Movement of our herps... opinions please

[Hickson]

In NSW you are allowed to take your reptile to a Herp Society meeting.

Now, something that hasn't been considered: you want the law changed so you can take your snake or lizard to the beach, or friends, or work etc. Your snake won't bite, it's not stressed, and you think you're doing a service by introducing people to the wonderful world of reptiles.

But what about the idiot with venomous species? Or with the scrubby which can be a little snappy, but is usually OK when out of the cage?

Just because you and your friends will do the right thing doesn't mean everyone else will too. And lets face it - we all know some idiots who have herps.



Hix

 

[nuthn2do]

i did politely ask for this not to turn into one of those debates so this comment on this thread is irrelevant (so cant spell today) and congrats to everyone that has kept this civil woohoo!!! lol

Aslan i understand what ur saying but again wouldnt it be ur choice to come in contact with that person.... i dont really know how OPMV works so if u could enlighten me on how it is transmitted perhaps that could come into factor with my opinion...

How many dieases do we all carry everyday that could potentially effect the native population??? and would an outbreak of OPMV have as much effect on the natives than say a feral cat..... as i said i dont know much about OPMV i am genuinely asking a question...

thanks

How is it irrelevant and not civil?

 

[swingonthespiral]

hix i did mention that one my original post..... but yes it is a point.... but hopefully if theyre idiots the scrubby will eat them or the venomous ones will bite the idiot keepers lol

 

[swingonthespiral]

i didnt say that u werent being civil i was putting that in as a generalisation for everyone in the thread being so good...

and its was irrelevant because i did ask for it not to turn into a debate about handling etc so it is irrelevant in THIS THREAD!!!

cheers

 

[AnteUp]

Also what about people that have to move their herps? Not for showing off or taking out on day trips. Say hypothetically someone had to move away for uni, the herps can't stay there for the holidays as they wouldn't be cared for during that period, in the way of cleaning, food and water. So I think there should be a way to have split residences (?) on the licence.

 

[Hoppa1874]

yep thats another very relevant point anteup.. good one..

 

[swingonthespiral]

yeah definately.... i think that both anteup and croc penny have it right with other approved addresses etc....

 

[olivehydra]

i did politely ask for this not to turn into one of those debates so this comment on this thread is irrelevant (so cant spell today) and congrats to everyone that has kept this civil woohoo!!! lol

Aslan i understand what ur saying but again wouldnt it be ur choice to come in contact with that person.... i dont really know how OPMV works so if u could enlighten me on how it is transmitted perhaps that could come into factor with my opinion...

How many dieases do we all carry everyday that could potentially effect the native population??? and would an outbreak of OPMV have as much effect on the natives than say a feral cat..... as i said i dont know much about OPMV i am genuinely asking a question...

thanks

Problem with OPMV is that noone really knows how it is spread. Considering it can decimate private collections, I would say that an outbreak within wild snakes could make a feral cat seem, dare I say, innocuous in comparison.

 

[croc_hunter_penny]

If it was an add-on for your licence, then perhaps restricted animals (venomous) aren't allowed. There could also be a size restriction, for example the python must be under 3 metres in length. Also have something in there saying that you are liable for your animal, so that if someone is stupid enough to bring an animal that they know isn't safe (or that they don't know, but I am not sure how that would work :lol then if the reptile does attack someone, the licence-holder is liable and can be sued, etc.

And, like I said in a previous post, they could make it so that you can register an address for the animal to be transported to. I don't know about trips to the beach, but taking it to your mothers house or a particular mates place could be registered. and then you can register whatever animals to that address.

something like this:

Address 1: 17 Blah st, Brisbane 4000

Registered Species:
Amt | Common or scientific name | Length
x 2 | Bredli Python . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | 500mm
x 1 | Diamond Python . . . . . . . . . . . | 900mm
x 1 | Water Python . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | 1.2m
x 3 | Central Netted Dragon . . . . . .| 110mm SVL

____________________

Address 2: 42 Soandso ct, Brisbane 4010

Registered Species:
Amt | Common or scientific name | Length
x 2 | Bredli Python . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | 500mm
x 1 | Diamond Python . . . . . . . . . . . | 900mm
x 1 | Water Python . . . . . . . . . . . . . . | 1.2m
x 1 | Coastal Carpet Python . . . . . .| 2.5m


or something similar to that. I imagine you would also have a copy of it to carry with the animals in case you get pulled over.

 

[Mangles]

About a year ago the Qld Herp Society advised all of their members not to bring their animals to meetings unless they are selling the animals or if there was a specific issue they wanted advice on (such as having the snake probed, non-eating etc.). This was under advice from QPWS.

There were two reasons for this, firstly for health issues as previously discussed and secondly Public Liability issues. At a meeting last year a large Coastal bit a young boy of around 12 on the face, which obviously hurt and there was a lot of blood. Fortunately it was his fathers snake, and all the people around had the snake stressed and the boy stuck his head too close to the snake and wham.

Imagine the uproar if you had your snake out, especially a large one, in a public place showing it off and it bit somebody badly. I know dogs can do more damage but I can imagine the headlines in the paper. You would probably lose the snake if they complained. maybe your whole collection. Is this worth it?

It doesn't matter how much you trust your snake, if they are stressed they can strike out and bite, and an easy way to stress them is to take them out in public with people around.

I like showing my snakes off as much as anyone else, but only at my house, and whilst I trust my snakes I still make it clear they are wild animals and I cannot give a 100% guarantee they will not strike.

I can see both sides to the argument, but I believe leave the laws as they stand.

 

[gillsy]

There was recenlty someone on this website that was taking their 2m coastal the their childs school with permission from the school until the mention that it was illegal.

Imagine if it bit a child, we know its not going to do anything but there are some real funny people out there would then sue the school for allowing it, sue the parent for letting it bite their prescious little son/daughter and then you'd loose every animal you had.

People pay large amounts for exhibitors permits to do exactly what you want, inform the public who's to say we are to take their living away.

I have taken two snakes off premises before to get photos, but they were not around people and no one knew i had them there. Its your risk but I believe taking them around to 'show off' isn't the best reason for wanting to move the animal.

 

[croc_hunter_penny]

Perhaps you would need a letter of agreement from the property owner, so that you couldn't register public places or addresses.

Also, because I forgot to say it earlier, there should be something in the agreement saying that the licence-holder has to be with the reptiles at all times (so that you can't dump them off at a mates place who doesn't have a licence) unless the registered address also has a licence-holder.
Say I want to leave my snakes at my boyfriend's house for the weekend, but I have to work on Saturday. I couldn't take my snakes to work (unless I registered there too :lol and Dean has a licence so they can stay with him.

 

[croc_hunter_penny]

I don't know about taking it to schools or public places.. I suppose that would be the point of an exhibitors licence, and yes it probably would be taking away from their business.

I don't know if you were referring to my posts, but I am more talking about the convenience of being able to move them to one or two personal addresses (eg. my partner's and a close friend's house) for "private viewing" and not in a public place where unknown random people could potentially be injured and sue the licence-holder. Also talking about registering individual animals per address and have regulations on the size of animals and whether or not they are classified as "restricted".

 

[swingonthespiral]

I don't think anyone in here would be 'showing off' i think perhaps it was a wrong term used.... I dont "show off" with my snakes.... people are genuinely interested.... like when im heading to mums house and some kids walk past with thier parents and ask if they can have a look.

And yes i know that some people arent like that and you're gonna get ppl walkin around the main street just to get attention....

As for the public liability yes dogs would do more damage.... so thats why i stated before that if they were more "visable" within the public eye with adequate education perhaps the stigma attached to snakes would be changed....

We could only hope....

 

[croc_hunter_penny]

yeah sorry about that folks, I just couldn't think of a better term at the time. For the record I do NOT "show off" my snakes but my friends request that I come around (or that they can come here) so that they can see them because they are interested, and I like teaching them all about reptiles.

Let's not say "show off" any more :lol:

 

[geckodan]

The basic issue in Qld is that the "right" to move around and "display" and animal warrants an exhibitors licence not a recreational licence. Public display is specifically prohibited under the legislation of the recreational to stop cowboys wandering the shopping centres with 6ft pseudogenitalia wrapped around their necks i.e. the % of the herper world that has a reptile for ego accentuation and nothing else.

 

[croc_hunter_penny]

but what about the right to move it around to regular private places? eg uni to home, or partners place to parents place. Surely theres something that can be done about that?

 

[swingonthespiral]

forgot to mention croc penny that ur a smart cookie .... so is there anyway we can contact someone in regards to putting in a complain/suggestion.... ecoaccess are totally knobski's so i wouldnt even bother there.....

anyone know???

 

[Greebo]

Treating a python like a fashion accessory is wrong on so many levels. People in our hobby tend to forget that we are in the minority. The majority of the unwashed masses do not like snakes. They will look at them behind glass or on the television and that's fine. But the majority will freak out when they come face to face with a live snake. Taking a python down to the beach is not going to change these peoples attitude.This kind of irresponsible behaviour will only continue to give our hobby a bad name.

 

[swingonthespiral]

greebo im not takin my snakes down to "the strand" (main beach in townsville here... well if u could call it a beach).... im talkin out cape pallarenda where u are lucky to see another person 500m away and its usually a half blind fisherman anyway and its for a bit of sun (i have dogs so its easier for me to go accross the road then dodge doggies land mines in my back yard) and its never for more than about 10mins or so.... so to me thats being responsible and NOBODY ever referred to them as being fashion accesories and i do take offence to that...

And i have to disagree with you can prove that i have changed most people i have come into contact withs views on snakes just by holding a hatchie....