What is the point of a Licence

[Cabotinage]

for keeping non ven

like really whats the point is it just a money making thing they check what snakes you have once a year and you give them money? its not like there "dangerous" i can understand having a breeding licence like they jhave for dogs and cats but a licencee to keeping a native reptile it could be used to stop taking wild ones but the people thta do ahve wild caught ones DECC would never know?

 

[GeckoJosh]

Because if there was not a license system it would become the wild west and people would start poaching left right and center

 

[Cabotinage]

well they could anyway? just never buy a licence and DECC would never even have a clue not like they will do a random house inspection to a non licenced home they rarely do it to licenced homes anyway...

 

[moosenoose]

It allows you to become a target for the DSE Because without the license they'd never know you had reptiles! :lol: DOH!!!

 

[Holylemon]

Yes but if you dont you cant buy or sell reptiles from breeders, well breeders which show their licence anyway....

 

[Cabotinage]

but wouldnt it be easier to just can the licenece for non ven? i always here they dont have enoughman power to do anything anyway?

 

[Brent]

LIc.

These days we do need a control and a record of Reptiles being kept.
We need to have a Lic. system and legislation in place to cover the way we keep reptiles, -Consider animal ethics and the code of practise .

 

[jasonryles810]

Great topic, maybe we may be so gifted that DCC might jump in and shed some light on thier reasoning behind the licensing system and fauna record books. I know they do sniff around the forums from time to time...

 

[Parko]

So snotty little kids can legally get their rich daddy to buy them a green tree python for Chrissy, that's one reason. At least our Govt makes some effort to control mans greedy rape of nature.

 

[beatlloydy]

These days you need a licence for everything...a dog, a cat, herps etc...In NSW it is $120 for 5 years for as many class 1 reps as you want to keep. This is quite a reasonable fee. If you had 10 cats or 10 dogs..you would pay a lot more than that.

Licencing is a good idea to try and eliminate the black market...it is not the be all and end all but at least it tries to ensure a responsible trade in reptiles. No system is perfect but I agree with the current licencing laws in NSW..cant comment on other states.

NSW has a sliding scale of ownership and it is good that you just cant go out and get a Taipan on a basic licence...at least you need to demonstrate around 5+ years of experience to own one...to be honest...why is there a need to own Vens if you dont exhibit or demonstrate?

Perhaps we should all start taking responsibility for our actions and licencing costs, insurance etc would possibly decrease in all sports/hobbies. Until then, there will always be the blame game...it would be interesting to see how many keepers in other states who can own a Ven on a basic licence with little experience are bitten and how much it costs for the antivenom/treatment..cos I dont think this would be cheap.

We as taxpayers unfortunately have to subsidise idiots, be it in sport, on the road, adventurers etc. I vote for a user pays system and then that would be fair for all...the only exception to this would be that genuine people born with a physical/mental handicap should be exempt from user pays costs but if you brought that handicap on yourself then this should not be subsidised.

rant over.

 

[beeman]

"QUOTE Beatlloydy"
NSW has a sliding scale of ownership and it is good that you just cant go out and get a Taipan on a basic licence...at least you need to demonstrate around 5+ years of experience to own one...to be honest...why is there a need to own Vens if you dont exhibit or demonstrate?
___________________________________________________________

If you want to use that train though about those of us that have Vens then please justify
why you own 1 or 2 pythons?

 

[fritzi2009]

way to keep track of how many reptiles are being kept legally i guess

plus since its illgal to take reptiels from the wild, this way they have all yoru stuff on record. if you send your movement advice forms away properly when you buy or sell lol...

 

[fritzi2009]

well they could anyway? just never buy a licence and DECC would never even have a clue not like they will do a random house inspection to a non licenced home they rarely do it to licenced homes anyway...

Lots of people wont sell to you unless you have a licence. Then again I'm sure there are plenty of people who may...

 

[jack]

a need to own them? exhibit & demonstrate?
i exhibit a fascination for them, and demonstrate great care when handling my pets...

 

[ashisnothereman]

as beeman said in NSW you need 2 years experience before you can even get a class 2 licence, then you probably need more experience and 2 references from experienced keepers. so many people would get bit if they could just buy vens without this experience.. and i doubt health insurance covers antivenom which is pretty expensive i would imagine.

basically it prevents idiots and shows offs from getting venomous snakes and leaves it for the experienced, serious keepers.

and beeman owning vens opens up a large area of the hobby and there are a lot of beautiful snakes in the category. my favorite snake by far is a red belly and owning one would be awesome.

 

[beeman]

Ashisnothereman,
The top part of my post was part of what Beatlloydy
posted and i was wondering what justification he has for owning pythons
using his thinking that we shouldnt have vens unless we are exibiting or demonstrating

 

[junglepython2]

so many people would get bit if they could just buy vens without this experience.. and i doubt health insurance covers antivenom which is pretty expensive i would imagine.

basically it prevents idiots and shows offs from getting venomous snakes and leaves it for the experienced, serious keepers.

.

You need zero experience prior to owning vens in vic and I may be wrong, but I doubt our rate of bites is any higher then anywhere else.

 

[beatlloydy]

"QUOTE Beatlloydy"
NSW has a sliding scale of ownership and it is good that you just cant go out and get a Taipan on a basic licence...at least you need to demonstrate around 5+ years of experience to own one...to be honest...why is there a need to own Vens if you dont exhibit or demonstrate?
___________________________________________________________

If you want to use that train though about those of us that have Vens then please justify
why you own 1 or 2 pythons?

I am not anti Ven owning...each to their own...my pythons are relatively harmless and wont end me up in hospital costing the TAXPAYER thousands of dollars in hospital fees. As I stated, using a sliding scale of experience for ownership in NSW the theory is that you gain experience in lower order snakes building up to more dangerous vens. You cant go out on day 1 and purchase a TAIPAN on a basic licence.

I am not anti experienced owners having elapids but to me it is not worth the risk. I know with my "boring" pythons I can comfortably clean and upkeep their enclosure without risk of serious injury...not so with elapids..particularly the more aggressive variety.

I can see where the adrenalin rush would be for owning and keeping elapids would exist but for me there are other ways of me getting a thrill. I have friends who own them...one of them has them for demonstration and education purposes...several of these people have commented that if their jobs didnt rely on them they probably would not keep elapids as it is not worth the risk...but each to their own.

It would be such a boring world if we all agreed on everything and only kept the one species of animals/reps etc.

 

[beatlloydy]

You need zero experience prior to owning vens in vic and I may be wrong, but I doubt our rate of bites is any higher then anywhere else.

I have no stats on snakebites...I was told 6000 people a year are reported to hospitals for snakebites..this includes pythons and non venomous species...I read that approx 600 people a year require antivenom. Bearing in mind that there are probably quite a few people bitten by vens who are not envenomated (dry bite).

It would be interesting to see medical stats on Ven bites by keepers and a state by state breakdown. I cannot deny or agree to the statement that there are more or less keepers in Vic bitten but it could in theory be more likely due toa potential lack of experience in some new keepers.

I am a relatively new python keeper...and pythons from what I have seen are much slower than elapids at striking. My Darwin has bitten 3 times in one go one morning (and that was when the temp was low first thing in the morning and I was brand new at keeping)....I now know to not go near him until he is back at ideal temp range as he is a little cranky then and was also close to shed.

Had I been a young, reckless fool in Victoria (not saying all elapid keepers are fools) my first snake could have been an elapid and I could have been a statistic. You have to admit this hobby does attract a few cowboys and what better way to show off your testosterone but to brag to your mates you own the most venomous snake in the world. :lol:

To those keepers who own elapids and have never been bitten I take my hat off to you...I am far to chicken to do so and also know my limitations on a reaction/awareness scale are not up to speed to own an elapid...pythons scare me enough

This debate was on licences and I was just supporting the NSW system that works on gaining experience. I would personally like to see DECC become a nationwide controlling body. Far too much is left to the states and there is too much difference with respect to licences/health/education etc...Plus the states like to play the "blame game" against Federal governments. Having a national system of licencing (and health/education etc) would make things far more simpler for all involved. But again that is just my opinion. Many would disagree with me but thats your right in a democratic society.

 

[garycahill]

for keeping non ven

like really whats the point is it just a money making thing they check what snakes you have once a year and you give them money? its not like there "dangerous" i can understand having a breeding licence like they jhave for dogs and cats but a licencee to keeping a native reptile it could be used to stop taking wild ones but the people thta do ahve wild caught ones DECC would never know?

There is always some tight wad wanting something for nothing.
If you are not prepared to pay for the licence, don't own herps.
Just remember that owning herps is a privelege, not a right.