Alternative Reptile Care

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feathergrass

Active Member
Vitamin E for scars is a myth, unforunately.

i had 46 stitches on from ankle to knee on the inside of my leg the vitamin e cream turned it from a nasty as looking thing to a i can look at it and not want to be sick scar also help scarring on my mums foot after her op to not become hard and stiff and made it heal bettter an retain flexibility
 

Smithers

Very Well-Known Member
Another great read first retained eye caps this morning now this, thanks Longqi and the others who have contributed very useful info.
 

GeckoJosh

Almost Legendary
Vitamin E for scars is a myth, unforunately.
I have had numerous doctors and even scar removal clinics tell me that it helps encourage the healing of scars.
If what you say is true can you please show me some evidence that supports what you say?

Interesting.. Given the list(s) above, would anyone be able to recommend which I should use for some minor scarring?

I think my woma has got scarring from baytril injections :(
I'm hoping with a few sheds it will clear up and not be so noticable, but in the mean time would like a suggestion as to what I should rub on it.
If you managed to give your Woma scars from injecting it then I fail to see how the Baytril had anything to do with it, needles cause damage regardless of what they are injecting.
Im sure any damage a the tiny needle may have caused will heal very quickly, Iv had to regularly inject juvenile beardies and you could not see any marks after they shed
 
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SYNeR

Suspended
Banned
On my phone at the moment. I'll dig up some studies when in front of a computer. Basically Vitamin E can retard the healing of scar tissue and cause dermatitis.It's a bit silly using anecdotal evidence and saying ' but it healed my scar real good'. Double blind studies show otherwise.

Goldmember;2019678 If you managed to give your Woma scars from injecting it then I fail to how the Baytril had anything to do with it said:
It's got nothing to do with the needle. The needle shouldn't be a problem if you aim between scales. The issue is Baytril is considered highly cytotoxic and actually burns the animal..
Not to mention, Baytril for reptiles is actually an off-label use.

Common Reptile Drugs and Dosages (includes references)

Here we go:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/10417589

C
onclusion: This study shows that there is no benefit to the cosmetic outcome of scars by applying vitamin E after skin surgery and that the application of topical vitamin E may actually be detrimental to the cosmetic appearance of a scar. In 90% of the cases in this study, topical vitamin E either had no effect on, or actually worsened, the cosmetic appearance of scars. Of the patients studied, 33% developed a contact dermatitis to the vitamin E. Therefore we conclude that use of topical vitamin E on surgical wounds should be discouraged.

And..

http://www.scintera.com.au/Pdf/Topical Treatments For Hypertrophic Scars.pdf

In conclusion, the evidence that topical vitamin E alone improves the cosmetic
appearance of scars is poor. It is also associated with a high incidence of contact
dermatitis. The use of vitamin E should, therefore, be discouraged.

And another..

Inhibitory effects of vitamin E on collagen synthesis and wound repair.These one state that current studies are inconclusive at best, and reports are only anecdotal:

Vitamin E: Critical Review of Its Current Use in Cosmetic and Clinical Dermatology - Thiele - 2006 - Dermatologic Surgery - Wiley Online Library

Vitamin E for treating children's scars. Does it help reduce scarring?

Why don't we use vitamin E in dermatology?


A few of those are full articles. If you're a university student or otherwise have access to (medical) journal databases, you an get the full articles. They're loaded with more
references.

I've got several scars, including one which is around 30cm on my leg. I have both experimented with/without Vitamin E and haven't noticed anything at all. At best, I've put the healing down to the body's ability - nothing more.

Of course, it's hard, if not impossible, to extrapolate from data/studies on humans as to what the effect of Vitamin E may be on reptiles..
 
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GeckoJosh

Almost Legendary
Well that gives me something to think about next time I hit the pavement at high speeds, thanks Syner
 

cement

APS Veteran
APS Veteran
What's the hammer for? That's how I fix stuff at work not the herp room

For those of us that rescue and care for reptiles, you occasionally get one that is past help and in excruciating pain.
I am not trying to provoke anybody here,and i realize that doing the act of euthing by hammer is probably making the cup of tea too strong for a lot of people that frequent this site.
Its a sad moment for me too, and the absolute worst part of this type of work, but it is quick and extremely effective for releasing a dying animal from earthly pain.
 

Seraph

Not so new Member
Thank you so much for this thread.
There is some amazing information here.
I never thought that power aid could be so versatile.
 

Robynne

Not so new Member
I agree with cement about putting a snake out of its misery. Nothing worse than watching an animal suffer.
 

RiPPle

Not so new Member
Interesting.. Given the list(s) above, would anyone be able to recommend which I should use for some minor scarring?

Iodine is good for scarring on reptiles. I had a coastal that had burn scars on it and i was recommended to wipe iodine on the scars a couple of times a day with cotton wool. I think it still has to grow out with sheds, but it speeds up the process...
feel free to correct me if im wrong.....
 

longqi

Very Well-Known Member
Just had a VERY interesting talk with a breeder in Jakarta today

He had 6 IJ Carpet hatchies that would not feed for over 3 months
He is a great bloke and had tried everything including braining etc etc

His answer was try something he heard of but never done

Mixed plain yoghurt with chicken flavoured baby food and syringed a gobful down the throat
3 days later 5/6 took pinkies

Theory behind it is simple
Some hatchies dont absorb all the egg yolk
Maybe they miss out on some enzymes/bacteria?? that promote feeding
Yoghurt promotes enzymes/bacteria?? in the gut and so they feed

Would probably also work on adult snakes after egg laying if they are in poor nick

Any comments on this are very welcome as it would be a lot less stressful on hatchies than force feeding???
 

Endeavour

Well-Known Member
Just had a VERY interesting talk with a breeder in Jakarta today

He had 6 IJ Carpet hatchies that would not feed for over 3 months
He is a great bloke and had tried everything including braining etc etc

His answer was try something he heard of but never done

Mixed plain yoghurt with chicken flavoured baby food and syringed a gobful down the throat
3 days later 5/6 took pinkies

Theory behind it is simple
Some hatchies dont absorb all the egg yolk
Maybe they miss out on some enzymes/bacteria?? that promote feeding
Yoghurt promotes enzymes/bacteria?? in the gut and so they feed

Would probably also work on adult snakes after egg laying if they are in poor nick

Any comments on this are very welcome as it would be a lot less stressful on hatchies than force feeding???

Very interesting thanks for posting this and all your other top tips.


Kindest regards

Endeavour
 

longqi

Very Well-Known Member
If anyone out there knows a vet please get them to drop us a line
balireptilerescue@yahoo.com

For minor infections burns and cuts etc we do ok here with our remedies
But if the infection is bad we are losing too many in my opinion
We dont have the luxury of free treatment for native animals that you have in Aus
So I have to euthanise reptiles too often that I know we could have saved

There are various triple antibiotics etc out there that can help us such as neosporin/equate florazine silverzine Baytril [enrofloxacin] Piperacil (piperacillin), and Amikacin (amiglyde sulfate) etc etc etc
Most are not available in Indonesia or are horrendously expensive but can work well on bad infections

In Aus these all have a use by date and after that have to be dumped
If any is due to be dumped soon we would love it to get dumped in our direction

example
We have a 3metre retic that came in with a golf ball sized ball of pus and yuck on the back above the vent
I o
pened it and removed as much as I could before treating it by washing it out
Ive had to go back 3 times now to do the same thing and if I am honest I think its possibly getting worse because we cannot kill the infection itself
 
P

-Peter

Guest
Just had a VERY interesting talk with a breeder in Jakarta today

He had 6 IJ Carpet hatchies that would not feed for over 3 months
He is a great bloke and had tried everything including braining etc etc

His answer was try something he heard of but never done

Mixed plain yoghurt with chicken flavoured baby food and syringed a gobful down the throat
3 days later 5/6 took pinkies

Theory behind it is simple
Some hatchies dont absorb all the egg yolk
Maybe they miss out on some enzymes/bacteria?? that promote feeding
Yoghurt promotes enzymes/bacteria?? in the gut and so they feed

Would probably also work on adult snakes after egg laying if they are in poor nick

Any comments on this are very welcome as it would be a lot less stressful on hatchies than force feeding???

I have been using a vetinairy probiotic for many years now, its been useful on all types of reptiles Ive had in care and recalcitrant young non feeders.


- - - Updated - - -

I'm skeptical of Baytril now.. Seems to have scarred my Woma. And I'm pretty sure I injected it deep enough - intramuscularly, not subcutaneously..

I'll be very uneasy about using it in the future if I need to.

EDIT: perhaps skeptical is the wrong word. Of course it works, it's a medicine.. It just makes me uneasy with the scarring.

Ive always wondered about theis. The makers of Baytril recommend it begiven orally, not by injection.

- - - Updated - - -

Interesting.. Given the list(s) above, would anyone be able to recommend which I should use for some minor scarring?

Iodine is good for scarring on reptiles. I had a coastal that had burn scars on it and i was recommended to wipe iodine on the scars a couple of times a day with cotton wool. I think it still has to grow out with sheds, but it speeds up the process...
feel free to correct me if im wrong.....


On the iodine, Betadine is iodine in an ointment form. Silverzine is good for scars but good treatment during the wound stage is best as it is the time when youcan minimise scarring. A wound dressing is best. You can use clingfilm and tape the ends on. You need two people to do it.
 

Bushman

Very Well-Known Member
This is an excellent thread. It's been suggested that we make it a sticky and I agree.
Thanks to everyone involved.
 

geckodan

Very Well-Known Member
Flax has been explained now
Cool
I dont know the big names for most of this stuff

Waterat
sorry mate should have explained that better
I sat there for about an hour crushing the Cuttlefish bone into as fine a powder as I could
Then mixed it with water and let it sit over night
Used that for both the syringe and the drinking water but the syringe lot was stronger as they were both pretty crook
None of the snakes were keen on drinking the water but I didnt give them a choice as that was the only water I gave them
Tried it myself and didnt taste too bad

SM Morelia
Thats the thing that is so different about this RI treatment
Most Aussie vets get horrified when you say you up the humidity for this RI treatment
But it works extremely well
Best thing is that there are no residual chemicals left and zero side effects
Bactrim and Baytril are basically the same stuff
One for kids with throat infections etc
One for snakes
Anyone with kids knows Bactrim pretty well
Once kids start on it they need bigger and stronger doses next time

Crushed Cuttlefish bone is just Calcium carbonate powder - I fail to see what major role it has in treating bacterial stomatitis (if thats what you were referring to) other than bone repair.
Bactrim and Baytril are most definately not the same thing - not even the same class of antibiotics.
Higher doses are not required at subsequent treatments. The recommended dose is based on the dose required to achieve therapeutic levels.
 
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