Thorny Devils..

[ether]

Wouldnt say that it is that ridiculous. They are very rarely put up for sale, which i suppose is in direct realation to their high maintenance and special needs. They are also extremely cool.

 

[indicus]

"Awesome!!!, insane!!!, incredible!!!, just the first thing that comes to mind when i think of these lizards. In regards to the amount of ants consumed in one sitting?, tried to count a couple times in the wild, lost count, couldnt keep up. There has been work done on the captive diet for these lizards for some years now, with success from what i was told, i'll see if i can find out some more info."

 

[Mr.K]

Well i'm not gonna get into the silly debate about how many ants they eat, but i will say that i reckon that they are absolutely phenominal looking animals. I have never seen one in real life but whenever i see them on the tv the world stops for a few minutes. Love em.

 

[Hickson]

Re: RE: Thorny Devils..

Does anybody else have absolutely no idea what this guy is talking about?

Yeah, me. :lol:

The price is ridiculous!How would you keep the ants up to them,stand them on an ant trail?High,high maintainence animals these by the sound of it .

A mate of mine who is a senior keeper at Alice Springs Desert Park told me that to feed them, they put some honey in an outdoor enclosure and then put the lizards in when the ants have a column going. Or they put honey in a chunk of old termite mound, wait for the ants to be crawling all through it and then put the chunk in the exhibit with the Devils. He described them as easy to look after, and not too hard to breed. Not high maintenance at all.

However, that's in the Alice, within their natural range. If you were to keep them outside the arid centre of Australia then they would eb more difficult to maintain. It's thought they only feed on 6 species of ants and that their range is determined by the availability of those ants. And, to my knowledge, they've never taken to an artificial diet (then again, I didn't think there were any in private collections either ).

If you live on the coast you'll probably have the same humidity problems as you would with Shinglebacks and Centralian Blueys.



Hix

 

[Simon_Archibald]

RE: Re: RE: Thorny Devils..

I doubt NSW NPWS would approve them being kept except by scientific institutions, Ether. Jeff could answer that better.

As I explained a few times in threads recently, every reptile species except Sea-turtles, Sea-snakes and Crocodiles can now be kept by private keepers in NSW. Thorny's fit this criteria, therefore they can be kept in NSW.

I have looked into getting some of these animals (and basically didn't only because of lack of availability at the time I enquired to some breeders). $2000 is a good price for something that basically doesn't exist in captivity and if I had the cash on me, they would be mine.

I also contacted the local University for some information on breeding big numbers of ants and they were quite helpful. They also explained that when I was ready to get started, they would give all the advice and help they could.

As for the humidity issue, there would be no more dramas with these dragons than with the Shingles, Centralian Blueys, etc and people keep and breed them fairly successfully.

Simon Archibald

 

[soulweaver]

RE: Re: RE: Thorny Devils..

i know of a bloke who has a mate that brought one home from N.T about seven years ago. He knew nothing about herps so he looked up what a lizard eats in a book and saw that most eat woodies, so he has fed it for the last seven years on tiny woodies., it must be working as its still alive. I also heard that its for sale atm for $400 but not on license.

I made sure i never learnt any details of the guy cos i jsut didn't want to know about it.

 

[herptrader]

RE: Re: RE: Thorny Devils..

Hp's "acceptable use" policy rejects pictures with both the common and scientific name of this cute little lizard ;-)

I have heard that there are a number of these in captivity in Britain. I doubt the ant species required are common there ;-) They must be able to do well on other species.

 

[spooky]

RE: Re: RE: Thorny Devils..

As far as I am concerned an animal is worth what someone is willing to pay for it, if it is an outrageous price, no-one will buy the animal, so they will have to drop the price if they want it sold.

 

[Already_Gone]

RE: Re: RE: Thorny Devils..

Cool, it seems what I have been told about these creatures is wrong wrong wrong. I have no first hand experience with them, and the person who told me about 10000 ants actually works with them... so I figured he may have some idea. Sorry dudes...

 

[Guest]

Sure you can keep devils in outdoor pits,enclosed backyards so they find ants,but how would they be maintained indoors,thats what i thought would be "high maintenence".I suppose if you lived within there distribution outdoors would be easy,but most herps dont live within the devils distribution.

 

[Guest]

True,faysmith the freemarket if you can call it that in regards to the reptile industry,will work itself out.I may think the price is ridiculous but another herper may see it as a bargain opportunity!

 

[trader]

I may think the price is ridiculous but another herper may see it as a bargain opportunity!

They have now been marked as 'sold', after quite a few inquiries. :wink:

 

[Kenshin]

i know that armadale reptile park in perth have maintained and bred these

 

[craig23]

I dont think $2000 each is rediculous. They are a hard species to maintain obviously needing alot of work to feed them, and they are probably rarer in captivity than GTP's. Why is that such a bad price when common as anything lace tail monitors go for $800-$1000 each. Prices are usualy determined by availabitiy in the market and to some degree the interest factor. Everyone i know thinks they are an awsome animal, and they are all but impossible to get in captivity.

 

[Hickson]

Re: RE: Re: RE: Thorny Devils..

I doubt NSW NPWS would approve them being kept except by scientific institutions, Ether. Jeff could answer that better.

As I explained a few times in threads recently, every reptile species except Sea-turtles, Sea-snakes and Crocodiles can now be kept by private keepers in NSW. Thorny's fit this criteria, therefore they can be kept in NSW.


Simon Archibald

That's not exactly what Jeff has said. You need to make a submission to Jeff, and he passes it to a comittee who assess your application/submission and then either decide for or against. And if they decide in your favour, the State Government can still overturn their decision (as they did with crocs).



Hix

 

[geckodan]

RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Thorny Devils..

Thorny's are not really all that difficult to maintain as the genera of ants that they prefer are quite widespread throughout Australia. A close friend has maintained and bred them in QLD for the past 6 years. He keeps them in an outdoor pit and once weekly baits a wire basket in the centre of the pit with a cooked drumstick, peanut butter sandwich or anything else that will rapidly attract ants and take a while to demolish. They are good feeders but anybody who believes the numbers and the feeding methods described are being mislead. They will certainly sit on an ant trail but are equally happy to pick off free ranging ants. They do suffer badly in caostal QLD due to our higher humidity. These animals are kept 400 km inland. Are they worth the money?. I would sooner pay the price for the adult molochs than fork out 3 times that for a hatchling GTP (but I am a lizrad person) ?. Just my two cents worth

Danny Brown

 

[womas4me]

RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Thorny Devils..

armadale, the mite breeding and research centre. Are you sure they did it or did they get someone to help them

 

[beknluke]

RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Thorny Devils..

Hey - if we were allowed to keep them in Vic, I was confident in my knowledge of how to feed them and that I would be able to maintain them to their full requirements -oh, and I had the $$?? Then I would have bought them!! They're AMAZING animals - and I certainly did not know that other states allowed them to be kept in private collections!! How UNREAL!!
Oh, and I would but a hatchy GTP just as soon as one of these guys!! I actually reckon that they're were a bit on the 'cheapish' side when you think of their rarity in captivity in ppls homes

 

[Magpie]

RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Thorny Devils..

http://www.reptilesmagazine.com/reptiles/Breed_Profiles.aspx?aid=18388&cid=3684&search=


Interestingly, they reckon wild molochs eat about 750 ants a day. They are the very small ants they are talking about though.

 

[Simon_Archibald]

RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Thorny Devils..

As of 23 November 2004 applications to classify previously unclassified species of reptiles in NSW will no longer have to await the deliberations of the Native Animal Keepers Consultative Committee (NAKCC).

Any species of Australian reptile, which had not specifically been classified in the NSW Reptile Keeper Licensing System (Class 1, Class 2, or Prohibited) will automatically fall into Class 2 should specimens become available to private keepers from any legal source.

The only species that have been classified as Prohibited in NSW are crocodiles and marine reptiles (marine turtles and sea-snakes) that have been prohibited by government directive from possession in private collections in NSW. This restriction is not a Department of Environment and Conservation (NPWS) initiative and is therefore not open to debate with DEC (or me).

All unclassified venomous species will be placed in Class 2 Category 1 or Category 2 depending on the highest categorisation already existing for other members of its genus or other close relatives. Any subsequent proposals to downgrade classification (from Class 2 to Class 1 or from Class 2 Category 2 to Class 2 Category 1) will still be subject to determination by the NAKCC. In such cases the proponent will be required to submit a detailed submission to justify the downgrading.

Cheers,

Jeff Hardy
Coordinator Wildlife Licensing
NSW DEC

Rough Scaled Pythons are not on Class 2 Category 3 in NSW. Although they are not currently in writing as being on the species list, as Jeff Hardy explained ALL Australian reptiles with the exception of sea-turtles, sea-snakes and crocodiles are able to be kept by private keepers. I would assume Rough Scaled Pythons are on Class 2 (no additional categories). The Class 2 Cat.3 you're thinking of Alex is the Rough-scaled snake, not RSP. These are a different (and venomous) species.

Also as Jeff explained, if you are wanting to keep a species which is not listed in the PDF file available for download, just contact DEP (NPWS) and they will tell you what category that species is under, and the species code.

Simon Archibald

Well said Simon.

Jeff

No submissions need to be made now to keep these animals, unless you want them downgraded to a lower class of licence

Simon Archibald