The Death Sentence

[slim6y]

So far I would like to comment on how clean you've all kept it (there's still time though). And secondly some very insightful comments... I only wish I had put a poll up now to see how divided we are on this subject.

Forensick... USA isn't the only capital punisher in the world. But I am unsure exactly of crime rates in China, Korea (I think north) and other severe penalty capitalisers. But the US has other problems. With freedom (or so called) comes responsibility - and their constitution allows for it.

The next thing is the cost. What costs are associated with the death penalty in the long term?

I did a quick year 11 study on how much it costs (in electrcity) to electrocute someone in the clinical method. It's like less than a cent!!! It's obviosly not the sodium pentalthate (sp??) or the electricity that costs, but what are the costs?

If it costs Hudson $100 000 per year to be in jail then surely the $2million it costs by time he''s out will be well and truley recovered if we let him top himself!

Yes, many of you see this as a way out. I personally see it as a blessing in disguise.

If Hudson topped himself there will be no more killing (on his behalf). I can guarantee if he gets out in 14 years within 4 months of his release he'll be either back behind bars or will have killed more.

My opinion would suggest he can not be rehibilatated.

But - I also think we're lucky he turned himself in and didn't go all Port Arthur on us - a man with a gun in one of Aussie's largest cities could have done way worse.

The eye for an eye thing... Has it's merits - but that type of savagery went out with the dark ages. Although kiddie fiddlers deserve castration for sure (as do rapists). But do murderers deserve human rights?

 

[MoreliaMatt]

slimy, i beleive also that we should just let him out of jail! let him run free!
i guarantee that the only reason he turned himself in was for his own safety! he wouldnt last 30 mins in the real world anymore! the Hells Angels want him for portraying a bad image for them and the Rebels want him because he has a Rebels tattoo on his arm and in turn giving them a bad name too.... they have threatened to find him and cut the tattoo out of his arm!

with both the hells angels and the rebels out to get him he simply wouldnt last long!

i say let him out! and let them (the HA and the rebels) deal with him!!!!!

 

[wardy]

I read somewere that it costs aprox 2mil to kill a person and only 75g to keep them alive for life in prison.

 

[nickamon]

Wow, touchy subject. *hands out popcorn*

My two cents for the controversy: I am against the death penalty. State-sanctioned murder is still murder. It's cruel and uncivilised. It's 2007 and it disgusts me that it's still happening in the world. (PS: I am an atheist. I'm not saying all of this because of a sense of Christian love and compassion for my fellow man. I just think the "two wrongs make a right" attitude is a sick one.)

The US doesn't even carry out death penalties correctly. I read ages ago that a study had found that in lethal injection executions, the prisoner isn't always given enough sedative, so there's a chance they're awake and aware while they're being injected with the drugs that kill them. Hanging doesn't always work the first time, ditto electrocution. Firing squads are cruel to the people on both ends of the gun. Guillotining is just plain gross. Gas chambers are cruel too - it can take around 30 minutes for someone to die in one.

As for the prisoner commiting suicide in jail, if it's his own choice? Aren't the jails so awful that suicide would be a better option? Your life is your own, and if you want to end it, that should be your choice.

 

[nuthn2do]

slimy, i beleive also that we should just let him out of jail! let him run free!
i guarantee that the only reason he turned himself in was for his own safety! he wouldnt last 30 mins in the real world anymore! the Hells Angels want him for portraying a bad image for them and the Rebels want him because he has a Rebels tattoo on his arm and in turn giving them a bad name too.... they have threatened to find him and cut the tattoo out of his arm!

with both the hells angels and the rebels out to get him he simply wouldnt last long!

i say let him out! and let them (the HA and the rebels) deal with him!!!!!

Wherever he goes he's not likely to see too many more birthdays without protective custody.

 

[Heapy22]

personally i dont have a lot of respect for the human race and as such could quite happily take him out myself to me people = ******* and those that do things that make the majority of the human race look down upon them deserve their death and then should be buried face down in several places (obviously cut up) animals show far better examples of how to live than humans ever do JMO but i wouldnt be human if i had a choice

 

[Midol]

So far I would like to comment on how clean you've all kept it (there's still time though). And secondly some very insightful comments... I only wish I had put a poll up now to see how divided we are on this subject.

Forensick... USA isn't the only capital punisher in the world. But I am unsure exactly of crime rates in China, Korea (I think north) and other severe penalty capitalisers. But the US has other problems. With freedom (or so called) comes responsibility - and their constitution allows for it.

The next thing is the cost. What costs are associated with the death penalty in the long term?

I did a quick year 11 study on how much it costs (in electrcity) to electrocute someone in the clinical method. It's like less than a cent!!! It's obviosly not the sodium pentalthate (sp??) or the electricity that costs, but what are the costs?

If it costs Hudson $100 000 per year to be in jail then surely the $2million it costs by time he''s out will be well and truley recovered if we let him top himself!

Yes, many of you see this as a way out. I personally see it as a blessing in disguise.

If Hudson topped himself there will be no more killing (on his behalf). I can guarantee if he gets out in 14 years within 4 months of his release he'll be either back behind bars or will have killed more.

My opinion would suggest he can not be rehibilatated.

But - I also think we're lucky he turned himself in and didn't go all Port Arthur on us - a man with a gun in one of Aussie's largest cities could have done way worse.

The eye for an eye thing... Has it's merits - but that type of savagery went out with the dark ages. Although kiddie fiddlers deserve castration for sure (as do rapists). But do murderers deserve human rights?

You mentioned two other Countries with the death penalty. When you compare this you need to pick countries relatively similar...

China is a communist country (heavily debated) with STRONG restrictions on a lot of things.

North Korea is a dictatorship...

They can't really be compared to America or Australia IMO.

The long term costs with the death penalty is the number of appeals and such a prisoner can make.

Keeping him in jail, and giving the prisoners useful things to do (contributing towards society) is the best option. I know in one jail they make water tanks... Contributing

Everyone deserves human rights. Once you start removing them where do you stop? Does a murderer get them? Does a rapist get them? Does a pirate get them? Does a thief get them?

 

[Forensick]

So far I would like to comment on how clean you've all kept it (there's still time though). And secondly some very insightful comments... I only wish I had put a poll up now to see how divided we are on this subject.

Forensick... USA isn't the only capital punisher in the world. But I am unsure exactly of crime rates in China, Korea (I think north) and other severe penalty capitalisers. But the US has other problems. With freedom (or so called) comes responsibility - and their constitution allows for it.

The next thing is the cost. What costs are associated with the death penalty in the long term?

I did a quick year 11 study on how much it costs (in electrcity) to electrocute someone in the clinical method. It's like less than a cent!!! It's obviosly not the sodium pentalthate (sp??) or the electricity that costs, but what are the costs?

If it costs Hudson $100 000 per year to be in jail then surely the $2million it costs by time he''s out will be well and truley recovered if we let him top himself!

the costs in the death penalty, like jail, do not include the very basic.
for starters, you have the costs of trials, and numerous appeals and attempts to convert the death penalty, given the murdered person is usually poor, the state appointed lawyer.... surely if you are pro death, you'd like to make sure you aren't murdering the wrong person (eg/ carryl chessman).
also you have the additional costs of the guards in death row, the exewcutioners, and the councelling associated. You also have security for the anti and pro death people out the front, aswell as all the associated media costs...
also lets not forget the political cost, being which ever gov't institutes it WILL lose an election...
but all in all, particually the legal costs.

I refer to the US because the practicality and social consequences of the death penalty in a australia will (and did) more closely resemble the US than china/thailand etc.

And finally, purely in reference to this case.
WHY kill him? he WANTS to die... so how is it a punishment?
its like punishing a child having a tantrum by buying them the toy!

the death penalty has nothing to do with justice, and never has, it has always been about vengance, and i would like to think we are more enlightened than that.
the governments and courts have 2 jobs, not just to protect us from those that wish to harm us, but to protect us from ourselves.

And finally... (sorry this is where friendly stops) what the hell is wrong with you "eye for an eye" people.... -note: while i disagree with pro death penalty people, it is not bitter till the foolishly use that line to "justify" themselves.
firstly, i hope you are jewish, because anyone that follows the sequel should know that that was changed "i am the way and the light, live as i live" fairly sure thats the first, and ONLY commandment in the new testament, also fairly sure that the man who consorted with murders thieves prostitutes and tax collectors, called them his brothers, and said that they would sit beside him in the halls of his father.... while condeming the ruling classes, merchants priests and governors, and in many cases in no uncertain terms telling them that they could NEVER enter heaven (a camel will pass through the eye of a needle before a rich man enters heaven).
Not to mention the simple fact that if you want to institute old testmanet law, which aside from being considered wrong by both jesus and mohummed, you better get ready to kill alot more... i hope the hair at your temples is long, otherwise you are stoned too...
and i hope your wife/gf never touched you while menstrating, otherwise you are unclean, and have to stone her and preform a sacrifce to be clean again...

come off it, your pseudo religous justifications have less basis in your alleged belief system than saying that he should die becaus ethe flying spagetti monster burbed

 

[Mystery]

slimy, i beleive also that we should just let him out of jail! let him run free!
i guarantee that the only reason he turned himself in was for his own safety! he wouldnt last 30 mins in the real world anymore! the Hells Angels want him for portraying a bad image for them and the Rebels want him because he has a Rebels tattoo on his arm and in turn giving them a bad name too.... they have threatened to find him and cut the tattoo out of his arm!

with both the hells angels and the rebels out to get him he simply wouldnt last long!

i say let him out! and let them (the HA and the rebels) deal with him!!!!!

It's not the rebels that are after him - it is the Finx! He left them and joined up with the HA's. Remember that boxing match at the Gold Coast in Qld? It was the Finx that shot him. He has a full Finx tat on his back - thats what they want. The police will give him anything he wants IF he feeds them all the inside info on the Finx and Angels. And true - he is not man enough to do away with himself. We will hear in a couple of months time that he has necked himself inside. I guarantee it won't be him doing the necking!

 

[Australis]

A state ordered death is too good for some people.
You dont need the State to put anyone to death, some criminals such as phedofiles and rapists should simply be released into the general prison population, where justice would be swift.

But at the end of the day only the stupid or less well off go to prison to begin with :shock:

 

[Mystery]

A state ordered death is too good for some people.

Totally agree.

 

[freddy]

but hes a hottie:cry:

plus with the death sentance its all good and well until its a mate of yours or family member thats getting it IMO

 

[darkangel]

a death sentance is the easy way out. he would be put in the boneyard with all the peodophiles etc where he is relatively protected. if he is let out there will be more ppl dead due to him killing them. they may be other bikies etc but what happens if an innocent person or cop gets caught up in it?? being in gaol may cost tax payers money and i know how easy they have it in there as i have had friends in gaol in the past but while he is in there he has to watch his back constantly. sleep with his eyes open for he will never know when someone will come for him. it will only be a matter of time and they will make him suffer for it!

 

[slip_phreak]

I've worked inside with the crims from the medium to low security part of Parramatta prison as a first year electrical apprentice.. (long story). Its not that bad being inside, 3 meals a day, a dry warm bed to sleep in, free courses that you can do inside through something similar to tafe, Free access to dental + doctors + Hospital, free drug rehabilitation (methadone clinics). The down side is you have to avoid gang rape and beatings, but if you think about it these guys are being punished and get more services and what not that the people who sleep on the streets. IMO

 

[grimbeny]

but if you think about it these guys are being punished and get more services and what not that the people who sleep on the streets. IMO

But their just bums, they get what they deserve. If they want to live better off then they should get of their lazy ass and get a job...

 

[slip_phreak]

But their just bums, they get what they deserve. If they want to live better off then they should get of their lazy ass and get a job...

Its not always that simple to just "get a job" , in my 3 years of being an apprentice i have gone through 6 employers becuase there are so many people who just try to use you for cheap labour, or becuase they have got a little too much work for 2 months then it disappears and you get the sack through no fault of your own.

 

[grimbeny]

Sorry if it didnt come across like it but i was being sarcastic. I most definatly dont beleive someone living on the street has a genuine oportunity to get their lives together. in NSW alone their are over 10 000 mentally challanged people which have no access to a bed each night. These people for obviouse reasons cant just go findthemselves a job. The government needs to provide everyone with basic necesaties. As i beleive a place to sleep should be a right not a privlidge.

 

[slip_phreak]

sorry mate my fault, did pick up on the sarcasm lol

 

[grimbeny]

Yea the net isnt really the best place to use sarcasm lol, it just never seems to work.

 

[slim6y]

It's amazing... all these mentally challenged people need to do is get a gun and kill someone to get the basics of life... This is what we cry for? A real world? Free of violence and crime? Really... where does it start?

It's suprising though.. Something went wrong with Hudson who - as Freddy pointed out appears well looked after, has a family... so where did it go wrong for him? Where did it start.

Are all you people just blaming him?

Well, most are - but always, and I can guarantee it, always you will find society somewhere is at fault. We failed them somehow.

I know you wouldn't see it - well, most wouldn't... But it's our own fault. we've lost our 'pack' we're turning more and more solitary with no one to rely on.

A series of events starting from early childhood culminating in the morning of violence in Melbourne was just how it all started.

So we should look more now to avoidance rather than rehibilitation.

Two innocent people lost their lives because of something we all failed at...

But - then yet again, i do live in a bit of a fantasy world. I have money (some), shelter, food every night, a warm place to live, animals to look at and cuddle... I'm pretty damned lucky!

But well over 2/3 of the world aren't!