Snake Positive Reinforcement?

Discussion in 'Australian Snakes' started by Konjira, Jul 25, 2012.

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  1. dickyknee

    dickyknee Almost Legendary

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    Old ?? ;)

    Yeah there does seem to be a whole new generation of crack pots .. I mean herpers who think that snakes are highly intelligent and able to think beyond eating , mating and pooping ... ;)
     
  2. stimigex

    stimigex Well-Known Member

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    Figuratively speaking of course :D
     
  3. euphorion

    euphorion Very Well-Known Member

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    How are his facts wrong? Snakes don't give a hoot if they lay in their own waste.

    And what on earth are you on about in regards to toilet training dogs? Of course it's toilet training. It's what bitches do with their puppies from the get go; TOILET TRAINING. Yes, they hold on because they know they are not supposed to soil their living space and so they toilet where they have been taught to toilet; outside! But further to that point, why are you using dogs as an example in a discussion that relates exclusively to training reptiles? Oh my goodness, I'm too frustrated by your grammar and spelling to follow this thought process any further.

    But to answer OP, no. Enough said.
     
    Last edited: Jul 29, 2012
  4. Are you sure you spelled you name on APS correctly - maybe you meant "Carturd" lol!!!

    Perhaps you are a new-age keeper, but can you tell me how many decades you've been keeping snakes for dude? And what background you have in reptile biology, beyond your "record keeping...?" I'm sure I can tell you quite a bit more about snakes than you can tell me...

    Jamie :)
     
  5. sherlock

    sherlock Not so new Member

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    You cant seriously think your yelling "NO" has taught your snake to not go near the heater ?? stimigex
    No I don't. But it was an interesting observation. But a true one, so far. No animal would be able to understand language, but they do understand something in front of them that comes with food sometimes might be an important thing to them. Don't you think?
    Snakes didn't get to be one of the most successful carnivores on this planet by being stupid.
     
    Last edited: Jul 29, 2012
  6. notechistiger

    notechistiger Subscriber Subscriber

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    No animal can understand language? My lorikeet understands me when I say "off you get" (meaning you're not allowed there so get off it). My dog understands his name. He understands "come here" to mean he better get over there fast! Most animals don't understand words that haven't been taught to them, but it's very closed minded to say no animal can understand anything at all.

    But I think you missed the point. You realise snakes have no ear holes and thus can't hear you when you scream "no!" at it, right?

    As for your other point, considering any of my snakes would just as happily munch on my hand if I tasted like food as they would the real thing- no I don't think for a second that my snakes have a special tie to me because I bring them food. To them I'm a warm tree that moves and bothers them every now and again. Snakes need far, far less people anthropomorphizing them. They really, really won't care if their owners die tomorrow.
     
  7. kawasakirider

    kawasakirider Very Well-Known Member

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    Pfft. You old school snake keepers just think that snakes can't be trained because you've never tried.

    If I say "wanna go in the car?" mine get excited. I can open their cage and they'll slither out the door, down the steps and into the car. They love going for drives.

    I try to take them for drives at least once every few days, they love stretching across the dash and poking their heads out the windows. They are also fairly partial to the odd trip into woolworths.
     
  8. Ummm... the last sentence here is interesting... "most successful carnivores on the planet..."? Evolutionary development has made them what they are, not intelligent strategy.

    Jamie
     
  9. sherlock

    sherlock Not so new Member

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    No I don't. There was a bit more said and done than just a 'no' , and no they can't hear. But the point is that he doesn't go near the heater. He shows no interest, but he is intensely curious about everything else. Not a proof intelligence or anything, just an interesting anecdote, which I thought you had the intelligence to understand.
     
  10. thomasssss

    thomasssss Very Well-Known Member

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    did you smack him on the nose as well and tell him his a bad dog .. i mean snake
     
  11. kaoss

    kaoss Not so new Member

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    You guys sound like you have some really timid snakes, My little stimsons gets curious when any one comes near his enclosure, instead of hiding and shying away... if I open the top of his enclosure, he gets all happy, almost jumping out of his enclosure into my arms! He loves getting into my jacket where its all warm and cosy, or he curls up around my pony-tail and sits on top of my head watching TV with me.

    He's a cuddly one, maybe I just got lucky....but I never get the feeling that he doesn't like being handled.

    If other people handle him, he comes STRAIGHT back to me and holds on and snuggles :)
     
  12. euphorion

    euphorion Very Well-Known Member

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    I do hope this thread doesn't get closed. It's just so darn entertaining!

    EVOLUTIONARY BIOLOGY - google this, now
    REPTILIAN PHYSIOLOGY - learn about it, learn A LOT about it, and then learn some more about it
    FUNCTIONAL CAPABILITIES - recognise and understand them

    omgoodness. reptiles are NOT DOGS.

    Koass - a few of mine are like that too, we're very lucky to have snuggly ones i say!


    Ugh, i just can't bear how silly this argument it. You 'making a show of telling your snake "no"' has nothing to do with your snake not going near the heating, perhaps it could be something as simple as the heater having a bad smell or vibrating at a frequency what you can't detect that put your snake off. I just can't comprehend how you can think you trained him not to go near it, i just can't.

    But enough, i don't want to get another infraction for feuding on the forum again, although goodness me i know i could stick to this like a dog on a bone.
     
    Last edited: Jul 30, 2012
  13. notechistiger

    notechistiger Subscriber Subscriber

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    The anecdote was easy to understand. The fact you said you shouted at an animal that can't hear is what raised eyebrows. What is so hard about that to understand?
     
  14. sherlock

    sherlock Not so new Member

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    Had no idea that my comments would be so wildly misread.
    Pythoinfinite - You are right, evolutionary development has enabled them to be this successful, and what you say is correct, but there is an intelligence of a sort, that is not just a “mindless eating, sleeping, machine.” I do feel sorry for people who feel that way about their pets.
    Snakes are one of the most successful, wide spread and numerous of animals. The same basic design has been around for millions of years. Snakes are everywhere on every continent except Antarctica and Ireland. And I don’t blame them for not living in those places.​
    I used to think that snakes were mindless eating sleeping machines, but I could observe that my snakes’ behavior shows the opposite. Snakes have personalities (as most snake owners would agree), they have likes and dislikes, they recognize and like (or dislike) their owners. They must surely experience pleasure when basking in the sun, or finding and killing their prey.
    Also that line “.."most successful carnivores on the planet..."? is a paraphrase from a David Attenborough documentary about snakes.
    And if microorganisms have been found to have an intelligence and birds are being studied at Oxford University for their tool handling and tool making abilities, why can't it be possible to train or condition a snake somehow?​
    I find it interesting and humorous how just stating an opinion can really upset some people, as my comment seems to have done. ​
    I’m looking forward to the responses to this post.
     


  15. The same could be said for bacteria except you would need to replace millions with billions and they also thrive in Antartica and Ireland, though it doesn't by default make them intelligent with human like emotions.
     
  16. Becceles

    Becceles Guest



    ...and New Zealand... not to mention that they were introduced to many of the smaller islands too.​
     
  17. sherlock

    sherlock Not so new Member

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    Hi euphorion - really enjoyed your post, thank you. I never laughed so hard.
    I never said it was proof f anything, it was an interesting observation of behavior. You may be right, it might be bad smell or something. Though I wonder about that, he enjoyed being in a spicy pizza box. It was cute how he poked his head out of one of the holes.
    Looking forward to your next post.
     
  18. hnn17

    hnn17 Active Member

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    sherlock did you eliminate all other possible reasons that could explain your snake's behaviour ? or just jump to the conclusion the cause was you yelling no at it ?
     
  19. I suspect that like many who anthropomorphise their reptiles, the neediness demonstrated by sherlock is greater than that of her reptile... I just hate it when grown up (?) human beings turn their grand, beautiful "wild" creatures into simpering, cuddly (?!), cooperative "colleagues" - it's so degrading for these beautiful animals...

    Jamie
     
  20. euphorion

    euphorion Very Well-Known Member

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    Your sarcasm is positively divine. Pray tell, why did you find it so amusing? Or did you simply not understand it? Oh wait! Feuding again. Drat.

     
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