Glass or melamine enclosure

Discussion in 'Newbies forum' started by Kirk1701, Nov 13, 2017.

  1. SpottedPythons

    SpottedPythons Well-Known Member

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    Won't happen if you are careful. I know plenty of keepers who use that kind of substrate without any issues. Plus, baby Antaresia love burrowing, and it gives them a chance to exhibit their natural behaviours. In fact, the ability to burrow in their enclosure is more important than the ability to climb, in my opinion, since they are no where near arboreal. You could also always feed in a separate container, if need be. I know that might be harder for people with more animals, but the OP is considering only one snake.
     
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  2. Flaviemys purvisi

    Flaviemys purvisi Very Well-Known Member

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    I don't see how being careful plays a part... you present a fuzzy to a young snake is a tub of shredded paper, it grabs it, coils it up and proceeds to go about eating it... unless it does so whilst levitating, the probability of taking some paper as a side dish is pretty high. I guess the owner will find out which substrate works best soon enough.
     
  3. Kirk1701

    Kirk1701 Active Member

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    Oh, didn’t think of that. I’ll take it out
     
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  4. Flaviemys purvisi

    Flaviemys purvisi Very Well-Known Member

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    A meal on paper towel is a lot easier... I use a double layer so the pythons can burrow between the layers if they desire.
    20171101_201806.jpg
     
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  5. pinefamily

    pinefamily Subscriber Subscriber

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    We did the same with all of our hatchlings. Not unusual to find them hiding under the paper towel. Not arguing against you, SpottedPythons, substrate for burrowing in is important; we just waited until our pythons went into enclosures to provide it.
     
  6. Scutellatus

    Scutellatus Well-Known Member

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    It will be fine. The paper will come out the other end just as the mouse will. It is not like snakes have a paper towel to keep their food clean in the wild.
     
    Last edited: Nov 15, 2017
  7. Flaviemys purvisi

    Flaviemys purvisi Very Well-Known Member

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    The paper towel isn't to keep their food clean... It's to keep their click-clack clean... it just so happens to also be a more convenient medium for a snake to eat off.
     
  8. Scutellatus

    Scutellatus Well-Known Member

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    I know what it is for. Snakes in the wild would ingest a whole lot more than a few strands of paper and seem to have done just fine for how ever many thousands of years.
    Technically you are the one that keeps the click clack clean not the paper towel.
     
  9. GBWhite

    GBWhite Well-Known Member

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    They sure do. I did a scat analysis of a number of species of wild elapids for my final paper for an Advanced Herp Course at the University of Technology in Sydney back in the early 1990's and their scats were full of items including bits of plastic, paper, cloth and pebbles as well as pieces of secondary food items like bits of beetles and insects. Also found bits of undigested skink sloughs (head shields and whole feet). The bit's and pieces of the bugs and skins were that perfect I could identify the species of beetles, insects and the skinks. I could identify mammals through undigested teeth, claws and fur.
     
    Last edited: Nov 16, 2017
  10. Scutellatus

    Scutellatus Well-Known Member

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    Were these juveniles George? A shed skin seems like a minute meal for any snake bigger than a pencil. Do you think they were eating the sloughs or the whole lizard while it was in or near a slough?
     
  11. Flaviemys purvisi

    Flaviemys purvisi Very Well-Known Member

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    In the wild the rodents are alive... don't compare the wild with captivity...
     
  12. GBWhite

    GBWhite Well-Known Member

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    No all mostly adults and a couple of sub adults. I was able to identify Water Skinks, Water dragons and Blue Tongues in Red-Bellied Blacks, Copperheads and Tigers. A couple of different species of Grass Skinks in Small Eyes, Marsh Snakes and Whip Snakes as well as Ctenotus Skinks (Coppertails and Stripped Skinks) in Whips and Lesueur Geckoes in Small Eyes. Identified Blue Tongues in some of the Browns. I doubt if they just ate the sheds and can only assume that the lizards were either in or near slough when hey were eaten.
     
  13. Scutellatus

    Scutellatus Well-Known Member

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    What does that have to with ingesting substrate.
     
  14. pinefamily

    pinefamily Subscriber Subscriber

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    Keeping reptiles in captivity, we tend to do the best we can to minimise any risks, especially compared to reptiles in the wild. Whether or not shredded paper presents such a risk is up for debate. I wouldn't think so, but as above, when we had hatchies we used straight paper towel, for ease of cleaning. Far easier to spot their business on paper towel than hidden in shredded paper.
     
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  15. Flaviemys purvisi

    Flaviemys purvisi Very Well-Known Member

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    You said in the wild they ingest matter other than their prey... you brought the wild into it so if ingesting foreign matter is Ok, then why feed killed rodents...? Your argument is stupid. Paper towel is safer than shredded paper, not only to eliminate feeding complications but for temp control too... newspaper is well known for its insulating qualities hence why it's highly sought after amongst the homeless... an inch of shredded paper in a plastic tub sitting over a heat mat will retain too much heat you might not see the snake but you'll sure smell it once it's baked... approaching summer, not a good idea... stick with paper towel.
    Paper towel is also far superior than newspaper as an absorbent...
     
    Last edited: Nov 16, 2017
  16. Prof_Moreliarty

    Prof_Moreliarty Subscriber Subscriber

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    I keep mine on paper towel till yearlings then they go into larger enclosures with kritters crumble or coco peat/ husk never been an issue when ingested. Also Kev we feed dead rodents to keep rspca happy and your snake healthy a live rat is very capable of delivering a deadly bite or one that will hand you a Large vet bill.
     
  17. Scutellatus

    Scutellatus Well-Known Member

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    I have noticed over a few threads your reluctance to answer questions put to you by several different members when your views are challenged and your choice to dance around the issues raised with arrogant snide remarks. I will not respond to you further with my 'stupid arguements'. Enjoy your day.
     
  18. GBWhite

    GBWhite Well-Known Member

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    I'm not trying to be nasty or anything and I don't know what your experience is with keeping snakes but I think the point being made is that it's not going to cause any harm if the snake ingests a bit of shredded paper. We feed frozen rodents because 1. It is convenient 2. It is illegal in most if not all states and territories to feed live rodents 3. Live rodents left in enclosures without supervision can cause serious harm a snake if not eaten.

    I'm not sure about your assumption that using newspaper as a substrate will cause overheating. Both myself and a number of friends have kept juvenile adders and red bellies in click clacks over a heat mat with shredded newspaper for a substrate as well as a substrate for adult elapids kept in plastics over heat mats in the past without any issues regarding overheating. In fact I still use shredded newspaper over newspaper as a substrate in my wooden enclosures for all my RBB's and a sub adult Collets that's house in plastic over a heat mat.
     
    Last edited: Nov 16, 2017
  19. Stompsy

    Stompsy Subscriber Subscriber

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    Yup, and when they strike so hard that the rat explodes, it’s much easier to clean this kind of mess.

    4A9739C1-4EBA-4283-A1A3-C68E54494190.jpeg
     
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  20. Flaviemys purvisi

    Flaviemys purvisi Very Well-Known Member

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    Exactly, that is my point, we minimise the risks in captivity hence why I suggested a substrate of shredded newspaper would not be ideal and that paper towel would be better. Saying it's ok because snakes in the wild swallow foreign matter while eating is silly, perhaps we should put some ticks in our enclosures too to make it more like the wild?? Anyway all I was saying is that paper towel would be safer... that is all.

    Huh?? Mate, feel free to use shredded newspaper all you want. If that's your preferred method, by all means, carry on.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 16, 2017

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