Snake behaviour towards man!

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geckoman1985

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Interesting subject ay

i was trying to imagine what a python is thinking when we handle them or interact with them I know that snake can have meny personalities but can they be changed and if so this would raise the question are they smarter then we think

see what I getting at is when you get baby reptiles they can be scared of us interacting with us but as thay get older and and use to us interacting with them some do calm down is this due to them realising that we mean no harm to them and thas them not use ing the fight or flight response towards us

becouse to me this would be a learned thing I know some kittens my also do this but soon become to love there owners could this be the same with snakes.

interesting to note that my bredli dose not mind being handled at all and is only to happy to sit coiled up on my lap for hours at a time and or tho some may say this is not handling it still is interacting and is some thing a wild snake would never do

i know that dog and cats and other farm animals would have been like this to before domestication so my question is this will we see a point in time were captive snake get domesticated. If not. Is there some limiting factor that will not allow this to happen.

another thing to think about what if any thing dose a snake that is happy to just sit or be handled think of us could thay enjoy the time with us after all there very inquisitive

are thay more intelligent then we make them out to be. And is there some sort of bond between a snake and its owner from the snakes prospective.
 
I think all animals with a brain can learn to some extent, goldfish come to the surface for food but I do not think snakes have the mental capacity to ever be domesticated. I also think it is funny how many people put on threads on here that their snake is happy with this and happy with that. Not sure how they can tell that their snake is happy without facial expressions or other telling signs.
 
I agree with the sentiment regarding how does one tell if a reptile is "happy" or not. I have only had my hatchy for a few weeks, and yet to feed, but he is not exhibiting any signs of stress (striking out, hiding, running away at feed attempts). In fact, it is very difficult to stop him from getting out of his click clack to explore and engage, when he should be concentrating on eating!

I take that fact that he is moving around his click clack, sleeping part in and part out of his toilet roll (instead of under the paper closer to the heat mat or down the cool end) and not exhibiting any extreme behaviour to mean he is content in his environment, warm enough, secure, etc.

Just need to get him eating, and when he does, based on the few interactions I have inadvertently had with him already, I feel that he will be quite amenable to handling, moving around, and exploring. I would call that "happy". To paraphrase "Hitchhikers":

Zarniwoop: How do you know he knows you to be kind, or enjoys what you think of as your kindness?
Ruler of the Universe: I don't. I have no idea. It merely pleases me to behave in a certain way to what appears to be a [insert unexpressive animal here].

In short, we have no idea if a snake is happy, but we project our thoughts and feelings onto it, and if it is pleasing to us, we think of it as kindness, and expect the recipient would be happy with our kindness.

I know, a bit heavy for a Wednesday.....;)
 
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Interesting to see the the thoughts of others on this I for one know mine must have some sort of bond between him and me i know it's not one of hate and probley not one of love so some were in between all tho he dose seem to enjoy moving about the yard and being out with me he seem strange tho he will rub agents the glass when I walk past sometimes. And sometimes if I open the sliding door to his enclosure he will just sit there with his head out that it keep I mind I feed him on the lawn and not in his enclosur.
 
Just from observing my own, and friend's snakes, I believe snakes are certainly not stupid and they have a pretty good memory - they learn routines quite fast, for example they know how their enclosure doors slide open and I have seen them try to copy this action. If they ever get a chance to get out, I know of snakes who will keep trying at that exact place for years to come, to see if it is vulnerable again. They know the routine for being taken outside to the toilet and will defecate as soon as they reach their designated area. They recognise me by smell and know not to be frightened of me; I represent food and exercise. When I bring them out for "cuddles" (my word, not theirs lol) they are happy to curl up in my lap, or around my shoulders or where-ever while I am on the computer - sometimes for hours at a time. I do believe there is a bond of sorts, even if it just one of recognition and basic respect.. and I certainly know I love my snakes dearly.
 
I think it's stretching the imagination to suggest that your snakes "respect" you. Snakes are basically lazy and into self-preservation, some see defensive behaviour as the best means of self-preservation, some see a peaceful attitude as the best means to achieve this end. I doubt it has anything to do with respect for their keeper. They are capable of developing habituated behaviour, in that they get used to frequently repeated stimuli, such as in zoos, where normally shy species will quickly learn that the idiots looking at them through glass cannot harm them, so lose the urge to retreat whenever their privacy is invaded.

They are into economising their energy, so why make a fuss, get stressed and use energy when it's not needed. They wouldn't reason it out like this either by the way, it just happens for them - they don't lie there thinking... "OK, for the last few days nothing has hurt me so I'm going to lie on that rock all day despite everyone being able to see me."

Jamie
 
Very interesting topic guys, i have 4 snakes and believe they can have a bond with humans, but not love affection like a dog or a cat.
They know we feed them and look after them , exercise them , handle them . they see us all the time and reconise us by our individual scent we have .
My babies come straight over to the glass as soon as they see me and go back and forth till i let them out and hold them, when friends come over and family they seem to go and hide in there hide rock or hide box and wont show themselves of, but after they leave they will come back out again knowing iam there by myself.

So there are signs of them knowing who you are, your no threat to them and they know you do feed and care for them , so there is a kind of understanding/ bond with them, but i guess we will never know the tuth , just one of those mysteries that probably we will never know:)
 
One way to see if your snake is "happy" with the enclosure and owner is leave the enclosure door open and see if it runs away. I think you will find that your snake may only be tolerating you and quickly escapes your protective environment.
 
I'm not sure on what snakes think about us regarding love, bonds etc but they defnitely have owner's recognition. They know who feeds them and cares for them, whether or not they have any emotional attachment to us or not there's no way of knowing. I personally think if someone else started caring for them and feeding them they wouldn't even blink so long as their needs were being met.

But I do think they do have their own little personalities. My Woma is forever trying to get out of his tank to explore, digging in his substrate and mimicking our movements when we are standing there watching him.

My Jungle however is very anti social, she will now tolerate being handled with relatively little protest but would much rather be left alone.

My coastal is content to have "cuddles" and when I get him out, unlike my woma, he would much rather chill on my neck/lap rather then explore.

So I don't think they care who is looking after them but I do think that they a) know their carer from others and b) have different personalities.
 
I'm not sure on what snakes think about us regarding love, bonds etc but they defnitely have owner's recognition. They know who feeds them and cares for them, whether or not they have any emotional attachment to us or not there's no way of knowing. I personally think if someone else started caring for them and feeding them they wouldn't even blink so long as their needs were being met.

But I do think they do have their own little personalities. My Woma is forever trying to get out of his tank to explore, digging in his substrate and mimicking our movements when we are standing there watching him.

My Jungle however is very anti social, she will now tolerate being handled with relatively little protest but would much rather be left alone.

My coastal is content to have "cuddles" and when I get him out, unlike my woma, he would much rather chill on my neck/lap rather then explore.

So I don't think they care who is looking after them but I do think that they a) know their carer from others and b) have different personalities.
I think the biggest mistake people make is to attach human emotions to an animal that I don't think can possibly have emotions.
 
I think the biggest mistake people make is to attach human emotions to an animal that I don't think can possibly have emotions.

I could not agree more!

As stated by others, young snakes are instinctivly programed with the fight or flight/ aggressive attitude. This trait can vary between individual snakes of separate or even the same species.
With frequent handling, snakes are smart enough to learn that there is nothing that will hurt them and will begin to TOLERATE handling by their owner.
Snakes are not a social species and do not crave for affection nor do they give affection thus can never be domesticated.
Snakes at best will be comfortable and tolerate handling by their owner and then use their owner for a heat source, a means to be fed (if their is a routine to the feeding snakes can learn this routine, ie being fed from the same rock every time and even being transferred to a feed tank) etc.

Whilst snakes have the capacity to learn, they do not have the emotions of Mammals and humans and cannot "love" or even want to be interacting with another individual weather it be human or another snake unless it was for a means to achieve one of their instinctive goals (Eating, breeding, heat, water and survival)
 
I think the biggest mistake people make is to attach human emotions to an animal that I don't think can possibly have emotions.

it is easy to say they cannot have emotions because of the type of brain they have
but we really know so little about them?
maybe we cannot measure reptile emotions because we use mammalian tests to try??

while it is quite clear they do not have deep emotions, there is enough anecdotal evidence to show they
probably have something going on that is more involved that basic instincts?

there was a very entertaining thread on this
reptile emotions debate
no winners or losers
but interesting reading
 
well, hate is a human emotion and im pretty sure one of my bredli hates me!!! :p
either that, or i taste better than rats,.....
 
it is easy to say they cannot have emotions because of the type of brain they have
but we really know so little about them?
maybe we cannot measure reptile emotions because we use mammalian tests to try??

while it is quite clear they do not have deep emotions, there is enough anecdotal evidence to show they
probably have something going on that is more involved that basic instincts?

there was a very entertaining thread on this
reptile emotions debate
no winners or losers
but interesting reading
The statement was human emotions and you may be quite right that they may have something going on but that is something that we can only guess at until there is actual proof. I very often see a statement saying that a snake loves his new enclosure when realistically the snake is smelling new smells and is exploring. If people changed the furnishings once a week they would have a very active snake I would imagine.
 
Hmmm, interesting subject, i do not believe reps can have emotions "BUT" i do however believe they have the capacity to learn even if it is only at a basic level, here is an example, on our girls old enclosure (1200 x 400 x 600 tank) it had a hinged lift up door at each end, if we lifted the door on the end closest to her hide she was instantly out of her hide and up over the top of the tank for cuddles, but if we lifted the door on the furthest end to the hide she would slowly come out of her hide and wait for the inevitable rat that was to follow, now she is in a new enclosure with sliding glass doors on the front but she still knows that if the door in front of the hide opens it is come on out for cuddles time but if the other door opens she patiently waits for the rat she knows will come next. Bart70 comes to my place with his wonderful kids and for some reason our girl gravitates to his son on every visit and just settles on him somewhere, whereas when his daughter handles her she does not usually stay still for long, some could say it is an instinctive behaviour or is it a learned reaction. i think everyone could add to this with anecdotal evidence of learned behaviour from their reps...Emotions ?? no i don't think so, capacity to learn ?? well i think a whole book could be written on the subject, but in my opinion "YES"..........................................Ron
 
The statement was human emotions and you may be quite right that they may have something going on but that is something that we can only guess at until there is actual proof. I very often see a statement saying that a snake loves his new enclosure when realistically the snake is smelling new smells and is exploring. If people changed the furnishings once a week they would have a very active snake I would imagine.

I agree with your point but I think when people state that their snake "loves" his new enclosure or "loves" going outside exploring I don't think they neccessarily mean that in the context we're discussing here. I think the 90% of these statements mean "well he looks happy enough so I must've done something right" not love as in the way we as humans love chocolate or wine lol
 
I agree with your point but I think when people state that their snake "loves" his new enclosure or "loves" going outside exploring I don't think they neccessarily mean that in the context we're discussing here. I think the 90% of these statements mean "well he looks happy enough so I must've done something right" not love as in the way we as humans love chocolate or wine lol
What makes him look happy?
 
What makes him look happy?

Things mentioned above, exploring, checking things out as opposed to finding a small hid at the cool end and crawling in there for a week. Not an exact science but you can generally gauge if your snake is stressed or not
 
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