I was thinking last night about some locality animals i have seen for sale in the past, while i'm sure some have came from legal sources i'm sure alot of them dont (mainly talking about QLD here). Its not hard for someone to have a pair of carpet pythons, find a nice forma locally and write them onto permit as captive bred but wouldn't it raise suspicion when someone advertises a locality not heard of in the trade before? A while ago i saw a guy offering beerwah locality coastals i think it was.
Where do they come from
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Who cares some of the biggest breeders went and caught there stock and still... Imo if its on a road and some on takes it. it was all ready dead any way..
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i dont have any problem with it i was just wondering is it something thats looked down upon and policed or is it one of those things people just turn a blind eye to. Really i can only see how it benefits the hobby with adding genetic diversity and some stunning animals and in most cases is not going to be doing any damage to the wild populations
moosenoose
Legendary
Not too far from the truth imo.
It's like the regulatory destruction of certain animals that cannot be relocated within a certain distance of a persons property. Relocators are obliged to destroy those animals (being that they are "wrongly" found on someones land! :lol
rather than taken into care. I don't see a problem with someone being given one of these animals on the condition they cannot be sold for profit. Fancy empowering a removalist (someone passionate enough to risk life and limb, literally, to protect these animals) with the burden of having to destroy the very creature that puts them into this position in the first place!Then there are also those out there who "pay" for the "privilege" to remove wild stocks and onsell them.
I certainly think there should be controls to protect wild populations and their various locales, so thank heavens there is a dollar to be made from it, otherwise the bodies regulating it wouldn't give a toss!
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Guest
Very Well-Known Member
there wasnt any suspition when the PNG ones popped up!
I think it all depends on species really, no one cares if a new locality brownsnake pops up but the broadheads are now being microchipped or having dna taken or what not in an attempt to stop new lines being taken from the bush
I think it all depends on species really, no one cares if a new locality brownsnake pops up but the broadheads are now being microchipped or having dna taken or what not in an attempt to stop new lines being taken from the bush
pythons73
Very Well-Known Member
Its been happening for years,and yet it will keep happening for a long time to come.Its hard to police this,unless caught in the act..
---------- Post added 30-Dec-10 at 11:38 AM ----------
Maybe they should be doing this also with Chondros and the higher end snakes..
---------- Post added 30-Dec-10 at 11:38 AM ----------
Maybe they should be doing this also with Chondros and the higher end snakes..
---------- Post added 30-Dec-10 at 10:48 AM ----------
[/COLOR]Maybe they should be doing this also with Chondros and the higher end snakes..[/QUOTE]
Too late, the same goes for any other species that are established in captivity. The Oenpelli python is the only species where it would make some sense to mark the founding animals and follow the lines.
[/COLOR]Maybe they should be doing this also with Chondros and the higher end snakes..[/QUOTE]
Too late, the same goes for any other species that are established in captivity. The Oenpelli python is the only species where it would make some sense to mark the founding animals and follow the lines.
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Jonno from ERD
Very Well-Known Member
Oenpelli's can be found - a friend found one a few months ago.
waruikazi
Legendary
I think poaching is abhorrent and represents everything i hate about this hobby. We do not have a god given right to the animals that we keep.
I don't have a problem with sustainable use. But the only way to ensure that the use is sustainable is to track the collection with permits.
I also think that collectors should have to pay for the animals they collect so they are contributing back to the community where the animals are collected. Whether they are paid for with cash, services or research doesn't matter to me but i do have a problem with someone getting rich just because they know the right government official.
---------- Post added 30-Dec-10 at 10:54 AM ----------
There are bigger problems than just finding them.
I don't have a problem with sustainable use. But the only way to ensure that the use is sustainable is to track the collection with permits.
I also think that collectors should have to pay for the animals they collect so they are contributing back to the community where the animals are collected. Whether they are paid for with cash, services or research doesn't matter to me but i do have a problem with someone getting rich just because they know the right government official.
---------- Post added 30-Dec-10 at 10:54 AM ----------
There are bigger problems than just finding them.
pepsi111
Active Member
and then he sold on the black market lol
Gordo, such thing is already in place, at least in Qld. Taking from the wild (licensed) attracts "conservation value" payable to the QPWS. It is substantial, if I remember correctly, for GTPs the CV is around 3K.
I don't see why any money should go the the community. Just like you rightly said "we do not have a god give right ...." neither has any community, so why should they get any money? They don't own the animals any more than we do.
Jay84
Very Well-Known Member
What about collecting animals from the bush then? Not on roads? I doubt many people come across a GTP on a road?
It makes me laugh, a young kid will get flamed for catching a Bluetongue in their garden and keeping it, yet poaching by 'more experienced' herpers is ok? The hypocrisy is astounding.
Please note - I am not expressing an opinion either way.
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waruikazi
Legendary
It happens in the NT too but usually the compensation is in kind, more often than not a pest removal service. In some situations i feel that money is the most appropriate payment but not in others.
I think cash payments are usually only appropriate where the animals to be collected are on Indigenous land but not in every situation. I don't see it is as being any different to mining, if you want a resource from someone's land (wether it is collectively or individually owned) you need to compensate the owners.
---------- Post added 30-Dec-10 at 11:29 AM ----------
While not a God given right i do think land owners do have an inherent right to any resources (including animals) on their land.
Did God give the land to the Aborinies (by the way, I am atheist)? They came from elsewhere and claimed the land they stood on just like any subsequent arrivals. I have a huge problem with this rot but lets not go into it.
waruikazi
Legendary
I know you don't want to go on with it but i feel that comment needs a response.
First off i do not think that it is just the Indigenous or traditional owners that should be compensated.
Second, at a federal level in 1992 the idea of 'terra nullius' was overturned and Indigenous Australians were recognised as having native title rights to traditional land, ie. traditional ownership. So maybe not a god given (maybe rainbow serpent is more of an appropriate term
) but definately an undeniable legal right.This topic is a big can of worms and gets many people very passionate.
You're not wrong. Wonder why?
waruikazi
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