Sexing Boydii
Well there has been a heap of secrecy around the sexing of Boyds and that it is impossible to tell until maturity....I didn't have too much trouble at all, although when they are young it is almost impossible to see the difference except IMO, only by behaviour and the way that young males interact with each other. As they get older around 8-9months you can notice the 2 bulges of the hemipenes on the tail side of their vent. There are ways to pop the hemipenes, but I wouldn't recommend that and wont even say how its done, as i don't do it but have seen it done and in the hands of someone that hasn't done it before, you could do your dragon harm.
Another way to tell the difference between the sexes besides the obvious hemipenes, is the males have a boof head, much bigger and stockier than the females head, again as they reach up to that yearling mark you can tell the difference, this and their behaviour patterns in a group enclosure are signs to determine sex. If you only have 1 animal, it would obviously be hard to tell from their interaction with other animals, so it this instance, you need to observe the vent area and wait till they are around that 8-12 month age. If you feed your dragons well, they grow quicker and you can tell even earlier.
Attached pic is of a young male, where the hemipenes are starting to become visible.
Cheers for the response.
I was just asking about sulking as I don't want to tiptoe around my lounge room to avoid upsetting the Boyds.
I live in Cairns so heating won't be necessary and I should only need to supply a UV light that will be mounted externally above the enclosure. I am looking to setup a large display about 1800L x 900W x 1800H with a glass/aluminium frame and aluminium mesh for ventilation.
I ask about cooling during summer because my inside temps fluctuate from 25-32 degrees. The only way I could prevent exsposure to temps from 29-32 during the middle of the day is by running aircon.
Will checkout Superrain.
> Does the flush through system minimise waste odours?
Ed
Hi Ed,
The flush through system is not designed to eliminate waste odours really, although it does to a certain extent i guess, as any poo that's on the substrate breaks down and is flushed through and as a result, doesn't smell, so it does do that.
The main reason for this system is you can plant live plants and because it is watered regularly, it is moist and it keeps up the humidity. In Cairns, I don't think you'd have a problem with that, like we do in the Southern States, but IMO, this is getting the enclosure as close to their natural habitat, so it has to be good for their welfare, don't you think?
My idea of keeping animals is trying to mimic their habitat as close as we can get artificially, this way you get to see all the natural behaviours of the animal IF they are comfortable in their artificial home.
Hey guys since we have big viv's for the boyds and as it's so damp etc would it be possible to house frogs in the same viv?
I don't think they would try eating them if they were a decent size, do you think it could work?
Hi Funkstaa,
Frogs need a special viv as well as Boyds, but I would not suggest putting them in the same enclosure, i'm not sure that you see Boyds in the wild sitting next to a frog, so taking this into consideration, they both must have different specific habitats they live in. Needless to say, their habitats do overlap i'm sure, but definitely not in a small enclosure. To clarify, its not "so damp" that its wet, its moist and therefore humid, there is a difference.
Sexing Boydii
Well there has been a heap of secrecy around the sexing of Boyds and that it is impossible to tell until maturity....I didn't have too much trouble at all, although when they are young it is almost impossible to see the difference except IMO, only by behaviour and the way that young males interact with each other. As they get older around 8-9months you can notice the 2 bulges of the hemipenes on the tail side of their vent. There are ways to pop the hemipenes, but I wouldn't recommend that and wont even say how its done, as i don't do it but have seen it done and in the hands of someone that hasn't done it before, you could do your dragon harm.
Another way to tell the difference between the sexes besides the obvious hemipenes, is the males have a boof head, much bigger and stockier than the females head, again as they reach up to that yearling mark you can tell the difference, this and their behaviour patterns in a group enclosure are signs to determine sex. If you only have 1 animal, it would obviously be hard to tell from their interaction with other animals, so it this instance, you need to observe the vent area and wait till they are around that 8-12 month age. If you feed your dragons well, they grow quicker and you can tell even earlier.
Attached pic is of a young male, where the hemipenes are starting to become visible.
Cheers for the response.
I was just asking about sulking as I don't want to tiptoe around my lounge room to avoid upsetting the Boyds.
I live in Cairns so heating won't be necessary and I should only need to supply a UV light that will be mounted externally above the enclosure. I am looking to setup a large display about 1800L x 900W x 1800H with a glass/aluminium frame and aluminium mesh for ventilation.
I ask about cooling during summer because my inside temps fluctuate from 25-32 degrees. The only way I could prevent exsposure to temps from 29-32 during the middle of the day is by running aircon.
Will checkout Superrain.
> Does the flush through system minimise waste odours?
Ed
Hi Ed,
The flush through system is not designed to eliminate waste odours really, although it does to a certain extent i guess, as any poo that's on the substrate breaks down and is flushed through and as a result, doesn't smell, so it does do that.
The main reason for this system is you can plant live plants and because it is watered regularly, it is moist and it keeps up the humidity. In Cairns, I don't think you'd have a problem with that, like we do in the Southern States, but IMO, this is getting the enclosure as close to their natural habitat, so it has to be good for their welfare, don't you think?
My idea of keeping animals is trying to mimic their habitat as close as we can get artificially, this way you get to see all the natural behaviours of the animal IF they are comfortable in their artificial home.
Hey guys since we have big viv's for the boyds and as it's so damp etc would it be possible to house frogs in the same viv?
I don't think they would try eating them if they were a decent size, do you think it could work?
Hi Funkstaa,
Frogs need a special viv as well as Boyds, but I would not suggest putting them in the same enclosure, i'm not sure that you see Boyds in the wild sitting next to a frog, so taking this into consideration, they both must have different specific habitats they live in. Needless to say, their habitats do overlap i'm sure, but definitely not in a small enclosure. To clarify, its not "so damp" that its wet, its moist and therefore humid, there is a difference.
Breeding Boyds
Breeding Boyds, like most mature animals is pretty easy, once the sex is determined and you are sure you have a Male and a Female. At around 18+ months the male will start to head bob to the female and then make his move.
He is not the romantic type and bites the crest of the female, pins her down, aligns his vent with hers and inserts his hemipenes. A few seconds later its done!
Attached are some pics of the male in action as I believe these are pretty rare pics and I have never seen any pics of copulating Boyds before, but I have observed my animals for many hours and have been lucky to see this mating ritual on a few occasions which is fascinating, seeing the courtship and then the males attack. I have been able to tell when a male is going for some action by watching this different head bobs that they do, its faster than the one they do to show their dominance, or just are communicating with another Boyd.
If you witness a copulation, its pretty certain that you know your female will be gravid. IF you don't, how do you tell?
Females even when gravid aren't really that fat, they are a slim dragon to begin with and because they only lay between 2 and 6 eggs that are pretty small, they don't show excessive signs of being gravid. What I do notice though in females, is they go off their food when gravid and taking that into consideration plus looking at their abdomen, you can tell, or suspect that they may be gravid. Mind you I have missed this on some animals and they lay eggs, so it is sometimes difficult to tell and not an exact science as I have mentioned previously.
At around 4-5 weeks after a successful copulation, the female will start to hang around the bottom of the enclosure looking for a suitable nest site. I have seen gravid girls dig a few test holes but NOT lay, but interestingly, in the wild I have been told, that Boyds lay their eggs at the base of a tree, which seems logical and the best spot I agree, so the new bubs can scurry up the tree to avoid ground predators.
In my big enclosure I always place a patch of sphagnum moss approx 20x20cm under one of the trees/upright perches because of the above advice and it seems to work most times. 2 of my females have always laid in that moist sphagnum moss spot. Contrary to this I have found eggs in other spots of the enclosure so again it does change and is up to the female where she feels comfortable to lay.
I have UV lights set up on timers and have observed, which also seems an evolutionary trait, that the female lay just after dark...the dark giving them some cover to avoid predators while they are laying their eggs and are very vulnerable.
I have also witnessed this on a few occasions, which is a magic experience seeing them dig a hole lay their eggs and try and disguise the lay site as though nothing has happened.. Pics attached.
The trick now is to get the eggs out of the enclosure without mum seeing you. The female will be defensive for the first few hours and bite you if you try and dig her eggs out, but after a while she tends to forget or just goes about her life once again and now is the time to remove the eggs ready to pop in the incubator.
I have done an experiment taking the eggs, I actually had some white marbles, although round were similar size to the eggs and what I did was, as the female laid her eggs I grabbed them straight out and replaced them with the white marbles and she was happy with that and buried the marbles thinking they were her eggs....I tricked her good.. :lol:
What I do after the female has laid her eggs and because she hasn't eaten for a while, take her out of the enclosure into a separate one and start to feed her up again. I have seen males straight into copulating again and never leave the females alone to recover. I did have one female so harassed by the male trying to copulate with her straight after laying, that she nearly died. So my advice, take her out and give her some tender loving care for a few weeks as the males don't show them that respect.
Incubation
I have had 100% success rate with this method, but it doesn't mean its the only way to cook your Boyd eggs, as there are many different ways which has also been proven with snake eggs as we all know.I believe if something works for you then there's no reason to change it!
I get a click clack (or any other container you can get that has a lid) and make a vermiculite mix, so its damp but NOT wet, not sure of the ratio of water to vermiculite as I don't measure the ratio, but remember don't make it watery all the water must be absorbed by the vermiculite.
A test you can do is, if you can grad a handful of the vermiculite mix, squeeze out all excessive water (not too much pressure as you want it to be moist) and if it stays in that clump it in your hand that's good enough. If its too wet you will get mould and this will kill your eggs, too dry and the same will happen.
After i have the vermiculite mix sorted, I make a little divet or hole with my finger in the vermiculite mix, only about 5mm deep which I place the egg into, not so its standing upright, so its laying on its side. The hole should only be as deep as half the height of the egg., ie half the egg in the mix and half the egg above it. after placing all the eggs in the mix, so that they are spaces between, I then place a layer of moist sphagnum moss over the top of the eggs. Again not wet but moist and not too thick just enough to cover the eggs.
Cover them up and place in the incubator.
I was told by some wise old herpers that have bred Boyds for years and which I gained valuable knowledge first up before I did my own thing and experiment, was to incubate at 28C, cooler than snake eggs, which I have done consistently again & again and have had 100% success rate, so this temp works perfectly! Again there would be many variables and temps as we all know, but for this thread, its a guide that works well, so we don't need to discuss other ways really.
Even few days check on the dampness of the substrate and give the sphagnum moss a fine spray of water IF required and to let some fresh air into the container. If you do all of the above, in about 60-70 days the little bubs will start to emerge.
I have had some late arrivals even 2 weeks after the first to hatch, so just leave them in for longer if you have some that haven't hatched. You can tell if the eggs still OK, if it is not covered in mould, or doesn't smell and has swollen from its original size, all is still good inside and just wait it out, it will come out eventually.
Caring for the bubs next....