Confirmation please

Discussion in 'General Reptile Discussion' started by trin_007, May 9, 2016.

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  1. trin_007

    trin_007 Not so new Member

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    I am a bit dubious about my seller and purchase. Just hoping someone can confirm/advise on what species/subspecies my fella might be? uploadfromtaptalk1462753601612.jpg [​IMG]

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  2. pythoninfinite

    pythoninfinite Subscriber Subscriber

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    It's a Carpet with a Jungle influence, but beyond that nobody would know.

    Jamie
     
  3. alterego

    alterego New Member

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    are you in queensland? i had a guy trying to swap a python similar to that for my enclosures. He was claiming it to be a u-beaut jungle of some description, my reply to him was it looked like one of my coastals and i never heard from him again....
     
  4. ronhalling

    ronhalling Subscriber Subscriber

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    [MENTION=42324]trin_007[/MENTION], from the first pic i would have said Black and White Jungle but the second shot just screams Coastal, i would go along with Jamie in saying it is a Coastal with some Jungle influence going by the Voodoo pattern on the head, looking at it's eye it is going into shed so put up another couple of pics (in the same light) after the shed. ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°) -ronhalling
     
  5. Burgo89

    Burgo89 Active Member

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    I'm seeing two completely different snakes.
     
  6. trin_007

    trin_007 Not so new Member

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    The two photos above are actually before and after a shed - just a couple i had on my phone.

    Here are a couple more:
    [​IMG][​IMG]

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  7. trin_007

    trin_007 Not so new Member

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    Yes i am in Qld and have to admit it has been a bit of a dodgy start. Being my first purchase i was a bit naive about the whole process, other than asking was he licensed, i was clueless about how things worked. He was just a young guy and i was a bit too keen to do the deal as it was a present for my son's birthday. He told me he would email the transfer as he couldn't find his permit while i was there. He told me the snake was about to shed and how he'd been feeding ( or starving! !) him, and about the general care etc. Two weeks later, a few text messages in between and still no permit, i called the mobile and "no one by that name on this phone" i lost my ***** with whoever it was and said someone better sorry something out. I eventually got a text back saying he had found his friend and the permit would be sent that weekend. I waited over a week and nothing arrived so i called DEHNP and they said just send in whatever info i had and they would follow it up. So i waited a couple of days then sent in my (blank) forms with basically just my permit number. A week later....the mystery form finally arrived! !!!

    The description on the transfer is: morelia spilota cheynei

    Sorry for the epic story.

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  8. notechistiger

    notechistiger Subscriber Subscriber

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    Cape york maybe? I'd definitely say some sort of jungle carpet.
     
  9. AdhamhRuadh

    AdhamhRuadh Active Member

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    Definitely looks more Jungle than anything to me. I personally don't see Coastal at all.

    Adam
     
  10. Jenk92

    Jenk92 New Member

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    Defs jungle carpet
     
  11. BredliFreak

    BredliFreak Well-Known Member

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    Looks Jungle or predominantly Jungle, perhaps coastal or cape York mixed in, or potentially a mixed locale animal
     
  12. pythoninfinite

    pythoninfinite Subscriber Subscriber

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    It's a Carpet with a Jungle influence, but beyond that nobody would know.

    Jamie
     
  13. Waterrat

    Waterrat Almost Legendary

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  14. ShaunMorelia

    ShaunMorelia Power Seller Power Seller

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    Appearance does look typical of a Cape York carpet.
    But without knowing the linage, then can't really say for certain.

    Jamie, are you inferring that there is no ssp. of Morelia spilota? ;)
     
  15. BredliFreak

    BredliFreak Well-Known Member

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    Waterrat in NQ there is probably more undescribed ssp and hybridisation zones so I find it easiest to describe using locales. Could potentially bee a cross between an Atherton and a julatten (as an example)
     
  16. GBWhite

    GBWhite Well-Known Member

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    Hi Trin_007

    What you have is a very nice looking python of the Morelia spilota group.

    Despite all the above "stabs in the dark" no body can tell you what it is and as far as subspecies go nothing has been confirmed that there are subspecies within the Morelia sp group. Even current evidence based on DNA profiling to date is insufficient. It appears highly probable that they are all the same snake that display a mass variation in colour and patterns relevant to the area where they originate and this alone is insufficient to confirm a subspecies.

    All the best

    George.
     
  17. Waterrat

    Waterrat Almost Legendary

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    Well said George.

    My favorite note on subspecies:
    “A population that has been geographically isolated for an unspecified period of time, and that has attracted more attention from researchers than one which has not yet achieved that status”. A product of vivid imagination and poor science."

    cheers
    Michael
     
  18. AdhamhRuadh

    AdhamhRuadh Active Member

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    Not trying to start a whole thing, but I am so sick of hearing the “No such thing as subspecies/Not enough DNA data” argument. If there is currently insufficient evidence to prove the existence of the various Spilota subspecies, isn’t that more reason to assume that they DO exist until proven otherwise? You know; to avoid people just going crazy with crossing anything they can get their hands on and possibly finding out later that they are indeed separate subspecies/species, resulting in a lack of pure animals and an abundance of crosses/hybrids?
    Oh wait…
     
    Last edited: May 10, 2016
  19. Waterrat

    Waterrat Almost Legendary

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    Agham, I see where you coming from but it seems to me like a reversed logic. Historically, if you go to Kinghorn, Worrell and other early workers, there were only M. s. spilota and M.s. variegata. So, how can other subspecies exist without being described?
    How can something exist without evidence of its existence?
    Also, species and subspecies are two VERY different taxonomic levels.

    cheers
    Michael
     
  20. AdhamhRuadh

    AdhamhRuadh Active Member

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    [MENTION=20031]Waterrat[/MENTION],
    I probably should have made it clear that I was referring to assuming that the currently accepted subspecies (Cheynei, Mcdowelli, Imbricata, Metcalfei, Variegata, Spilota) exist. As far as I know, these have all been described and I don't see how denying their existence without sufficient evidence to do so is helping anything.
    I also realise that species and subspecies are very different; but Bredli was once considered a subspecies of Spilota and that was proven wrong (with DNA, I believe?), so probably better to leave classification up to the experts, and follow the taxonomy of the likes of Cogger, etc.

    Adam
     
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