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SteveNT

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I used to know a bloke up here (sadly deceased) named Graham Gow.

He claimed that bhp's were immune to the toxins of taipans, death adders, browns, etc.

He felt that given the fact that current broad spectrum antivenines were as dangerous as the bite itself in many cases, someone should find out what the bhps had in their system that could defeat such a range of toxins.

I've never seen it but he said bhps grab the vens mid body and work their way up to the head before swallowing, thus getting bitten in the process.

He was always looking for a PHD student to take it on but I guess that would be too scary for many.

Any comment?
 
I think that would be absolutely fascinating. I'd love to do a PHD on that... (when I get there!) I don't have any insight as to why how they would be immune unfortunately.
 
Hi mate,

When my old man worked at Hartley's Creek Zoo in the early 1970's, he had a large wild caught Coastal Taipan in a holding enclosure ready to be put on display in the morning.

During the night someone dropped off a 2.5 meter wild Black Headed after closing time (got to love pre licensing laws) Garry Zillflesh (Zoo's owner at the time) did not know of the Taipan in the holding enclosure and placed the BHP into the same cage. Lucky for Garry, not only was he not bitten by the Taipan, he did not even know it was in there!

Come morning time, Rex went to check on the prized elapid catch from the day before and was shocked to see a Black Headed in the corner of the cage, fat as pie with the Coastal Taipan in her belly.

The Black Headed was fine and it just goes to show how tough they are against venomous elapids and also how OH&S played no part in FNQ's first Zoo
 
BHPs are not the only species immune to elapid venoms. More or less, all reptiles, including lacies, that prey on elapids are immune to their venoms.
 
I just typed up a pretty big post but it deleted before i go tot post it. I hate this computer!
 
My experience backs up what michael has said. But i'll ad that reptiles that are prey items to vens also have a level of immunity to venom.

There is some research going on that is looking at using the snakes own blood products that allows them to be immune to their own venom as an anti venom. But from the reading that i have done, using snake blood products won't stop serum sickness and imo may even cause serum sickness to be worse. The serum sickness is caused because of the body rejecting foreign blood products in your blood, the less similar the animal is to us the worse the sickness and the less effective the anti-venom.

Still an interesting topic.

PC Windows? By a Mac and you will never have a problem. Trust me.

No it's the laptop i'm working on lol. I accidentily bumped the mouse pad and kept typing which somehow caused the window to close.
 
I just typed up a pretty big post but it deleted before i go tot post it. I hate this computer!

Yep. familiar with that one. I make a word document first if I'm doing a big spiel these days, then cut and paste.
 
Completely immune, or just a high tolerance? I didn't think a full immunity to venoms had been proven.
 
Steve, I think tolerance in this case equals immunity. If elapid predators were feeling even slightly sick after ingesting venom, elapid prey would be unpalatable to them. The same goes for direct bites.
What is also interesting that for example King cobras regularly feed on pit-vipers and they're getting bitten in the process. Pit-viper's venom has pretty nasty local effect resulting in necrosis, gangrene, etc. (that is in humans), yet the cobras seem unaffected.
 
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BHPs are not the only species immune to elapid venoms. More or less, all reptiles, including lacies, that prey on elapids are immune to their venoms.


How about a A. maculosa eating a D. torquata! Something different every day in FNQ
 
We have to assume that BHP's get bitten in the process of subduing their prey, it would be hard to believe they don't, but does anybody know of an instance where it has been witnessed? have the effects or lack of actually been recorded post bite?
 
We have to assume that BHP's get bitten in the process of subduing their prey, it would be hard to believe they don't, but does anybody know of an instance where it has been witnessed? have the effects or lack of actually been recorded post bite?

I know of one case study that was referenced in a media release where a bunch of womas were killed by mulgas. And i have seen a video of a brown crawling out of a red bellies mouth.
 
Aspidities are too 'dopey' to always grab and elapid by the head. They would be bitten most of the time.

Have you ever seen an adult BHP in the wild with no scars? I have never ever seen a 'scar - less' adult.
 
Some of the scaring are claw marks. Big BHPs often get stuck into smaller lacies and they rip them up.
 
That is my point, if they will readily take on large monitors as a prey item, grabbing an Elapid mid boody hardly seems life threatening!

I know of a large BHP (2700mm) collected near Quamby in the early 70's that regurged a V. panoptes around 4 feet total length! I can imagine the smell of that in the back of the car on a 45 deg December day!
 
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