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MissScarlett

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Hi All!

i have just brought home a 11 mth old Proserpine. He looks healthy and is active. Bright eyes etc. I'm just a but concerned that he is a but underweight? He is 47 gms. I had a look at his last feed which was nearly 3 weeks ago on a fuzzy rat. He shed after his last feed. Is he under weight and what should I do about it if he is?
 
Not dangerously underweight but probably on the smaller side. This was possibly just given a base amount of food by the breeder to keep it and several others alive until they could be sold. May have also been a fussy eater originally. Just give it decent size rats that leave a bulge. Feed one or two every 5 days until it stacks on a bit of beef.
 
It is hard to tell if a snake is underweight from just a weight and age. You really need at least a weight and length or even better a picture. Has it got baggy skin, what is it's muscle tone like? It is probably actually more closer to the size it would be in the wild by the sounds of things but hard to tell from the information given.
 
Wow 47gms is a bit lite on for an 11 month Prossy, my smallest Spotty is 160gms and the other 1 is 190gms and they are only 12 months old, they get fed 15 - 20% of body weight every week and i don't consider them overweight, try power feeding it for a couple of months and see if it gets a bit more weight on, if it doesn't you might think about taking it or it's scat to the vet and get it checked for intestinal parasites. But as previously stated a few pics would also help. :) ........................Ron
 
Thanks Ron, I'll feed him up.

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As I only got him yesterday, is it too soon to try him with a feed or do I leave him alone for a bit longer ?

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Bump
 
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Personaly i would try to feed him now, then let him settle in, if he eats it gr8 if not you have only wasted 1 food item, i fed both of mine as soon as i got them home then left them alone for the next 4-5 days and since then they have been wonderful with their behaviour and feeding, the only time they will refuse a food item is on the day they shed, they will eat the day before and the day after but not on the day. It is your snake so in the end the decisions you make will hopefully be your own, that is why we have such a complex brain, it helps us make those big decisions lol, hope it bungs on heaps of weight over the coming months and is all you hoped for. :) ............................Ron
 
As I only got him yesterday, is it too soon to try him with a feed or do I leave him alone for a bit longer ?

I always offer food the next day (full 24hrs+) after putting new additions into their enclosures, as long as they have the correct amount of heat they should take it, if it fails to take it offer again every 2-3 days until it does.

Did it feed yet?
 
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Well I just tried him on a fuzzy mouse because his usual fuzzy rat that was available was far too big. I was told this is what he was taking three weeks ago. He struck and constructed it but then let go and just sat on it. I've left him alone now. If it's nit gone by morning I'll try again in a couple of days . Is it a problem swapping from ears to mice and then soon back to rats once a good suez is available ? I do have some small pinky rats.

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Ahh all good ! Scoffed it up in his time and is now hiding ! Thanks everyone
 
Ahh all good ! Scoffed it up in his time and is now hiding ! Thanks everyone

It should be hiding on it's heat spot to digest the meal, if the hot spot is around 32-33c give it 3 days and offer another, continue this for a month then go to 1 feed a week:)
 
Thanks Yellowbeard. Yes, he is in his hide on the hot end which on the floor is about 33 degrees. I'll definitely feed him again soon as I was just thinking I should have given him two fuzzy mice. He swallowed it quickly once he got onto it
 
Growth in snakes, allelsebeing equal, is very much dependant on how much and how often they are fed. If you happen to acquire a snake that is clearly small for its age, trying to play ‘catch up’ by power feeding it may likely shorten its overall life expectancy. Others will disagree with this statement but the anecdotal evidence I have heard convinces me otherwise.

In terms of the health of the snake, what is important is its body condition. With a in good body condition the vertebral column is clearly evident and there is a slight furrow either side. In an overweight snake, the furrows and the vertebral column are not clearly evident and in cross-section the snake is rounded like a hose. In an underweight snake the vertebral column juts out, the furrows disappear and in cross-section the snake is triangular like. The skin is loose and the abdomen has a hollow feel to it.

A normal feeding regime is all that is required to bring an underweight snake into good body condition. There is no necessity to play catch up. As Ron pointed out, a feed of 15% to 20%, or even 25% of the snake’s body weight, once a week is all that is needed.

Blue

EDIT: The efffects of power feeding have not been determined by scientific investigation and therefore are only likely at best and not definite.
 
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Growth in snakes, allelsebeing equal, is very much dependant on how much and how often they are fed. If you happen to acquire a snake that is clearly small for its age, trying to play ‘catch up’ by power feeding it will only shorten its life expectancy. Others will disagree with this statement but the anecdotal evidence I have heard convinces me otherwise.

In terms of the health of the snake, what is important is its body condition. With a in good body condition the vertebral column is clearly evident and there is a slight furrow either side. In an overweight snake, the furrows and the vertebral column are not clearly evident and in cross-section the snake is rounded like a hose. In an underweight snake the vertebral column juts out, the furrows disappear and in cross-section the snake is triangular like. The skin is loose and the abdomen has a hollow feel to it.

A normal feeding regime is all that is required to bring an underweight snake into good body condition. There is no necessity to play catch up. As Ron pointed out, a feed of 15% to 20% of the snake’s body weight once a week is all that is needed.

Blue

I'm not sure there's any properly structured study that suggests frequent feeding ("power feeding" if you will) shortens life expectancy. I used to believe that too, but many years of observations of actual animals in collections, some of them now 20+ years old and still in good health, has caused me to rethink this.

I'm sure if you feed it more frequently for the next 12 months to enable it to catch up will do it no harm whatsoever, and as most big breeders will tell you, it's wise to get some size on the bubs asap because if ever "illness" such as RI or whatever does strike, management is easier and therapies more easily administered on a larger bodied snake.

Jamie
 
Jamie,
You are quite correct about the lack of a properly structured study over the life of the animals, which is why I used the term anecdotal. Slateman is the one to talk to about the effects of “power feeding”. I am very interested to hear of examples to the contrary. Getting information where keepers have tried both has proven nigh on impossible.

Part of the problem is that the term that the term “power feeding” is ill-defined. Some consider it feeding to refusal. Others consider it feeding as much as a snake would take on its own and then adding another prey item while the mouth is still ajar. There is also the question of increasing the frequency of feeds, which muddies the water even more. But to put a figure on it, I would consider power feeding a to be giving a snake close to half of its bodyweight in food each week (on average), in contrast to a well fed snake being given around a quarter of its body weight in the same period. I emphasise that this is just my opinion.

You did highlight one error for me thanks Jamie... “power feeding it will only shorten its life expectancy” should read “may likely shorten its overall life expectancy.

Blue

I should add that Simon Stone, who ran Southern Cross Reptiles and has raised many hundreds of pythons, recommends as little as 5% of body weight every 5 to 7 days for young pythons.
 
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