Major pet supplier out of crickets !!!

[wokka]

how many petshops do you see with their crickets in contolled environment? It is not just a matter of breeding them. Transport and storage conditions influence survival.

 

[lizardwhisperer]

And how many lizards have been made sick or even killed by their carers buying a tub of second rate, sick, half dead crickets , mealworms or woodies and feeding what looks like the good insects from the tub (who have been eating their dead, mouldy or sick fellows) ?

Can't be too careful about food insect quality IMO.

I happen to know the local PB keeps their mealworms refigerated (but it's an open refrigerator and this results in mealworms dying in the tub and excessive humidity levels especially in warm wet weather). So I buy them elsewhere in the summer.

I also time my purchases of crickets to the same day the local PB takes delivery of new stock from Piscus. (Pays to ask the staff when this happens and only buy new stock.)

 

[Thyla]

Well i believe 25c is best for growth but i could be wrong.

I wouldn't normally bother correcting this but yes you are wrong, by a significant amount. It's much higher than this number. Because they are raised over generations and generations at these temperature, as soon as they are shipped out to pet shops and private homes, they struggle with the cold. It's a classic case of evolution. I also noticed a few years back that many crickets have really short back legs which i'm guessing is another result of the breeding conditions.

I'm surprised it hasn't already been said yet but the major suppliers will purchase large amounts of stock off each other when they are short themselves. They will repackage them, and sell them as their own (making a loss on them) to keep customers happy. It's a crazy world we live in...

 

[Rogue5861]

I wouldn't normally bother correcting this but yes you are wrong, by a significant amount. It's much higher than this number.

So how warm are they kept? I incubated eggs at 28-29c and would of thought temps would be somewhere between 25-35c, i havent really bothered breeding them as i only have frogs and geckos on them.

I find woodies are easier to breed and most species will accept them. Good range of sizes and will lay babies after 44days of being born.


Rick

 

[mcloughlin2]

And how many lizards have been made sick or even killed by their carers buying a tub of second rate, sick, half dead crickets , mealworms or woodies and feeding what looks like the good insects from the tub (who have been eating their dead, mouldy or sick fellows) ?

Can't be too careful about food insect quality IMO.

I happen to know the local PB keeps their mealworms refigerated (but it's an open refrigerator and this results in mealworms dying in the tub and excessive humidity levels especially in warm wet weather). So I buy them elsewhere in the summer.

I also time my purchases of crickets to the same day the local PB takes delivery of new stock from Piscus. (Pays to ask the staff when this happens and only buy new stock.)

I highly doubt any lizard has got sick from eating a half dead cricket/woody/mealworm let alone died.

 

[Thyla]

I can only speak for one major supplier/breeder. The temperature range was 28-36c depending on the crickets life stage. I cant remember what temps the eggs were incubated at but it was around the 31 mark.

 

[lizardwhisperer]

Who would pay for the additional cost of heating? I know with rodents many breeders cant be bothered spending the capital to keep rodents cool so as to maintain production in heat waves. After a heat wave many breeders lose their breeding herd and so a shortage develops in supply. The fair way to distribute the limited supply from the breeders who have invested in climate control, is then to look after the regular long term customers. I am assuming the same principle appleis to keeping insects warm. It is difficult to allow for demand whigh might occur and far easier to cater for regular demand.

Gets pretty warm in Queensland , excessive heat kills off crickets pretty quick.

So I'd think they are produced in a climate controlled (airconditioned room, cooled in summer, run in reverse cycle in winter) and the cost of this included in the price per tub and always has been.

 

[Cypher69]

I can only speak for one major supplier/breeder. The temperature range was 28-36c depending on the crickets life stage. I cant remember what temps the eggs were incubated at but it was around the 31 mark.

I don't mean to question your experience but LiveFoods Unlimited suggests a temp range of 20-25. They state a cooler temp range will extend their life expectancy & only offer heat during Winter.

 

[B_STATS]

Crickets from pet shops are usually gut loaded with cardboard.

 

[Cypher69]

Crickets from pet shops are usually gut loaded with cardboard.

So after hours, when no one's around, pet shop assistants are shoving cardboard down crickets' throats?

 

[B_STATS]

So after hours, when no one's around, pet shop assistants are shoving cardboard down crickets' throats?

Nah man they don't give them new food when they get them in so the things eat what they have which is usually the egg carton.

 

[mcloughlin2]

All fresh boxes of crickets/woodies will have a fresh piece of carrot in there as well as some form of gut loading in some cases. Even if they didn't they are packed and shipped and on the pet shop shelf in around about 48 hours hardly enough time to rid their bodies of useful nutrients and replace with cardboard.

 

[Thyla]

I don't mean to question your experience but LiveFoods Unlimited suggests a temp range of 20-25. They state a cooler temp range will extend their life expectancy & only offer heat during Winter.

Um yeah their business is to sell crickets. The more they can sell, the more profit they make. Do you think they would tell you how to breed them and all the ins and outs? Never. Suggesting a lower temperature will extend their life, but it can also cause them to die. Another breeder also suggests "on arrival, crickets should be kept in a cool area" and I laughed when I first read that.

Pet shops are hit and miss with feeding their crickets. Some will place fresh carrot inside every couple of days, and others wont, and in these tubs yes they will chew through some of the cardboard (and also eachother).

 

[Cypher69]

That's the thing about the "fresh carrot".
After years of buying crickets & being told,"just give them a carrot & they'll be fine..." it's only last week that I read & learned about the clotting agent, betacaratine, in carrots, from Ron's post.
A critical piece of information that most pet shops don't know about (much less pass to customers).

I often wondered why my crickets were dying & the fresh carrot I replaced the old one with, was left "untouched."

 

[andynic07]

Suggesting a lower temperature will extend their life, but it can also cause them to die.

Can you please explain what you mean by this statement because to me as the statement stands it seems to be a contradiction in terms and I am sure there is an explanation behind what you are saying.

 

[Cypher69]

Um yeah their business is to sell crickets. The more they can sell, the more profit they make. Do you think they would tell you how to breed them and all the ins and outs? Never. Suggesting a lower temperature will extend their life, but it can also cause them to die. Another breeder also suggests "on arrival, crickets should be kept in a cool area" and I laughed when I first read that.

Yes, of course it's their business to sell crickets...the more they sell, the more profit they make. However, if they didn't care for their customers, they wouldn't be openly giving out free-professional-advice in maintaining the longevity of the stock you buy off them. Ie: You'd be ordering from them not as often.

If they didn't care & was only in it for the money, then they wouldn't share free advice, forcing you to buy more from them, more often to replace your constantly dying stock.

Sorry but you're still being vague about what experience you have to base your opinions on.

 

[JrFear]

what brand were you getting ill call the supplier as i work in a petshop if you want? Pisces or bio supplies?

 

[B_STATS]

All fresh boxes of crickets/woodies will have a fresh piece of carrot in there as well as some form of gut loading in some cases. Even if they didn't they are packed and shipped and on the pet shop shelf in around about 48 hours hardly enough time to rid their bodies of useful nutrients and replace with cardboard.

I've bought plenty of crickets from pet stores with an old, withered piece of carrot and parts of the egg carton eaten away. But whatever.

 

[Thyla]

Can you please explain what you mean by this statement because to me as the statement stands it seems to be a contradiction in terms and I am sure there is an explanation behind what you are saying.

If you read my previous posts in this thread I mentioned what can happen when the temperatures get too low. I took them off heat for 20 minutes and had a few turn belly up. If I had kept them off the heat they would have most likely died. Surprising to me was that they could come back from this belly up state if you return them to heat.
So keeping them at cool temperatures will kill many of them (I don't know the specific way in which the cold kills them but it just does).

There is something I learnt at university about the lifespan of an organism. I cannot recall specific terms, but the concept, I have a decent grasp on, and it makes sense to me. It's an example of a trade off. Organisms have a finite amount of energy to use up. If it uses its energy up rapidly, then it will die at an earlier period than if it was energetically conservative.

So think about a female gecko who is encouraged to breed as much as possible year after year. This female will die sooner due to the amount of energy invested in producing eggs and young. If that same female kept separate and encouraged to not breed, then she would theoretically live a longer life (as she can invest this energy in maintaining cellular activity).

So by keeping crickets at lower temperatures, they should theoretically live longer than if they were kept at say, 32 celcius. At these temperature, they go through their life cycle at a much faster rate, including incubation, shedding, maturing and dying. These types of temperatures would be preferred by breeders because you are able to produce more stock in a shorter time period and would also require less space. But yes, it does cost a LOT of money to maintain these temperatures, particularly through winter.

 

[andynic07]

If you read my previous posts in this thread I mentioned what can happen when the temperatures get too low. I took them off heat for 20 minutes and had a few turn belly up. If I had kept them off the heat they would have most likely died. Surprising to me was that they could come back from this belly up state if you return them to heat.
So keeping them at cool temperatures will kill many of them (I don't know the specific way in which the cold kills them but it just does).

There is something I learnt at university about the lifespan of an organism. I cannot recall specific terms, but the concept, I have a decent grasp on, and it makes sense to me. It's an example of a trade off. Organisms have a finite amount of energy to use up. If it uses its energy up rapidly, then it will die at an earlier period than if it was energetically conservative.

So think about a female gecko who is encouraged to breed as much as possible year after year. This female will die sooner due to the amount of energy invested in producing eggs and young. If that same female kept separate and encouraged to not breed, then she would theoretically live a longer life (as she can invest this energy in maintaining cellular activity).

So by keeping crickets at lower temperatures, they should theoretically live longer than if they were kept at say, 32 celcius. At these temperature, they go through their life cycle at a much faster rate, including incubation, shedding, maturing and dying. These types of temperatures would be preferred by breeders because you are able to produce more stock in a shorter time period and would also require less space. But yes, it does cost a LOT of money to maintain these temperatures, particularly through winter.

I read all of your posts and understand what you are saying in them but still cannot see how a temperature that is low enough to kill a cricket can also extend its life. Are you trying to say that there is a temperature just above what will kill them that will prolong their life as they will not be expending energy but this temperature is below the ideal breeding temperature?