Woma Python Heating - Cant get cage above 25-26 (hot spot)

Discussion in 'Herp Help' started by steverokh, Jun 12, 2016.

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  1. steverokh

    steverokh Not so new Member

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    Hi All,

    This is my first snake (who I actually pick up tomorrow) which is a 7 month old De Grey Woma Python. My current enclosure is a glass reptileone 90x60x60cm cage and i've been struggling to get the basking spot over 26 degrees. I have a 150w ceramic heater with a reflector dome sitting at the top of the enclosure.

    I know its winter and my ambient temperature in my current home is about.. 10-15 degrees on any given day (shes cold! central coast NSW!) - See pick of my setup below (please ignore the other white ceramic lamp, thats a spot for my UV Bulb, but I am trying to heat up the cage before I get my Woma). Which If i have this heating lamp on (the white) it'll heat up the left side to about 30-32 degrees..

    20160612_094652.jpg 20160612_094640.jpg

    Any suggestions? I know by the time it heats up to the not so cold months i wont have too much of an issue... so hoping to grab some thoughts of the experienced!
     
  2. Ekans

    Ekans Not so new Member

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    You will be losing a lot of heat through the glass and the main culprit will be the mesh top both which will effect your hot spot. You could try insulating the tank by lining the sides with styrofoam and placing something over the mesh.

    I'm not sure why they sell glass enclosures for anything over than humidity loving species. The forum needs a recommended set up section compiled for each species lol this in't a jab at you :) it's just a very common question and usually a glass tank is being used
     
  3. steverokh

    steverokh Not so new Member

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    Yeah i've red that I could put some foil on top which I might try, and also i have foam as the backdrop, it would probably be a good idea to get foam for the sides too instaed of the hanging leaves (which do nothing). I've seen loads of woma python setups the same as mine, though im just guessing because its about 10-12 degrees in my house and how high the enclosure is, that heat is going to be lost...

    It still heats up to about 27.5 degrees on top of the left hand side (of the hide).

    Would 27.5 degrees and 20-22 degrees on the cooler side be OK for winter for a woma python? Or should i invest in a small heating pad?
     
  4. nonamesleft

    nonamesleft Active Member

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    Ditch the lamp and use a heat pad or chord. Put a nice insulated hide over the top to create a micro climate of sorts. The hide will be nice and cozy and does no matter what the ambient temp is on the outside.

    Also if you aren't cooling the snake there is no need to lower the temp, especially if you are still feeding.

    If you do my above suggest aim for a floor temp of approx 35 degrees, remember where this snake if from,
     
  5. steverokh

    steverokh Not so new Member

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    so much $$$ wasted on the lamp and the 150w bulbs -_- would you recommend a good heat cord or heat pad ?
     
  6. Ekans

    Ekans Not so new Member

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    Yeah there is nothing wrong with keeping reptiles in glass enclosures, just makes it harder to keep temperatures up. If you insulate it you won't have wasted money on the lamp, during summer you can just remove the foam.

    Don't forget you will definitely want a thermostat with a heat mat/cord. Ideally you should use one for both types of heating but with a heat mat you can't really afford to not use one.
     
  7. steverokh

    steverokh Not so new Member

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    I can get the basking spot to 35 degrees with the 150 w bulb if i just put it closer, obviously the heat is losing its gas the further down the enclosure is.. annoying but what can you do! i might just either insulate it or create a higher basking spot by just putting some foam beneath half of the enclosure...

    - - - Updated - - -

    Also seeing as its winter, a few degrees below their normal 31-33 degrees basking spot should be OK right? (currently I can get it to 28 if i leave it in the normal position, or 35 degrees) - which would be better for the snake?
     
  8. Ramsayi

    Ramsayi Very Well-Known Member APS Veteran

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    Insulate and reduce the ventilation.
    150W bulb is ridiculous in a cage that size.

    As an example I run 50w per enclosure which measure 1200 x 800 x 600mm
     
  9. steverokh

    steverokh Not so new Member

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    ridiculous though i still cant get it to heat properly :( assuming your enclosure is not fully glass ? hows yours built?

    So reducing ventilation with just foil on top of the top grate?
     
  10. Ekans

    Ekans Not so new Member

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    My woma is brumating at the moment and I'm based in Sydney, he has brumated the past winter as well and he was fine, your guy will be fine with slightly lower temps

    Although I will add that temperature affects digestion so not too low or you run the risk of him regurgitating or not digesting properly although he might let you know if it's too cold for eating :)
     
  11. steverokh

    steverokh Not so new Member

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    well on top of the basking spot right now (when its 11 degrees inside my room) its 28.5 degrees. I will get some insulation for the sides tomorrow and see how that goes. I have foil over the top grate aswell.
     
  12. Wokka

    Wokka Well-Known Member APS Veteran

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    Over a year there are ballpark 9000 hours which will consume say 1,350,000 watts of power running a 150 watt bulb. At an average cost of say 30 cents /1000 watts that is an operating cost of $400 each and every year you run that bulb, so don't worry about the few dollars spent on purchasing the bulbs! A matt will cost about $50 to buy and use about 20% of the power used by a bulb, saving say $350 in the first year, not to mention the reduction in greenhouse gases from reduced electricity consumption. I agree that glass tanks are not ideal to keep reptiles in in terms of operating costs but they are cheap to build and look pretty. It is a shame that newbies go to the pet shop first, and here second, and that many buyers don't pay the cost of electricity and so are only concerned with the initial cage cost.
    It is alarming when you think how many reptile tanks are out there and in turn how much electricity is being wasted, accelerating the demise of our planet. I heard this morning the Libs are offering billions to fix the barrier reef. An alternative is to think before you create the problem and save all those fix up costs.
     
    Last edited: Jun 13, 2016
  13. pythoninfinite

    pythoninfinite Subscriber Subscriber

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    Foil will not be the best insulator - it will stop convective heat loss but it's metal and it will just conduct the heat straight through it. You need something more substantial to stop the heat escaping - plywood or foam. If you run the temps at the high twenties that you suggest may be OK for winter - you're asking for serious problems. The temperature is not hot enough to elevate the metabolic processes satisfactorily, but it's not cool enough to allow brumation, so the snake will have a compromised immune system and all the complications the may bring. You need it to be one thing or the other - either warm enough for the animal to remain fully functional (and feeding), or to shut down for the winter. Getting a snake (presumably a youngster) at this time of year should dictate that you keep it active and feeding through at least its first winter with you, as I can assume it is currently fully active from wherever you're getting it. As much as possible you need to replicate the circumstance in which it is currently being kept in your own enclosure, bringing it from a warm environment to a new one which is cooler overnight and remains cooler is potentially harmful.

    Bottom heat with maybe a 15W heat cord under a section of the cage floor is probably the best way to go. If it was a Carpet Python you could simply put a branch up near the heat, but Womas are not natural climbers, so a warm patch on the floor is much more suitable. It looks like you've been given some dud advice about the setup - did you get the gear from a pet shop? Many of them have a vested interest in flogging as much stuff as possible regardless of its usefulness.

    Jamie
     
  14. jsmith

    jsmith Not so new Member

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    i would suggest getting a heat mat/pad
    with a substrate they can dig into.
    if you did want to buy a mat. install the bulb inside the tank through the mesh the difference in temp will suprise you. just ensure you have a cage over the bulb.

    Sent from my SM-N920I using Tapatalk
     
  15. steverokh

    steverokh Not so new Member

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    I went to bunnings and bought some 30mm thick insulation and just stuck it on the outside of the glass. Temps are 31-33 degrees give or take when i open the cage or open the door to my bedroom. I'd rather have a ceramic heat bulb than a heat mat, I just dont trust heat mats at all. After winter is over I can always switch to a 50-75W bulb and go from there...

    I did buy the enclosure from a pet store (it was $120 on sale, for a 90x60x45cm enclosure, cant complain with that one) but the rest I bought off online after doing a bucketload of research. If I had $1000s of dollars to spend, then i'd get everything from the pet shop lol. I'll see how my first electricity bill goes and maybe switch to a heat pad afterwards. - If so what would be a good heat pad recommendation? I see everyone pointing to a heat pad but no recommendations yet
     
  16. pythoninfinite

    pythoninfinite Subscriber Subscriber

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    I never recommend heat mats - I've seen too many scorched tabletops from even the lowest wattage mats when used incorrectly. A 15 or 25 watt heat cord sandwiched between two ceramic floor tiles (about 300mmx300mm size) is a great way to provide heat for a medium sized python. Cheap to buy and run, bullet proof, and most pythons love belly heat.

    Jamie
     
  17. jsmith

    jsmith Not so new Member

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    i use a 'reptile one' branded one. has a built in cut off switch which i have run through a surge protected power board.

    Sent from my SM-N920I using Tapatalk
     
  18. steverokh

    steverokh Not so new Member

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    Im going to downsize to a 50 or 75W bulb, and place the bulb inside the enclosure with a cage. It'll get it alot closer to the cage and I will also put a piece of plywood or even some more insulation on top of the cage (with a few small holes for air flow) and see how that goes.

    At the moment my 150W bulb is doing well.. my temperature room is 15 degrees and the hot spot (55cm under the light - along way to travel) is about 31-32 degrees. I get to move it about 15-20cm closer with the cage and be able to downsize to a smaller bulb - should continue to do the trick. When winter rolls around again I can just swap to the 150W bulb and see how that goes!

    Should that fail in a week or two (hoping not, taking advice of others here, with insulation, place bulb down further) i'll look at getting a 15W heat cord and some cheap ceramic tiles to lay it between.

    Thanks again for all the help, Homer the Woma is very active, explored for about 1.5 hours when I got him in the enclosure, and is now happy basking at 31.5 degrees!
     
  19. cagey

    cagey Subscriber Subscriber

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    To save yourself some money go to the top of this page; click on the SPONSORS tab and scroll down to find a list of Reptile Supply Stores.

    PS; I also have a woma - great choice
     
  20. steverokh

    steverokh Not so new Member

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    Yeah i've bought most of my supplies from the sponsors listed here! :)

    Thanks, hes really a cool snake. Hes 7 months old - is a De Grey Woma (Much smaller than a tanami or a brody) - get to about 1-1.2m. So pretty good for a first time snake owner.
    [MENTION=24657]cagey[/MENTION] - Another question I have is how long should I wait before attempting to handle? I've tried twice and hes not showed any sort of aggression but has slithered away very quickly. So i've just left him to his own devices. The breeder who I bought off was really informative, and said I should either wait a day or feed him now and wait a few days. Thoughts?
     
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