My first venomous snake handle!!!! <----no need for capti

[andrew_555]

RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: MY FIRST VENOMOUS SNAKE

ahh interesting point cris. but just creates more questions: when an elapid strikes, does it select whether to envenomate? that is to say, can it strike at prey without injecting venom?

 

[GreatSage]

RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: MY FIRST VENOMOUS SNAKE

"I truley belive that it is about time that the bunch of incompetent fools that go under the name snakebusters need to be removed from the industry, by choice or force, and take up another profession. "

Can't something be done! I can't see how this practice hasn't been made illegal in our day and age!

"As for the rest of you read the first post and start again... you should be ashamed of your behaviour... "

I am glad that he is exhited however it would be far better if it wasn't via such a Barberic-Group who
clearly show pure disregard for herps and the education on society on herps!

 

[Australis]

RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: MY FIRST VENOMOUS SNAKE

Im not ashamed at all

 

[TrueBlue]

RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: MY FIRST VENOMOUS SNAKE

cris, sorry but i disagree again, venom would help digestion in australian elapids.
True some captive elapids dont always envenomate when they feed but most still do.

 

[Garry2]

We all know what peoples opinions are on this what we dont want is it continually shove down our throats each time someone post a new topic
Use the site for what it was intended ..... Helpful info
I am sorry you could not work that one out.

 

[Australis]

RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: MY FIRST VENOMOUS SNAKE

Hoser claims on his site that Aussie Elapids dont need it to digest, he also claims the fridge method stops any pain during the operation. He claims alot, but doesnt provide proof to back it up.

I wouldnt trust any information on his site, he doest have a good record of telling the truth!!

Regardless of any stance a person may or may not have on the Venomoids, the fact is, it is currently ilegal for Raymond Hoser to perform this operation, or any operation!!!!

 

[bredli84]

RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: MY FIRST VENOMOUS SNAKE

This was all news to me too. Wrasse and cris both put forward good points, but IMO people shoud be discouraged from handling vens, surely such displays could result in the uninitiated running off to catch their own tiger/taipan etc which coud end in disaster? anyway i signed the petition.

 

[Australis]

We all know what peoples opinions are on this what we dont want is it continually shove down our throats each time someone post a new topic
Use the site for what it was intended ..... Helpful info
I am sorry you could not work that one out.

This is "Helpful info"

Some people still dont know about Venomoids, some people at Hosers shows handling these animals dont even know what they really are or how they are created.

I think explaining this to new people is "helpful".

Do you have anything "helpful" to add "Garry2"????????? :roll:


Matt

 

[andrew_555]

hold on garry,

true blue and cris are giving me some very useful info, and the others giving great opinions, which, for the record, i didn't already know and are completely relevant to the original topic.

and on that point, can a elapid strike without envenomating?

 

[elapid68]

RE: Re: RE: MY FIRST VENOMOUS SNAKE HANDLE!!!!

Unfortunalty I have to admit those Colletts were some of my babies that I sold to He That Shall Remain Nameless who then venomoided them. Vemonoided or not, they're still awesome critters.
(shameless promo follows) All my Colletts are mating like mad at the moment so once they start hatching if anyone wants some, I'll be sure to post when they're available.

 

[cris]

We all know what peoples opinions are on this what we dont want is it continually shove down our throats each time someone post a new topic
Use the site for what it was intended ..... Helpful info
I am sorry you could not work that one out.

There are plenty of ppl here who wouldnt even have known what a venomoid was until they read this thread. I dont see why its wrong for me to put my view accross ppl are free to go and make up their own minds. I also accept that my view isnt the popular one. I suggest that anyone who doesnt know about this go to the link for the petition(on the last page) read through the all of papers that are linked and make up there own minds. Then if you want to, sign the petetion too.

 

[Garry2]

Helpful info is good and yes there is a lot of that in this post but if you check the last five pages of this topic you will see more opinions than info...
though it was an info site and not a flame site.
Sorry but you get sick of all the rubbish that goes with info

 

[Australis]

There are plenty of ppl here who wouldnt even have known what a venomoid was until they read this thread. I dont see why its wrong for me to put my view accross ppl are free to go and make up their own minds. I also accept that my view isnt the popular one. I suggest that anyone who doesnt know about this go to the link for the petition(on the last page) read through the all of papers that are linked and make up there own minds. Then if you want to, sign the petetion too.

Well said cris, im also surprised how many people still havnt heard much on this topic.


Matt

 

[Kiwicam]

and on that point, can a elapid strike without envenomating?

Slightly relevant, have been reading about Cobras as I find them very interesting and venom in general (interesting stuff like a simple sugar molecule protects a Cobra from it's own venom),
Quote as follows....

"Not all snakebites result in envenomation. In the case of cobras, the percentage of blank bites may be quite high, 45% in one series of 47 cases from Malaysia. In another series, 1 of 3 snake charmers bitten by large king cobras showed no signs of envenomation. "

From http://www.emedicine.com/EMERG/topic544.htm

 

[Snake Catcher Victoria]

shameless promo follows) All my Colletts are mating like mad at the moment so once they start hatching if anyone wants some, I'll be sure to post when they're available.

shameless promo worked.
pm sent

 

[andrew_555]

Interesting kiwicam, thanks for the stats.

Really interesting stuff.

 

[PremierPythons]

tebz..... Glad you are so excited about your experience and hope you have more good times ahead.

As for the rest of you read the first post and start again... you should be ashamed of your behaviour... the post was not about you and your opoinions but about someone elses exitment.

Shame Shame Shame.

Are you serious mate? You can't express your opinions on this board now if it takes away from someone's excitement?? So what if (for example) someone posts a topic - "I'm so excited - I just killed my first snake" - are we still allowed to be critical eventhough it takes away from his excitement?

 

[GreenWillow]

Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: MY FIRST VENOMOUS SN

Imagine if noone had voiced their disgust about what was happening to Jews et. al. in Germany in the 1930/40's. Or if people continued to hold their tounges about whaling because other people know how they feel about it already and are well able to make up their own minds. And look at what has been the result of silence about the abuse of women and children in some Aboriginal communities.

Silence can all too easily be misinterpreted as complicity.

Sometimes we need to continue to voice our anger and disgust so that the message continues to get across (or may eventually fitler through), and so that those who don't know can learn.

I'm not comparing the voiding of venomous snakes to the sexual abuse of an Aboriginal child or the gassing of millions of Jews, but this thread has morphed into a very valid discussion on whether or not members of a community should speak up when they see harm and wrong being done.

I believe Ray Hoser is doing harm and wrong.

Hear my angry voice raised!

 

[andrew_555]

RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: MY FIRST VENOMOU

and what a voice! well said lily

 

[JandC_Reptiles]

How can you compare a person who operates on his own snakes to millions of innocent people slaughtered by a dictator or the innocent slaughter of Whales by the Japanese? Bit different don't you think? Ray may cause harm to his own animals but he isn't effecting an entire population unlike Hitlers stance or the act of culling vulnerable species of aquatic mammals.

Voicing anger is all good atm while it suits the majority but what about when somebody has a differing opinion than the mass? Should Afro be re-instated as a Mod because he voiced his opinions about Steve Irwin being a egotistical goose that caused undue stress to wildlife? Atleast he didn't try to force it down peoples throats everytime Steve was mentioned. What about if a member constantly raises their voice about the feeding of rodents &amp; insects and posts that opinion in every thread that makes mention of either? That would be a valid point to some I would suppose. Or the fact that Reptiles should remain un-spoilt in their natural enviornment THE WILD? Again a fair call to make if you felt so inclined.

Members could of easily posted Rays site address and asked the poster to take a read, its called education. But instead the mass prefer to take shots at the man and get into heated arguments. Even if the topic made no mention of venomoids but just mentioned Ray or Snakebusters the mass would of pounced like a pack of pittbulls on a poodle.