some elapid picts

[redbellybite]

Yeah Mark fluffy sits 'dead' still ....

 

[eipper]

Hey all,
Taxonomical Politics aside, as a co-author of the paper, I can tell you that the mtDNA and cytochrome B studies we performed on Pseudechis, Oxyuranus and Acanthophis where primarily to determine the relationships and invasion periods between these genera in Aust. & PNG, not to determine the speciation within a genera. Although these results suggested inter-relationships within the various genera, we were not willing to make taxonomical judgements based purely on these results, as the study lacked a detailed morphometric study to compliment the DNA results.

In regards to Pseudechis porphyriacus remaining in Pseudechis, I was under the impression that Pseudechis species shared a distinct hemipenal structure, which is the main argument for retaining Pseudechis as is. (I don't personally agree with the retention of Pseudechis species as it currently stands, however until a complete study is done, P. porphyriacus will probably remain in Pseudechis.

The "Taxonomic Stability" comment, was simply in reference to avoiding making assumptions based on small data-sets, leading to taxonomical confusion. This has sometimes been the case over the last ten years, and the end result is many species described that no-one can accurately tell apart, creating major confusion and "taxonomic instability".

All the Best.

HI Chris,

Its been awhile....hope all is well

I was refering to both yours (Wuster et al) and Ulrich's papers.

It certainly appears on all available evidence (Schwaner 85, Mengen 86, Greer 97 etc) that physiologically there are reasonable differences for porphyriacus to be split away from the rest of the group (Incidently I don't feel that Pailsus or Panacedechis are different enough to use those as genera).

From husbandry, habitat preference, behavior reproductive mode all seem to point them away from the other "Pseudechis" as traditionally known.

I am not familiar enough with the Hemipenal morphology of some species in the group so I would rather not comment on this aspect at this stage.

That aside, I feel there is enough published evidence to split the other species away from Pseudechis. Therefore I am now using Cannia for australis, butleri, colletti, guttatus, pailsi, papuanus, rossignoili and weigeli and Pseudechis for porphyriacus.

Cheers,
Scott Eipper

 

[ryanharvey1993]

HI Chris,

Its been awhile....hope all is well

I was refering to both yours (Wuster et al) and Ulrich's papers.

It certainly appears on all available evidence (Schwaner 85, Mengen 86, Greer 97 etc) that physiologically there are reasonable differences for porphyriacus to be split away from the rest of the group (Incidently I don't feel that Pailsus or Panacedechis are different enough to use those as genera).

From husbandry, habitat preference, behavior reproductive mode all seem to point them away from the other "Pseudechis" as traditionally known.

I am not familiar enough with the Hemipenal morphology of some species in the group so I would rather not comment on this aspect at this stage.

That aside, I feel there is enough published evidence to split the other species away from Pseudechis. Therefore I am now using Cannia for australis, butleri, colletti, guttatus, pailsi, papuanus, rossignoili and weigeli and Pseudechis for porphyriacus.

Cheers,
Scott Eipper

does that mean that the only pseudechis left is red belly? do you have an article about it or some sort of paper I could have a read of, if you have already posted it just tell me which page, this thread is very long.

 

[ssssmithy]

here are a few more shots

little nutter

spotted black

my favourite rbb,whitey

smithy,

 

[ryanharvey1993]

got any full body shots of the spotted black, are captive ones aggresive? all the wild ones I have seen seem to be full of attitude. wouldnt mind seeing some of the browny looking ones, only seen road kills. all 4 live ones I have seen have been jet black.

here is a shot fo one in "situ" 3 out of 4 I have seen have been found on overcast days, 2 of them seemed to be laying half through clumps of grass, I presume this is kinda so they can stay hidden, to the unsuspecting walker they would be missed, the other one was found in the middle of a track next to a creek, while we were looking for frogs and red bellys in the creek my mum yelled out for us to have a look at one, she was a metre away and it did not move it just puffed its hood at, I always thought they were shy, but after these 3. only other live one I have seen was crossing a road in the upper hunter valley, was not able to get close my friend nearly hit it with the car as it slid accross the road, by the time we were out of the car, it was in some long grass on the side, we of course ran in with bare feet, but much to our disapointment we did not see it again as it was probably long gone, that of course was the first ever one we had found.

 

[ssssmithy]

hey ryan, mine is good as gold,puppy dog but does put on a show for the camera :lol:
feeding time he is nutts though.

here are some more spotted pics

smithy

 

[ryanharvey1993]

very nice, don't see as many of them available as you do red bellys, don't know why, there probably just as good, just not as bright, if I got into elapids, they would be on the list along with adders and hoplocs

 

[ssssmithy]

yea mate,he is my favourite elapid in my collection,cool snakes thats for sure


some mulga pics.....

 

[redbellybite]

Yeah Mark fluffy sits 'dead' still ....

Just thought I would tell you a bit more about 'fluffy' ...Poor ole mate didnt make it ..he was a callout that by the time the guy rang me ,sadly ,fluffy was on his way out ..He had been caught up in a staircase and chose the wrong gap to try and squeeze through ..he was all but alive but had passed on by the time I got there by about 15mins or so ..he got cooked by the sun ...so I took him back had a real interesting poke around ,finding new things out about eastern browns ,like one side when I sexed him was a bit longer then the other and the size of the fangs(knew they were small) and the set up of the fangs amazing animals(in bottom pic you can see the reserve fang) ,also was able to 'pop' it and get alook at the sex organs , that I never would have seen ,if he wasnt dead ...and after that gave him the respect he deserved ..a watery grave ...

the couch pics were done for a gag ,couldnt resist he was in perfect condition :lol::lol::lol:

 

[pythons73]

Thats a unfortunate story Redbellybite,i didnt think the brown looked alright on the couch,in a dead way....Some snakes get themselfs in some awkward situations,most get out,some like this one didnt thou...how dare you go poking around around at the private parts.LOL....Whats some other interesting things you found out that you couldntif it was alive,cheers..MARK

 

[redbellybite]

I dont go making habit of checking out the vens mouth when they are alive and kicking ...more so the mouth structure ..got a good look ,quite a good setup for a killing machine ..
The way the jaw moves ,cause I gave that a bit of a prod and poke ..dont think an alive one would have been so happy for me to play with his mouth ...ha ha ..and I know I wouldnt have been so happy to do that either Mark ...anyway ..if you find a dead one take a good look yourself ..and practise probing cause you certainly cant do any damage to it and then you get to know how far back the probe can actually go, before the danger area, it felt like a membrane was at the bottom and if I pushed it any harder I couldve popped it ..very interesting ..I know its not everyones cup of tea to play with dead snakes

 

[Stefan]

I like all those Spotted Black pics! Great animals 8)

 

[eipper]

One thing must be remembered that dead snakes can and have caused envenomations. Also muscle contractions can still cause jerking movements and even bites. Even dead snakes should be handled with care.

I know of one bloke who got "bitten" by a frozen Eastern Brown when he reached into the freezer (he was not envenomated but it gave him a scare).

Cheers,
Scott

 

[Sturdy]

does that mean that the only pseudechis left is red belly?

Yes and Will be getting split into 3 different sub species

 

[nathanbanks]

Their some nice snakes you have... Was just wondering if they are just ornamental or if you brave the challenge and handle them...

 

[ssssmithy]

Their some nice snakes you have... Was just wondering if they are just ornamental or if you brave the challenge and handle them...

wat does that mean?:| lol

i have mine on display and for breeding purposes also. a few of my elapids are just "pets" and i probably wont ever breed them,or at least at this stage dont intend to.

smithy.

 

[hodges]

Their some nice snakes you have... Was just wondering if they are just ornamental or if you brave the challenge and handle them...

Great question , been "brave" has nothing to do with handling elapids

 

[ssssmithy]

you dont own elapids because your brave thats for sure haha



beat me to it hodges

 

[redbellybite]

One thing must be remembered that dead snakes can and have caused envenomations. Also muscle contractions can still cause jerking movements and even bites. Even dead snakes should be handled with care.

I know of one bloke who got "bitten" by a frozen Eastern Brown when he reached into the freezer (he was not envenomated but it gave him a scare).

Cheers,
Scott

I tell you Scott ..I was extra careful around the bitey end ..as you said even dead can still do the trick ....
He was in my fridge overnight ...I took the pics and did the looking the next day ...no jerking movements at all ...

 

[SnakeyTroy]

beautiful inland taipan!