Suspected RI?

[Ellannn]

It doesn't look good at all.
Took her to the vet and she was gasping for air and has no body strength what's so ever.

The vet is unsure of what it could be at this stage.
Could be neurological, could be viral who knows.
All we know is that it's not looking too good at the moment.
She was given a baytril injection, a fortum injection, a tolfedine injection and some fluids.

She is booked back in on Monday because it was to late to take some blood tests this evening.
She did do a stool sample but that didn't show up anything unusual.

Hopefully she makes it through the weekend.

 

[tahnia666]

Got my fingers crossed for you [MENTION=37437]Ellannn[/MENTION]

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[CrystalMoon]

All the best to you and your Girl, I hope she is ok

 

[littlemay]

That's some seriously rapid deterioration, obviously something serious going on

See my PM

 

[MissDangerous]

Thinking of you [MENTION=37437]Ellannn[/MENTION] and hoping for the best possible outcome for your girl... *hugs*

 

[MrThumper]

Nawwww....nothing worse than feeling helpless with a pet in pain. Hope she pulls thru


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[Maxwell]

I hope everything works out! Keep us updated.

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[Lawra]

[MENTION=37437]Ellannn[/MENTION] fingers crossed she makes it through the weekend and you can do tests on Monday. Sending lots of love xxx

 

[Snowman]

mate, considering she shed 11 days ago, she has only just started making the sounds, I rather honestly take the advice from a vet whom was recommended on these very forums, when it comes to the health of my animals, yes there are more definitive symptoms, but by then the RI maybe in its later stages?, everyone on the internet is an expert. I made the choice to go as I had issues with a previous animal I recently got rid of, and wanted to be more safe than sorry, why take the risk? yes I am new and being 'oversensitive' but I don't need you implying I've been had, big deal $20 for antibiotics is not going to break the bank neither is the consult fee.

BAM!
One of the least experienced members talking smack to one of the oldest and most experienced members (who has far more experience than many vets). Stuff like this is just embarrassing

 

[RedFox]

[MENTION=16366]Snowman[/MENTION] Maybe the gold star idea (I think that was yours?) would stop some of the rudeness Jamie and other experienced members have to put up with, just because they don't sugar coat their answers.
[MENTION=37437]Ellannn[/MENTION] hope they find out what is wrong soon and your little one can be on the road to recovery.

 

[Snowman]

Yes. It's funny when people have no idea about the person they are being rude too.
As a WA keeper I'm very grateful to Jamie who was part of a small group that took on the WA government for the better part of a decade to finally allow the public to keep reptiles as pets. Without that we still wouldn't be able to keep herpetofauna as pets.

 

[Karnyge]

Look I meant no disrespect, and I apologise for coming across the way I did, but these guys are not at my house to inspect the animal, and I respect their experience but I don't appreciate being told I've just been sold antibiotics because I'm new and over sensitive, like I said I became worried when I started hearing these frequents sounds which weren't present, like python said 99% of clicking sounds are pre shed, as mine is not in pre shed, maybe mine is the other 1%, I took her to a vet recommended here on the forums so I assumed they would have the necassery experience.

 

[andynic07]

It doesn't look good at all.
Took her to the vet and she was gasping for air and has no body strength what's so ever.

The vet is unsure of what it could be at this stage.
Could be neurological, could be viral who knows.
All we know is that it's not looking too good at the moment.
She was given a baytril injection, a fortum injection, a tolfedine injection and some fluids.

She is booked back in on Monday because it was to late to take some blood tests this evening.
She did do a stool sample but that didn't show up anything unusual.

Hopefully she makes it through the weekend.

Sorry to hear about your snake, I can't remember if you had any more snakes or not but it may be a good idea to keep your sick one in quarantine if you haven't already and have more reptiles.

 

[CrystalMoon]

Look I meant no disrespect, and I apologise for coming across the way I did, but these guys are not at my house to inspect the animal, and I respect their experience but I don't appreciate being told I've just been sold antibiotics because I'm new and over sensitive, like I said I became worried when I started hearing these frequents sounds which weren't present, like python said 99% of clicking sounds are pre shed, as mine is not in pre shed, maybe mine is the other 1%, I took her to a vet recommended here on the forums so I assumed they would have the necassery experience.

I dont really think Jamie's comments were directed at you persay, I think they were a generalization. No-one really disputes the amount of learning a vet goes through but I have to be honest, a lot of vets know next to nothing about Pythons. I have at my disposal 2 vets in this small town, one of which has told me they would be happier if I didn't bring in my Pythons the other said openly they have know idea about how to treat them and would need to confer with colleagues over the phone to diagnose/treat my Reptiles. So..... this is why I would turn to members like Jamie and many other "experienced" long time members on this forum. It is their no nonsense approach that gets to the very bottom of issues. Vets are a very much needed member of our community as are our long term experienced Reptile keepers. Sometimes access to a "reptile vet" is not possible, members like Jamie are invaluable to myself and many others, I guess that is why we jump to their defence. It is nice that you apologized.
I really hope OP's Coastal is on the mend very sad to hear she is so ill

 

[Karnyge]

I dont really think Jamie's comments were directed at you persay, I think they were a generalization. No-one really disputes the amount of learning a vet goes through but I have to be honest, a lot of vets know next to nothing about Pythons. I have at my disposal 2 vets in this small town, one of which has told me they would be happier if I didn't bring in my Pythons the other said openly they have know idea about how to treat them and would need to confer with colleagues over the phone to diagnose/treat my Reptiles. So..... this is why I would turn to members like Jamie and many other "experienced" long time members on this forum. It is their no nonsense approach that gets to the very bottom of issues. Vets are a very much needed member of our community as are our long term experienced Reptile keepers. Sometimes access to a "reptile vet" is not possible, members like Jamie are invaluable to myself and many others, I guess that is why we jump to their defence. It is nice that you apologized.
I really hope OP's Coastal is on the mend very sad to hear she is so ill

I 100% agree and shouldn't of jumped the gun and took so much offence, by the sounds of it in your case seeking advice from an experienced member would be your only real option, I had a choice =) I wouldn't just go to any old vet, I looked up vets who specialise in reptiles and have the experience and in the end I listened to their advice. I just didn't want to take any chances, I'll leave it at that. I too hope that OP's coastal will be okay.

 

[andynic07]

Dr Shane Simpson who is one of Australia's leading reptile vets is happy to discuss any case with other vets for a consultation fee so maybe if there is no real reptile vets close by this would be an option.

 

[GBWhite]

Ellannn,

I sincerely wish you all the best with treatment for your snake.

However and unfortunately; from your description there is every indication that your snake is suffering from a serious respiratory infection that may be secondary to a fungus, parasite or virus. A virus that causes severe and chronic respiratory infection in Boids (Boas and Pythons) is known as VERBS (Viral Encephalitis of Boid Snakes). It is basically a fungus that causes acute pneumonia as well as neurological signs. It requires prompt and aggressive attention for any possibility for the snake's survival. Unfortunately (and I hate to be the bearer of bad tidings) if this is the case the infection is usually fatal. It can be treated if caught early so ask your vet if they are familiar with this condition and if treatment is worth considering. Treatment can be difficult and expensive with no guarantee that the snake will pull through.

Cage environment is usually the principal cause relating to respiratory infections. Therefore environmental corrections and supplementary heating should always be indicated when treating a suspected respiratory infection.

Snakes housed in moist conditions with poor ventilation for long periods of time are prime candidates for respiratory and fungal infections. I don't know what the environmental conditions are regarding your animal but from experience respiratory infections often arise when keepers try to duplicate a "natural environment" for their charges. Hence a positive argument exists for keeping cage environments simple. Unlike humans, snake's aren't into aesthetics (they don't care what their cage looks like); all they need to maintain good health is heating, clean water, clean environment and a regular source of clean food.

Karnyge,

Jamie and Crystalmoon are right on the money. Unwary newcomers to the game with no experience regarding reptile health have no reason not to believe that vets are the first port of call to treat a sick reptile. The truth is that the vast majority of vets practising in Australia today (even those who advertise as "reptile vets") know hardly anything about vet care for herps. 99% of the time their diagnosis is no more than a guess. Not many will admit it because they (like doctors) are running a business and want, albeit need, to maintain a continuous line of inquiry to stay in business. I agree that they have to undertake extensive study, however their study of reptile diseases and care is very, very limited over the course of their education. Most of their experience is gained through trial and error. They do get it right sometimes, however it's far better for a keeper to self educate and familiarise themselves with diagnosis of conditions before consultation with a vet.

There are many long time keepers on here who, through experience, are more familiar with diagnosing health problems associated with snakes than vets. Jamie is just one of those people and I too am of the opinion he was just making a cynical, general joke. What do they say about taking a spoon full of cement (that's meant as a joke as well).

Personally I very much doubt that you'll get the same advise provided by Jamie or that given above from a vet.

However, considering that you are new to the game and aren't familiar with keepers on this forum you did do the right thing consulting a vet whether it is a respiratory problem or not.

FYI...Clicking sounds in snakes are not necessarily an indication of a respiratory infection. Did your vet inform you of this? Is your vet experienced enough with snakes to be aware of this?

Again I don't know what your cage environment is like or what you use for a substrate. However just as a general future reference for all, clicking sounds coming from snakes can also be due to chemical irritation found in substrates such as wood shavings, high ammonia levels caused through dirty enclosures or even cigarette smoke. It could be an allergic reaction to dust from compressed paper, coconut husk, corn husks or similar substrates.

As I've stated above environmental correction of housing often prevents such irritations and allergies.

Cheers,

George.

 

[Karnyge]

Ellannn,

I sincerely wish you all the best with treatment for your snake.

However and unfortunately; from your description there is every indication that your snake is suffering from a serious respiratory infection that may be secondary to a fungus, parasite or virus. A virus that causes severe and chronic respiratory infection in Boids (Boas and Pythons) is known as VERBS (Viral Encephalitis of Boid Snakes). It is basically a fungus that causes acute pneumonia as well as neurological signs. It requires prompt and aggressive attention for any possibility for the snake's survival. Unfortunately (and I hate to be the bearer of bad tidings) if this is the case the infection is usually fatal. It can be treated if caught early so ask your vet if they are familiar with this condition and if treatment is worth considering. Treatment can be difficult and expensive with no guarantee that the snake will pull through.

Cage environment is usually the principal cause relating to respiratory infections. Therefore environmental corrections and supplementary heating should always be indicated when treating a suspected respiratory infection.

Snakes housed in moist conditions with poor ventilation for long periods of time are prime candidates for respiratory and fungal infections. I don't know what the environmental conditions are regarding your animal but from experience respiratory infections often arise when keepers try to duplicate a "natural environment" for their charges. Hence a positive argument exists for keeping cage environments simple. Unlike humans, snake's aren't into aesthetics (they don't care what their cage looks like); all they need to maintain good health is heating, clean water, clean environment and a regular source of clean food.

Karnyge,

Jamie and Crystalmoon are right on the money. Unwary newcomers to the game with no experience regarding reptile health have no reason not to believe that vets are the first port of call to treat a sick reptile. The truth is that the vast majority of vets practising in Australia today (even those who advertise as "reptile vets") know hardly anything about vet care for herps. 99% of the time their diagnosis is no more than a guess. Not many will admit it because they (like doctors) are running a business and want, albeit need, to maintain a continuous line of inquiry to stay in business. I agree that they have to undertake extensive study, however their study of reptile diseases and care is very, very limited over the course of their education. Most of their experience is gained through trial and error. They do get it right sometimes, however it's far better for a keeper to self educate and familiarise themselves with diagnosis of conditions before consultation with a vet.

There are many long time keepers on here who, through experience, are more familiar with diagnosing health problems associated with snakes than vets. Jamie is just one of those people and I too am of the opinion he was just making a cynical, general joke. What do they say about taking a spoon full of cement (that's meant as a joke as well).

Personally I very much doubt that you'll get the same advise provided by Jamie or that given above from a vet.

However, considering that you are new to the game and aren't familiar with keepers on this forum you did do the right thing consulting a vet whether it is a respiratory problem or not.

FYI...Clicking sounds in snakes are not necessarily an indication of a respiratory infection. Did your vet inform you of this? Is your vet experienced enough with snakes to be aware of this?

Again I don't know what your cage environment is like or what you use for a substrate. However just as a general future reference for all, clicking sounds coming from snakes can also be due to chemical irritation found in substrates such as wood shavings, high ammonia levels caused through dirty enclosures or even cigarette smoke. It could be an allergic reaction to dust from compressed paper, coconut husk, corn husks or similar substrates.

As I've stated above environmental correction of housing often prevents such irritations and allergies.

Cheers,

George.

Thanks mate, the vet I consulted has extensive experience with reptiles, and others on here recommended them, I'm not entirely new to the game it's just been some time since I've owned any snakes, we use to have a collection of venoms which my old man milked, I use paper towel and a click clack, very basic setup, I spot clean and wipe down with f10. Cheers

 

[Pythoninfinite]

Look guys, I'm not even slightly offended by the OP's response, I think he/she mistook the general point I was making - it wasn't a personal shot at the OP, just a general observation that new keepers often see a vet as the answer to all problems, even imagined ones. George has explained it very well I think, as well as outlined some of the pitfalls we all experience at one time or another as keepers. Of course an experienced SPECIALIST reptile vet has a good deal of knowledge about reptiles, and many inexperienced vets will communicate with one of those when confronted with a problematic patient, as they should. I have absolutely no beef with the vet industry at all, but I do have concerns when new(ish) keepers say they're taking their symptomless snake to the vet for its "annual checkup" - this is totally pointless, and money for jam for vets. A good vet will discourage this practice because a reptile not showing symptoms will automatically be given a clean bill of health in ALL circumstances, while relieving the client of $60-$80 for a consult. Vets don't have a window into the future of an otherwise healthy snake, any more than I do. Reptiles are not like cats & dogs where annual checkups for teeth, heart health, vaccinations etc are wise preventative measures - none of those things are necessary or even available for reptiles.

But... if a reptile has symptoms or behaviours which are out of the ordinary, and the keeper has little experience, then perhaps a vet visit is appropriate, as it looks to be the case here as the story develops...

I'm also a bit confused - the OP (Ellann) indicated on March 20 that the snake in question was "due to shed any day now" but in another post, someone named "Karnyge" bluntly said it shed 11 days ago... what's the story? Are we discussing a different snake? Does the thread-starter have two IDs?

Jamie

 

[Rob]

I'm also a bit confused - the OP (Ellann) indicated on March 20 that the snake in question was "due to shed any day now" but in another post, someone named "Karnyge" bluntly said it shed 11 days ago... what's the story? Are we discussing a different snake? Does the thread-starter have two IDs?

The thread was hijacked in this post, so yes - two entirely different snakes are being discussed. When people don't use quotes, it makes it even harder to follow.