Best UVB for Blue Tongue?

[rainmonitors]

Hey guys. A while ago I found my Western Blue Tongue a foster home after the person I am living with forced me to rehome him. Next week I get my keys to my new apartment, and soon after I'll be ready to have him home again!
He's now going to have his permanent 4x2x2 ft vivarium, from his 3 ft viv. A few things will be changed, and the UVB will be one. His previous viv came with a UVB setup, as it was second hand, but the bulb was new so it wasn't an issue to replace yet.
The controller is an Arcadia T5: http://www.arcadia-aust.com.au/24-39w-ip67-plug-socket-controller-aquatic-wholesale-only
The previous bulb was: https://zoomed.com/t5-ho-reptisun-10-0-uvb/ (39w)
So my question is, what UVB is best recommended for a Western Blue Tongue? No, I will not not provide UVB to him. "Why risk it?" as Clint's Reptiles would say. Plus, I already have the UVB controller.
Should I stick with the same bulb, or should I use a less powerful (eg. not high output) T5 UVB tube? Should the UVB tube be the whole length of the viv, or only 1/2 or 2/3, etc.
Also, slightly unrelated, but what is the difference between T5 and T8 UVB tubes? I can't wrap my head around it!

 

[lifesagame]

I’m not sure on the level of uvb recommended there, I live in the uk so less natural exposure and ideas on this seem to differ depending on the country sometimes, but I was recommended the 12% Arcadia with a reflector. As far as length goes I was told 2/3 - 3/4 of the vivarium and having the gap on the cool end so the BTS can decide to get out of the uv light as well as the heat going into the shade or hides at the cool end.

I can’t remember the science behind the t5 and t8 differences but as far as I can remember the t5 has a better balance across the light colour spectrum, longer life and higher output so can be a bit further away from the animal to still get the benefit. It is more expensive to set up, and I think run too, but my t8 I used to change every 6 months and was told the t5s are recommended changing every 12 so they last longer. I did see a difference in the light colour compared to the t8s I was using, it looks more natural to me and less of a blue tint but that might just be me seeing things!

 

[Sdaji]

If you gave me a million dollars to set up an indoor Blue-tongued Lizard enclosure, I wouldn't include UV. I've kept and bred them with and without it, no difference. I've bred multiple consecutive generations of skinks of multiple species without UV of any kind, I never had problems and UV never made a difference.

Make sure you include calcium and multivitamin supplements in the diet (whether or not you provide UV). With or without UV, a lack of supplements usually will cause issues including MBD.

 

[Bushfire]

Go for an arcadia t5 tube. The strength (either 6, 12 or 14) will depend on the distance between the light and basking spot. There are iso irradiance charts for each one to guide you which one is best suited. I would use a reflector as was mentioned - you will get a better performance from the tube.

 

[nuttylizardguy]

I concur :
The use of a good parabolic shaped reflector will double the UVA & UVB under the tube where you want it.
There are slip on reflectors for t8 and t5 tubes available online for those tubes used in domestic luminaires and in control kits that don't have a hood.

The natural range

I'd go for a 10%UVB t5 or 12%UVB t5 in a reflector hood for a western BTS , provide it with a linear UV gradient from high (at the basking spot to very low or zero in the cool zone) or a couple of hides so it can choose the level of UV it's getting to suit it's needs at different times of the day. So UV tube about 2/3 the length of the viv will work .
If the UV source is too strong it will simply seek out shade when it's soaked up enough UV.

Based on the natural range , aiming for no less than 150 microW UVB & 700 milliW UVA per sq.cm at the basking spot will be appropriate , similar to an NSW or VIC Eastern BTS.

 

[Flaviemys purvisi]

A good mercury vapour lamp, either the Exo-Terra Solar Glo or the Mega Ray.

 

[rainmonitors]

I’m not sure on the level of uvb recommended there, I live in the uk so less natural exposure and ideas on this seem to differ depending on the country sometimes, but I was recommended the 12% Arcadia with a reflector. As far as length goes I was told 2/3 - 3/4 of the vivarium and having the gap on the cool end so the BTS can decide to get out of the uv light as well as the heat going into the shade or hides at the cool end.

Go for an arcadia t5 tube. The strength (either 6, 12 or 14) will depend on the distance between the light and basking spot. There are iso irradiance charts for each one to guide you which one is best suited. I would use a reflector as was mentioned - you will get a better performance from the tube.

I concur :
I'd go for a 10%UVB t5 or 12%UVB t5 in a reflector hood for a western BTS , provide it with a linear UV gradient from high (at the basking spot to very low or zero in the cool zone) or a couple of hides so it can choose the level of UV it's getting to suit it's needs at different times of the day. So UV tube about 2/3 the length of the viv will work .
If the UV source is too strong it will simply seek out shade when it's soaked up enough UV.
Based on the natural range , aiming for no less than 150 microW UVB & 700 milliW UVA per sq.cm at the basking spot will be appropriate , similar to an NSW or VIC Eastern BTS.

So will this tube be sufficient for a 120cm long, 60cm high enclosure? https://www.amazingamazon.com.au/arcadia-t5-globes.html (85cm long)
Like said, I already have the T5 controller which works perfectly fine (and was $120), so I will not buy a reflector straight away. But after settling in the apartment and less worried about running out of money, I will consider changing to a hood!
[doublepost=1556345406,1556345158][/doublepost]

A good mercury vapour lamp, either the Exo-Terra Solar Glo or the Mega Ray.

Checked out the Solar Glo on Amazingamazon. It's not recommended for Blue Tongues? All watts say this: https://www.amazingamazon.com.au/exo-terra-solar-glo-125-watt-mercury-vapour.html

 

[Bushfire]

The controller you have is for t5 HO tubes so won't work for normal t5 or t8 tubes. What is the distance between the tube to the basking spot? For your blue tongue, based on their habits, it is estimated that at the basking spot you would provide a UVI of about 3.0. So using the charts below match the tube with your distance at the basking site with the requirement of around 3.0 UVI.

 

[lifesagame]

That’s the size UV tube I’m using. If you have the starter and the UV tube itself I don’t think you’d need to get a hood. The one I have simply clips onto it, it’s this one that came included in the set I bought when I was changing from the t8s. https://www.reptiles.swelluk.com/ar...Sc-bfeH1u4wm2SnGiAbQv4H99MzpPIoxoCEpoQAvD_BwE (sorry for the uk link but it still shows the reflector)

 

[rainmonitors]

The controller you have is for t5 HO tubes so won't work for normal t5 or t8 tubes. What is the distance between the tube to the basking spot? For your blue tongue, based on their habits, it is estimated that at the basking spot you would provide a UVI of about 3.0. So using the charts below match the tube with your distance at the basking site with the requirement of around 3.0 UVI.

That is so helpful! Where'd you find the chart, and how did you figure out that the Blue Tongue needs a UVI of 3?
It seems like I'd have to buy a reflector for the 14% tube to reach 3.2 for 60cm, or raise the basking rock/platform/etc closer to the top of the enclosure, maybe a 12% at 30cm.
...
Spent a while researching before finishing this comment. Found these awesome PDFs/articles that explained the UVB, er, 'stuff' really well.
https://www.jzar.org/jzar/article/view/150/89
https://www.solarmeter.com/pdfs/6.5R_UV-Index-Interactive.pdf
The JZAR PDF had three species of Blue Tongues on its info table, and comparing the natural distribution of the Western to the other three via IUCN, its closest comparison would the the Shingleback. The Shingleback's Ferguson Zone info has it as 2-3, which would be a maximum UVI basking spot of 1.1-7.4 (the authors recommended NOT going over 7-8 for even creatures of zone 4). The second PDF says between 1.1-3 maximum for a basking spot. The JZAR PDF has a lot of other useful information, like what bulbs would work best for what zone of reptile you have. Just thought of sharing this!

So in the end, I think I've got a pretty good idea with what I'm working with! I won't be using a reflector as that takes another $100+ from the moving funds, but maybe soon in the future. I'll be using the 12% T5, and the basking spot will raise max to about 30cm away from the tube, so that'll be awesome! Thanks for the comment, helped me figure out what to search for.

 

[nuttylizardguy]

The controller you have is for t5 HO tubes so won't work for normal t5 or t8 tubes. What is the distance between the tube to the basking spot? For your blue tongue, based on their habits, it is estimated that at the basking spot you would provide a UVI of about 3.0. So using the charts below match the tube with your distance at the basking site with the requirement of around 3.0 UVI.
View attachment 326971 View attachment 326972 View attachment 326973

That's good data to have on hand regarding UVB flux with distance.
Created some graphs that make the different tubes easier to compare.

 

[Bushfire]

It is and it's independent data, not supplied by the manufacturer. Just people with the gear testing various bulbs.