there's a challenge for you folks in Victoria and these species are already on you keepers list.

You have a point, I for one, would love to get into keeping some of those dragons. Painted and crested especially.

 

[vadnappa]

What kind of official report, is this to verify numbers that they have already established there are discrepencies in? And why are they asking for a third party (as in not you, the one who is making the proposal) to do it?

Is this all a way for the DSE to make things as tricky as possible?

I doubt there are more than 20 of most of those species you listed in the NT but i'm happy to approach NTPWS on your behalf. They are usually pretty good to deal with.

yes i think it is just to make it as tricky as possible, my understanding is the advissory comitee was setup because of numerous complaints by lisence holders.
i beleive there only needs to be more then 20 in total not in every state, it would be very helpfull if you could approach NTPWS as i did not get anywhere with them when i tried. as i dont live there they couldnt disclose numbers to me.
ofcoarse i realise the majority of these wont go through, this is just the list i was emailed from the comitee to try and get more figures for.
and i have kept the majority of dragons and odatria on our current list, i would love to keep malee and central military's however i have not been able to find them as of yet, i had a chance to get 2 malee's once but by the time i had grabbed some cash they were gone.

 

[snakerelocation]

just read through the list of species in the different schedule lists..... what a joke. a common brown tree snake in the same schedule as an eastern brown.
yeah they would be on par to keep and handle....

 

[Ramsayi]

as some have stated, dse will not do this research. i have already approached ALL of the other states departments and included their responses in my submissions, however there are discrepencies between what is on record and what is being held apparently. any one is welcome to contact dse themselves. the stage i am at is.. i put in 17 submissions to the advissory comitee (which is all done through the dse site, if you have a good look) out of those 17 i think about 8 of mine and a couple from other people have been accepted to be discussed. that had to be done by last july. the hearing for these is this march. i was emailed by the comitee to get some solid figures from breeders/keepers. then find someone in that state to approach there department and try and get a official report to submit. so yes basically trying to make it as hard as possible to get anything added. i started theses submissions 8 months ago so any help would be appreciated. if no one wishes to put their name down thats a shame, but understandable. and as for numbers they want more than 20 animals in other states before considering the species. and the most veiwed australian public reptile forum is probably one of the better ways to reach the most people?

You would have to get the numbers from the relevant department in each state as I doubt they would go by any anonymous info you collected via a website.Even if the departments numbers of what is being kept is incorrect they are the official numbers and the ones they could not dispute.In NSW they used to make numbers of what was being kept public but stopped that quite a few years ago.I guess the best way would be to access each states info via FOI if they wont give out that info anymore.