New Caledonian Crested Gecko

[Ned_fisch]

Anything non venomous you shouldnt need licence but i agree with licence for venomous whether they are considered deadly or not

Agreed, A course for venomous keeping will always be essential.

 

[Wrightpython]

Agreed, A course for venomous keeping will always be essential.

a course ???
people need to get hands on experience from less aggresive and dangerous animals
Im not bagging you but where not talking puppies
Some venomous elapids like rbbs for instance are easy to keep relativly calm and can teach a lot to someone wanting more venomous species unless they are going to do a course for each species it would be a waste of time. Looking after and handling deathys is a lot different to coastal tais which are a lot different to inland tais which in my opinion are the easiest and most forgiving of our top ten elapids.

 

[Ned_fisch]

a course ???
people need to get hands on experience from less aggresive and dangerous animals
Im not bagging you but where not talking puppies
Some venomous elapids like rbbs for instance are easy to keep relativly calm and can teach a lot to someone wanting more venomous species unless they are going to do a course for each species it would be a waste of time. Looking after and handling deathys is a lot different to coastal tais which are a lot different to inland tais which in my opinion are the easiest and most forgiving of our top ten elapids.

A hands on practical course and demonstration on how to handle mild ven's and extreme ven's, with at least 4 points of reference's and multiple courses with registered and licensed demonstrators.

Some species may be different, and I believe a course is needed for each species, as browns are a lot different to RBB's, and adders are different again.

 

[jedi_339]

I will admit PhilK that I thought vets in general didn't have any form of confidentiality agreement towards their 'clients' as such (like a doctor would with a patient)

I have heard of a vets obligation to euthanase and report any exotics that come through their doors as a requirement from Derm or DEC etc?

feel free to correct me if I'm wrong but I did think that was the case


Other then that my opinion doesn't help with the OPs original question, but good luck nonetheless

 

[PhilK]

they do if you pay squellions to them.
Can any vet out there tell me that if i had say a green mamba and it was injured that you would administer aid

Hahaha a vet being paid squillions. Classic. Our award rate for the first few years out is $25 an hour.... after 5 years of study. Just so you know. Maccas employees can make more than that.

And yes I would administer aid if I had the necessary skills to handle venomous snakes.

Quite a few people offering legitmate help and suggestions. Who knew we had so many experienced keepers of Rhacodactylus ciliatus right chere on the forum? Colour me impressed.

Not hard to Google care requirements...

Then I take my hat off to Philk.
If however he rightly knows the implications that an exotic may harbour to our wildlife and turns a blind eye to one reptiles wellbeing to our possible countless native reptiles wellbeing then..............
The Need of the many outweighs the need of a few.

Which disease is that, mate? Everyone always spouts "they have diseases" - which diseases? Proof? The exotic trade in Australia is likely at the point where animals are being captive bred in which case they wouldn't have any diseases that native breeders don't already have in their set ups.
Which is another point - if your captive native reptiles were to escape they would also pose a huge disease threat to wild natives. Many animals in captivity will have had exposure to diseases that wild animals haven't making ANY escapee dangerous. Aquarium fish are a prime example.

I will admit PhilK that I thought vets in general didn't have any form of confidentiality agreement towards their 'clients' as such (like a doctor would with a patient)

I have heard of a vets obligation to euthanase and report any exotics that come through their doors as a requirement from Derm or DEC etc?

feel free to correct me if I'm wrong but I did think that was the case


Other then that my opinion doesn't help with the OPs original question, but good luck nonetheless

Yes vets do have a confidentiality agreement with their clients.
I have seen many vets euthanise wild ferals (to prevent a feral being released back into the wild). But if the animal is under someones care and will be going back to that persons house vets are more inclined to treat them. This alleviates their suffering and ensures the owner will bring an animal back if it is unwell - as opposed to developing a distrust for the vet and leaving their sick animals at home, seeking advice on forums etc.

That is my experience anyway.

 

[Tobe404]

Can any vet out there tell me that if i had say a green mamba and it was injured that you would administer aid

I am by no means an expert at all but i would like to think I would try and help any animal that is in bad shape. Better than doing nothing.
I have saved a few Barking Geckos. Hatched a few Marbled Geckos (eggs would of drowned where they were and one had already fallen from the clutch).
Recently I also successfully helped a Jacky Dragon through a shed that it was struggling with.
Not quite the same as snakes but you get my point hopefully.

 

[Tsubakai]

Philk is spot on. The vets obligation lies with ensuring that animal welfare is paramount. As an example, rabbits are illegal in Qld so by the logic of the exotic haters they should be put down if found in Qld. However many families (eg military) get transferred here for a period of time. Should they have to give away or euthanise their children's beloved pet? Its not all black and white therefore vets tend to treat the animals for whatever they need and let the owners deal with the legality of it all. Otherwise, as previously pointed out, if owners are too scared to seek treatment then the animals will needlessly suffer with something that could be alleviated by a medical professional.

 

[Vincey]

*facepalm Wrightpython*
That has been needed so many times through out this thread.

 

[mad_at_arms]

Mods:- I think it is fair to say the thread has gone off topic. (unsurprisingly to the same old debate *yawn*)
/thread???

 

[Retic]

The arrogance and obvious ignorance exhibited by some in the thread is incredible, is it any wonder most experienced keepers just don't bother posting anymore.

 

[PhilK]

Philk is spot on. The vets obligation lies with ensuring that animal welfare is paramount. As an example, rabbits are illegal in Qld so by the logic of the exotic haters they should be put down if found in Qld. However many families (eg military) get transferred here for a period of time. Should they have to give away or euthanise their children's beloved pet? Its not all black and white therefore vets tend to treat the animals for whatever they need and let the owners deal with the legality of it all. Otherwise, as previously pointed out, if owners are too scared to seek treatment then the animals will needlessly suffer with something that could be alleviated by a medical professional.

Hahaha that is true re: rabbits. As an interesting side note probably 10 out of the 15 rabbits I have seen in practices in QLD have belonged to police officers.

 

[sagara_cp_2006]

Thank you for all your replies. I was unaware until I did some more digging around that this gecko was illegal. Had I known it was illegal I would no have posted it on a public forum. The comments have been passed on to the relevant people and it has made more aware of what I post for friends in the future.

 

[Justdragons]

For a forum of people who love animals its amazing how fast some people are willing to kill an animal due to it being exotic.

 

[sagara_cp_2006]

I don't agree with people keeping animals illegally, I own 2 snakes myself; however have never had to find out what was illegal and what animals were legal other than in regards to snakes. I am not sure how the gecko got in this condition but if you are going to own any animal you should be prepared to do the research and look after it properly.

 

[PMyers]

For a forum of people who love animals its amazing how fast some people are willing to kill an animal due to it being exotic.

We love all creatures great and small... unless the bandwagon says otherwise.

 

[Wrightpython]

*facepalm Wrightpython*
That has been needed so many times through out this thread.

what does this mean in the words of pauline Please Explain

Hahaha a vet being paid squillions. Classic. Our award rate for the first few years out is $25 an hour.... after 5 years of study. Just so you know. Maccas employees can make more than that.

And yes I would administer aid if I had the necessary skills to handle venomous snakes.


Not hard to Google care requirements...


Which disease is that, mate? Everyone always spouts "they have diseases" - which diseases? Proof? The exotic trade in Australia is likely at the point where animals are being captive bred in which case they wouldn't have any diseases that native breeders don't already have in their set ups.
Which is another point - if your captive native reptiles were to escape they would also pose a huge disease threat to wild natives. Many animals in captivity will have had exposure to diseases that wild animals haven't making ANY escapee dangerous. Aquarium fish are a prime example.


Yes vets do have a confidentiality agreement with their clients.
I have seen many vets euthanise wild ferals (to prevent a feral being released back into the wild). But if the animal is under someones care and will be going back to that persons house vets are more inclined to treat them. This alleviates their suffering and ensures the owner will bring an animal back if it is unwell - as opposed to developing a distrust for the vet and leaving their sick animals at home, seeking advice on forums etc.

That is my experience anyway.

i know you dont get paid squillions and i also know that first year vets get bugger all considering the amount of study etc but gees there bosses shore no how to charge when it comes to polo ponies

 

[PythonLegs]

5 years study to even begin being a vet? Surprising that so many seem to have taken all their husbandry knowledge from 'Spots Big Book Of Animals'..

 

[jedi_339]

Yes vets do have a confidentiality agreement with their clients.
I have seen many vets euthanise wild ferals (to prevent a feral being released back into the wild). But if the animal is under someones care and will be going back to that persons house vets are more inclined to treat them. This alleviates their suffering and ensures the owner will bring an animal back if it is unwell - as opposed to developing a distrust for the vet and leaving their sick animals at home, seeking advice on forums etc.

That is my experience anyway.

cheers for clearing that up, I believe that the wildlife vets at CWS wildlife hospital told me about the lack of confidentiality, so they were probably referring to ferals bought in to be rehabed for release as opposed to exotics owned by a customer.

 

[Jeffa]

Hahaha a vet being paid squillions. Classic. Our award rate for the first few years out is $25 an hour.... after 5 years of study. Just so you know. Maccas employees can make more than that.

And yes I would administer aid if I had the necessary skills to handle venomous snakes.


Not hard to Google care requirements...


Which disease is that, mate? Everyone always spouts "they have diseases" - which diseases? Proof? The exotic trade in Australia is likely at the point where animals are being captive bred in which case they wouldn't have any diseases that native breeders don't already have in their set ups.
Which is another point - if your captive native reptiles were to escape they would also pose a huge disease threat to wild natives. Many animals in captivity will have had exposure to diseases that wild animals haven't making ANY escapee dangerous. Aquarium fish are a prime example.


Yes vets do have a confidentiality agreement with their clients.
I have seen many vets euthanise wild ferals (to prevent a feral being released back into the wild). But if the animal is under someones care and will be going back to that persons house vets are more inclined to treat them. This alleviates their suffering and ensures the owner will bring an animal back if it is unwell - as opposed to developing a distrust for the vet and leaving their sick animals at home, seeking advice on forums etc.

That is my experience anyway.

I Cannot recal mentioning diseases but here goes without a google search:
Chitrid fungus for frogs (frogs, not reptiles I know).

It was mainly for the fact that possible escapes breed, breed and more breed and end up like our beloved AHG that I am currently looking at now.

I do not disrespect your job as vets, and apprecite the passion you guys have.

One more question, If I brought a cane toad into your clinic and (just say you were based in Sydney) and wanted a health check on the critter because I had strong intentions of breeding, what are your thoughts regarding confidentuality? If you saw me as a total yobbo and did not feel that I understood the situation or did not care, would confidentuality stand?

Honest question.

 

[killimike]

I agree with vets treating animals in these circumstances, as per PhilK's rationale. I also don't have much first hand knowledge of confidentiality requirements, but I have talked to a few vet nurses who have said that they do report exotics. I dunno if they do really, or how representative they are.

I imagine there is not total uniformity across the vet profession, like in any job, but is there a code of ethics, or a specific law that vets are breaking if they do report clients with an illegal animal of some kind? I cannot imagine that they are actually open to being sued. I know as an interpreter that my legal obligations are extremely murky...