Thawing rodents...

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Pythoninfinite

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Following on from the thread about thawing rodents, I thought I might put some ideas into the system. Leaving intact animals (guts in) to thaw at room temp, or on a (just) warm spot overnight, or for more than a couple of hours is asking for food poisoning troubles at some time in your reptile-keeping career. Bacterial activity is very high in the guts of rodents, and can cause all sorts of problems, not always, but it's just not worth the risk.

Thawing in hot tap water for 20-30 mins, either in a bag or not, allows the animals to be fed without the time for bacterial breakdown to begin. Most snakes don't care whether the rodent is wet or dry, and in some cases the wet fur assists swallowing and aids hydration, especially in young snakes. Rodents properly frozen will not disintergrate using this method, when the animal breaks up it is always because it is partly rotten to begin with, either left a long time before freezing, or being stored at the wrong temp., sometimes for months (should be stored no higher than -15C if you want the quality to be maintained)

When large numbers of rodents are killed for food, people often place them in large numbers into bags then directly into the freezer. When the mass is large, and they can't freeze quickly because they're in a big lump, the ones inside the heap will partly decompose before they can freeze properly, and when thawed, they can fall apart very easily (and stink). Sealing too soon in plastic bags also assists in retaining body heat, it's always better to either let them cool naturally for 30 mins before bagging, or bag in one layer and place in iced water for 15 mins before freezing. This will ensure optimun quality, but from then on it depends on the efficiency of your freezer.

To test freshness after thawing, pull gently at the fur on the bellies of your rats & mice, if it comes away with some of the epidermis and exposes the underlying tissue, the animals has begun to decompose.

Rapid freeze, efficient storage, and rapid thaw is the way to go. And yes, microwaving can cause cause nasty explosions if not done carefully!!!

I was a professional taxidermist for over 30 years, so I've seen my fair share of fresh and decomposing animals. Rats and mice, both native and introduced, are prone to VERY rapid breakdown if not handled properly from the moment of death. Feed your herps the freshest food you can and you will minimise any ensuing problems.
 
wow, I think I am lucky. I have been feeing my snake the same way for over 10 years. Take rodent out of freezer, stick in ziplock bag until thawed, chuck to snake. I have never had any problems with them coming apart or being all yukky or whatever.
 
Well, that just shows you Nina, you can still learn something.
The thing here though is everyone says hot water.
What the hell is hot water, anything between 50 to 100 c. Needs to be more specific.
 
what am I learning?

well that's true, you dont want to cook the thing, so boiling would be too hot I think
 
i thaw in a cup wit ht water that the only way my fussy chlidrens will eat it hehe
 
Nice Pythoninfinite. I am learning something everyday.
 
If you have a large frozen rat in a container and then pour boiling water over it this won't cook the animal as it defrosts the rat and in most cases the boiling water will go cold from the rat not the rat cooking from the boiling water (If that makes sense)
Also I would think that boiling water would assist in killing any bad bacteria that the freezing process didn't and I can't see how leaving a frozen rodent out for 10+ hours at room temp could "improve" the quality of the feed, I would think that leaving a rodent out for this time would be quite dangerous.
I use the boiling water method on all my rodents and know other keepers who do the same and have never had a problem,Atleast this way I know that the food has not been tainted and that flies haven't had their way with the rodents.
Remember to always cool the rodent down before feeding
 
peterescue said:
Well, that just shows you Nina, you can still learn something.
The thing here though is everyone says hot water.
What the hell is hot water, anything between 50 to 100 c. Needs to be more specific.


i will be more specific, whatever the temp is that comes out of my tap :)
 
NinaPeas said:
what am I learning?

well that's true, you dont want to cook the thing, so boiling would be too hot I think

If you need to ask then obviously nothing.
 
Obviously a bit of common sense should prevail when considering temperature - I did say hot tap water, perhaps I should have said hot water from the tap...and I think this is usually around 50-60C. Anyway, it's not so hot that I can't put my hands into it. I simply use water from the tap which is about as hot as that which I use to wash dishes (and no, not in a dishwasher!) If I thaw a lot of rodents, I make the water pretty hot because the large number of carcases will cool the water down fairly quickly and it may even need to be refreshed with more hot water. If only a few mice, then it doesn't need to be very hot at all. Just make sure that the animals are fully defrosted before feeding - if you hold your thumb against the belly of the rodent for a moment and it begins to feel very cold, leave them a while longer.

Most of the common bacteria in a "slightly off" rodent will do little harm to a healthy reptile, and yes, some people get away with feeding rotting food for years, but the risk of a pathogenic bacteria causing regurgitation or enteritis exists, and may affect a snake or lizard with compromised health, or begin the process of compromising the health of a healthy animal. I wouldn't be prepared to take that risk, and I think we should all strive to feed any animal in our care the very best and freshest food possible. Certainly snakes are known to eat carrion in the wild, but a meal missed may be the only one for months, in MOST cases snakes eat their prey within minutes of its death, you can't get fresher than that!
 
i get a container and fill it with as many rats as i can fit and pour boiling water straight out of the jug over the top of them.
When the water cools i tong them out and pad them down a little, then feed . salt to taste mmmmm
 
I have found that boiling water makes them fall apart. I just use hot tap water let sit for about 10 minutes, empty water out and put in hot water again for another 10 minutes, pad dry and feed. I like to give the rat to them while its still warm because sometime they bite me instead.
 
I have found that if you use boiling water it speeds up the digestion of the food, not by much but by a little.
 
I think we should all strive to feed any animal in our care the very best and freshest food possible
Just wanted to be sure this part was read.
 
i did the freezin rong i put about 13 10cm rats into a zip lock freezer nag at the same time, so is my whole lot off now? cos it the first 1 out of the 6 ive used so far hmmmmm
 
I do the same as a few of you except with a variation. My Rats dont come into contact with the hot water...I sit a few of them in a container....floating the container on some hot tap water held in the sink.... I do change this 2-3 times to get the rat defrosted and nice and warm... never had any smelly ones...nor any that lose their fur.... I could almost eat them...:p....;p;
 
I use hot water straight out of the tap too. So does my son when he makes my coffee (and feels lazy) :x
 
Good thread Aussiesnakelover. Just try the quick thaw in hot water, for about 20 mins, then check their bellies (pull the fur gently) and if it comes off it's probably a bit off. Smell is another guide, but dead rodents can smell a bit funny anyway... even if fresh.

Another sign of freshness is if there is still some rigour (stiffness) in the rodent, it means it was probably fresh when frozen, and froze fairly quickly. Rigour mortis disappears in a few hours after death, but not if the animal is frozen.
Cheers.
 
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