How long nose to tail are newborn baby Eastern Water Skinks ?

[ianinoz]

With all the visitors today, Lizzy decided to spend the day outside in the front flower bed and on my front patio (spotted her soaking up the sun on the bricks next to the steps about 20mins after the last of the visitors left). She aways makes herself scarce when we have visitors (often not coming back for a day or two).. Was definitely Lizzy , her markings are quite unique as is her regenerating/regenerated tail.

Don't blame her, was a lovely warm and sunny day today for Dad's Day.

And to my surprise on the bricks on the otherside of the steps I saw a little skink about 1 3/4" to 2" long that on closer examination had the unmistakeable patterns along it's side of an EWS. (Initially though it was a common brown skink).

What a little cutey.... grabbed the camera and tripod in the hope of getting a macro photo of the baby EWS but I saw Lizzy disappear over the edge of the bricks to go under the house as I was walking towards the front security screen door with my camera and the baby EWS almost immediately did the same thing (following Lizzy ??? or saw me coming and was frightened by me ??) , so I didn't get a photo.

If Lizzy was already pregnant a few weeks ago - no idea how far along - surely it's too soon for this baby EWS to be one of Lizzy's babies ????

 

[GeckoJosh]

ITs very early in the season for her to give birth, maybe one of last years?

 

[ianinoz]

False alarm

Would a baby EWS that small survive winter (hardly any bugs to eat for 3 -4 months) ? (yes I know the little brown skinks are about 3 - 4" long and they manage.)

But yeh , that's what I was thinking too, but then Lizzy came out of brumation looking fatter than she was the lsat time I saw her before she retired for the winter , so she was either pregnant because she found a perfect habitat for her to be so (inside my house with a softy like me to feed her when the bugs disappeared, or she had a feast on all the roaches that bred up while she was asleep when she woke up with a whole to fill in her stomache).
'
Is this just wishful thinking on my behalf perhaps or is she a cleaver Lizzy who has stolen a march on the other female EWSs who live undermy house and in my garden by getting pregnant early ?


I was thinking a pregnancy of maybe 3 months so I didn't expect her to give birth for several more weeks.

APPENDUM 5-SEP


False alarm and wishful thinking on my part....silly me.
.
Lizzy's back inside and looks just as plump as before, just in time for lunch, offered her a nice wrigglely mealworm but she just looked at me .... "that's not a cricket " and gave up on me , she's very frisky now she's'swarmed up and she's is back on the hunt - and been checking out all the usual bug / roach hides under the furnature and then discovered the front door was open and she had access to the little hole in the bottom of the flyscreen in the security door and she's now outside again and soaking up the sun on the bricks next to the front steps..

She's got the best of both worlds.

Maybe the baby EWS was one from last summer. (Still was a VERY CUTE little guy.)

 

[book]

The size EWS you describe would be a new born from this year. They are about 50mm total length, about half of that being the tail.
Pregnancy is a little over two months and it is possible for some to be giving birth this early.
Last year I had one of my females give birth to a single healthy baby late August, mate again and produce another 9 babies early in November. That same female is looking like giving birth again any day now.
I also had a first time mother produce 4 babies mid August this year. It would be much harder on them to get enough warmth for the developing offspring starting this early. She was in an outdoor pit till I moved her inside once she was clearly pregnant. All 4 where very weak and none survived for very long.

 

[GeckoJosh]

The size EWS you describe would be a new born from this year. They are about 50mm total length, about half of that being the tail.
Pregnancy is a little over two months and it is possible for some to be giving birth this early.
Last year I had one of my females give birth to a single healthy baby late August, mate again and produce another 9 babies early in November. That same female is looking like giving birth again any day now.
I also had a first time mother produce 4 babies mid August this year. It would be much harder on them to get enough warmth for the developing offspring starting this early. She was in an outdoor pit till I moved her inside once she was clearly pregnant. All 4 where very weak and none survived for very long.

Newcastle and Bundaberg temps are quite different, we are only just starting to have warm days

 

[book]

Newcastle and Bundaberg temps are quite different, we are only just starting to have warm days

True, but still possible given how early they can start here. Much more likely an EWS the size of a new born in Newcastle on Fathers Day is a new born rather than surviving over winter at that size.

 

[ianinoz]

Newcastle and Bundaberg temps are quite different, we are only just starting to have warm days

Thanks for the information. Looks like I was right . It's Lizzy's baby.

Lizzy is very spoilt, she spends most her time (unless it's nice and sunny and warm) living and sleeping inside our home (in particular our lounge room where it's always warm (I run the aircon continuously in the cool months , set to 27C during the day , 24C overnight and she makes the most of it, basking in the warm air that I direct down towards the floor and the lounge and she LUVs hanging out often for hours there or on our modem's transformer , runs at 36C (I'm told that's perfect temp for her).
So she's got a nice warm environment inside with us, she's been reluctant to go outside until this weekend when I spotted her and the baby (her's ?) outside taking advantage of the warmth in the sun and in the trapped heat in my concrete and brick patio.
Been quite warm here this last week and she's been spending a lot of time outside, still visits with me each day about lunchtime (Lizzy is a late sleeper) when she shows up, gets onto the transformer for a while , maybe gets a worm or bug or a pupa or some other treat from me, then she does her own thing.
I've even seen her go through the little hole in the flyscreen and then hird her and saw her coming back inside througn the same hole. (Hole has been there for years - from when we had a cat and I've been too lazy to fix it, probably how she got inside in the first place, she also comes inside and out via some coax cable holes in the floors and from the back door (laundry somehow - via the floor waste ??).

She has also been very well fed by me, lots of worms, crickets, and other food treats.

Do they get really thirsty and hungry when they are ready to give birth ?
Lizzy did get exceptionally thirsty in the last week, I put it down to really loving her new luxurous lunch box lid bath/pool.
She was particularly hungry late last week (kept begging me for more and more food) , not so hungry this week (I've run out of crickets and I think she's holding out for a cricket).

I have not seen her outside colony-mates (the other EWS's who live under the house and in my yard yet this spring) until the last couple of days when I saw the big cheaky EWS male who lives in my garage glaring at me this afternoon.

The size of 2" for a newborn EWS matches perfectly for the little EWS I spotted to be a new born. Guess that makes me a foster grandpop to the baby I saw .... was a very pretty and cute little lizard. Not seen the baby inside (yet) wonder if I should leave some little treats laying about for it outside (but hidden from easy spotting by the minnor birds, magpies and other freeloaders ? - I think it hides in the flower bed and I've been hearing it moving about and through the gun tree leaves that are along the bricks).

I'm rambling.... I'm very pleased. And quite proud of Lizzy for giving birth to such a beautiful baby.

 

[PeppersGirl]

Aaaw! Going to try and befriend the little one as well? They never forget their people, not for years!

 

[ianinoz]

Aaaw! Going to try and befriend the little one as well? They never forget their people, not for years!

You Bet !!

Hopefully it'll see Lizzy likes and trusts me and it'll easier with the baby.

I want to try to get some good macro-photos of the baby in the next week or 2 , if I see it. I've been hearing it russling about in the leaves on the patio on a daily basis. Not seen it again since and it's not followed Lizzy back inside (not seen it inside).
Do the EWS babies come back to sleep with their mothers ?

I think Lizzys "nest" is behind the corner unit - I heard her rustling about there most days and even at night sometimes.

 

[PeppersGirl]

I've noticed the southerns actually appear to stick close to their mother's territory for a little while, but I don't think they curl up with them.

Just be careful with the camera, to the little guys any small movement you make is a lot bigger - try not to tower over him at first

 

[ianinoz]

I've noticed the southerns actually appear to stick close to their mother's territory for a little while, but I don't think they curl up with them.

Just be careful with the camera, to the little guys any small movement you make is a lot bigger - try not to tower over him at first

Lizzy was very skittish originally, would scurry away when she saw us coming into the same room. I can imagine how a big guy would look to a little baby AWS.

If I'm lucky enough to see the little AWS again, and maybe it's siblings if it has any in the next week or two I'll probably move very quietly and slowly and sit quietly on one of my patio chairs, the bricks surrounding the flowerbed or on the steps and just watch it and try to get it used to seeing me around and show it I'm not going to try to hurt or catch it.
Pretty much how I started with Lizzy, only I'd sit quietly on the lounge chair and watch it , then I started quietly talking to her and then when I knew Lizzy was watching me I started putting little food offerings where Lizzy could see them and slowly built up the trust she had in me.

I now think Lizzy actually likes me and enjoys being near me and she expresses this by taking food treats off me from my fingertips and hand and by letting me sometimes have physical contact with her by handsurfing her and by gentlely tickling her under the chin (she assumes the positon and seems to really enjoy it) and by gently stroking the side of her head/neck and flanks, she is sometimes OK with this.

I've plenty of patience and will let things develop with the Lizzy's baby/s at their own rate.

I've found a use for the empty small Roses Chocs box that I saved from when I got then as BD pressent, I'll put it in the flower bed and put some dead leaves in it and overtop of it - maybe the baby EWS will find it and use it as a hide and somewhere to go that it'll feel secure and protected in.

I'll keep my camera set up on the tripod and with stock macrolens on it and the TC remote cable ready to go. This way I take some photos without "towering over" the baby EWS.

If I get any photos of the newborn baby EWS I'll post them. Wish me luck.

 

[PeppersGirl]

Sounds like a plan Good luck!

 

[ianinoz]

Lizzy's just had a big guzzle of water, a bit of sunbake, then decided she was peckish
.
No sign of her baby today (yet) inside or outside on the patio (that notices yet today.


The little MT Roses Chocs box has been taped up and made more water proof and placed in the flower bed with a far bit of dead gumtree leaves over it and some inside it. One outside hide provided , all it needs now is a resident baby EWS to find it and use it.

I've also used the see-thro' plastic from a Duracell AAA battery packet to make a little food treat tray for outside and the lid off a strawberry punnet (cut a hole in 2 opposite end of it to let lizards in but not let the birds knick the dead insects), I've staked it down with trigs so the minnor birds can't flip it off and it wont blow away in the breeze.

Just hand fed Lizzy who came up to just now and gave me the "I'm hungry" look, been a few days since I handfed her, so I gave some food treats to her by hand, no tickles and stroking permitted today, and she does look not as plump as a couple of weeks ago.

2 meal worms satisfied her, and she's gone to back to the front door and was sunning herself (it's a lit cool outside in the breeze today even if it's very sunny) and was looking outside but has decided to stay inside and returned to her nice toasty warm spot n the modem transformer and in the direct path of the warm air from the A/c. Looks like she's going to hang out there and with me for while.

More food layed out for her on a Duracell AA packet display lid (a couple of fresh new meal worm pupae and a couple of freshly dead (still soft) deformed meal worm beetles. She knows it's there, but just wants to loaf about now and watch me.

So content and comfy , hung out with me for over 2 hours (mostly various some very precarious positions in the head of the lounge - looked like she'd fall off her perch a few times when she'd dozed off , and was having the leg twitchy thing going on with her eyes closed (wonder what she was dreaming about ?)..

addendum 8-sep

Saw the baby EWS just a few minutes ago sunning itself on my front patio.

Scurried away too quick for me to unlock the security screen door, get outside with the camera on tripod and get a quick happy snap.... these little guys really move quick !!!
Lizzy was foraging about in my front jungle (lawn) not far away from the baby and she saw me and wasn't the least bit bothered by my being very nearby. Then the teenage boy from next-door came over and Lizzy spotted him coming and scurried away . .... LOL ... she's not keen on strangers.

My wife tells me she watched Lizzy take a bath and then a really big drink while I was at the dentist (says she looked very funny sitting there on her tail and leaning over to take a mouthful of water every so often).

 

[ianinoz]

Addendum 11sep
The baby EWS was on the bricks for a few minutes - I saw it through my front window - gone by the time I got the front door open.... so shy.

Checked the food dish I left for it in the flowerbed and all the dead mealworm lavae, pupae and some dead beetles except one where gone. I guess the baby EWS has found it and had a few feeds from it. The big male EWS and Lizzy are too big to get into the dish through the openings I made in the plastic cover.

Wouldn't be surprised if the baby EWS was watching me check it and putting more bugs into it.