Feeding in a seperate tub - when to move back?

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-Adam-

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Hi,

Everything I've read says that you shouldn't handle your snake after it has opened for a minimum of 24hrs (many say a lot longer than that).

In this instance- for those who do choose to feed in a separate enclosure - what do you do? Does your separate enclosure have independent heating so you can wait until returning the snake back to it's original enclosure?

Or does this 'rule' more relate to playing with the snake, and it's OK to briefly handle your snake to return it back to it's cage shortly after feeding if it's just a single short move?

Cheers

Adam
 
I don’t handle untill 3 days after feeding or at least untill the bulge has shrunk


Theres no pros to feeding in a seperate enclosure/tub

If you move a snake right after it’s fed, it’s gonna be in a feeding mode, if you move it an hour or so later, it’s gonna have a regurgitation risk

There’s a “myth” that after a while if u move the snake, it will start to associate being put in tub with feeding time?? It’s Le bullcrap

I haven’t been keeping snakes for very long, but only time my snakes have bitten me is when I’ve been touching rats or holding a rat and they’ve gone flying past and latched to my hand

If there’s no food around, I’m clean


Save yourself the time and just feed them in the one enclosure

A) it makes no sense to move them twice to feed them

B) causes stress- risk of regurgitate

C) will be in a feeding mode when you move it back which will have the highest bite rates
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'Don't handle after feeding' isn't a rule god gave us at the creation of time, it's just a basic rule of thumb. If you just gently and briefly pick a snake up it to move it for cleaning or inspection or to put it in a tub it doesn't matter if it just fed or is coming up for a slough etc. This is a rule for newbies who want to play with their snake for lengthy periods, which most long term keepers don't do with many if any of their snakes, ever. Newbies or some long term keepers with a small number of snakes use them as hands on physically interactive pets, and those are the people who need to understand that it's a problem to do this when they have a full belly.

It's like you shouldn't swim after a meal. It doesn't matter if you eat a couple of chips before jumping in, and it doesn't generally matter if you jump in for a swim after a big lunch, it's not like it's terrible to swim 29 minutes after a meal and then at 30 minutes it's 100% fine, and it's not like getting your foot wet immediately after a meal is a big problem. Common sense is sufficient for smart people and strict rules are for people with limited ability to use their brains (admittedly, this is common). Snakes generally eat about 10-30% of their body weight in one go and it takes days for them to digest it. Imagine eating 5-10kg of pizza and cake - you would probably wouldn't want someone picking you up and swinging you around.

Also, moving them to a separate tub for feeding is a stupid idea and it's a shame the first person to suggest it did so.
 
Thanks guys for the reply. My plan is to feed in the enclosure, but I have aspen bedding so i will see how that goes. It was more a curious question as I didn't know if those who seperated for feeding had a completely second setup ready with heating for 24-48hrs after feeding - but it sounds like people who choose to feed separately just put it back once it's finished feeding.

My aim will be to get the snake to know the difference between feeding and handling time so I don't think I'll have an issue with instinct - it was just in the back of my mind as a backup plan if the substrate it's on causes any concerns down the track.

Cheers

Adam
 
I have heard people use the tap training method where they tap on the glass to signal feed time. I have never tried it but have heard it can be done. Accidents can always happen but if you get to know your snake you can tell what mood or mode it's in by looking at it. If you absolutely don't want to get bitten use a hook even if it's just to bump its head out the way. I don't have a hook but if I'm worried I just use a hide or something to move its head. Once it is out or you have it in your hands most snakes are OK or can be handle in a manner to avoid getting bitten
 
I have always thought the feeding in a separate tub a stupid idea, first up the no handling after feeding.Apart from confusing the snake when you pick it up, is it feed time? or handle time? So I have 2 different routines.
I feed in the enclosure, tapping on the glass with the tongs first so they know it's feed time.
If I want to take them out for whatever reason I pat them with the hook first to relax them.
Snakes are not the smartest creatures but can learn to respond to simple repetitive actions.
 
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I just feed in the enclosure too.
The Stimmy has never bitten for any reason, and isn't very food responsive anyway.
SWCP #1 is a food responsive git that once tried attacking a water jug (after months of him seeing it no less), tub feeding definitely wouldn't be helping that one. Still, he is 100% calm once he has had his feed and you can get in there and do things - I just don't handle that one at all.
SWCP #2 is a new addition still in quarantine, and will be for quite some months to come. Fed him in his enclosure just last night. Didn't even strike at his food, let alone my hands or the tongs. Granted, this one is very young and small and would just be nervous in unfamiliar surroundings. Once I left the room and killed the lights he ate it in about 5-10 minutes. The breeder fed in enclosure, and had no issues with handling.
 
Tapping on the glass to let them know it's feed time? I have serious doubts you could condition a snake this way.

They pick up on scent well before they have any interaction with their keeper.
 
I used to keep diamonds in a big aviaries and a couple learned to come to the aviary doors at feed time. These were 6m aviaries and I experimented with placing the bowl of rats in different positions away from the doors but they clearly knew where they came in.

I also tapped on the aviary doors and they would come out of the hides but that could have been the scent.
 
@Yellowtail, I have tap trained Domino and she comes out of wherever she is immediately. I tested this by keeping the food away from her enclosure to check whether she’s responding to tapping or scent, and it is definitely the tapping.
My Diamond in the enclosure across the room also gets excited when she hears the tapping, but sadly for her, hers and Domino’s feeding schedule don’t always coincide.

Edit: I should have put “hear” in inverted commas, as they pick up vibrations not sounds. Although there’s seems to be an opinion out there that snakes do have a very limited sense of hearing.
 
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My snakes also respond differently with waving food around and dragging it on the floor..

The tapping + scent just makes the snake think there’s food nearby
 
Snakes have to pick up the vibration of tapping as they have no ears. My aviaries had weld mesh floors attached to the frame so the vibrations could be picked up.
I regularly feed Kookaburras and wild lace monitors with mice and rats that have died or a bit dirty to meet my standards and call them by tapping the pool fence with a knife. The laceys definitely respond to the sound as I sometimes find Kookas waiting and don't need to tap the fence, the monitors only come when I tap on the fence. There is a constant smell of rodents on my property, certainly detectable by wild reptiles so it is not the smell in this case.
 
I'm sure you could train them to associate just about anything with feeding. If you consistently tapped on the glass immediately before offering a feed, many/most pythons would get the hang of it. It's actually quite a natural trigger. For example, if birds were nesting in trees above and babies sometimes fell out of the nests on to the ground, a python learning to associate the thud/tap of a fallen bird would get extra feeds. If lizards running around in a tree knocked bits of something down, a snake picking up on this cue could do something similar. Any environmental stimulus a snake can detect which is consistently associated with the presence of feed is likely to be picked up on by the snake.

For me the trigger used is the smell of a bucket full of hot, wet rats. I guess I'm a simple fellow.
 
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