A
Administrator
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Oh... and an interest in doing so. What you guys talk about in private does not interest me what so ever. I try not to buy into internal politics on this site, it's important to the job I have to do.
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Oh... and an interest in doing so. What you guys talk about in private does not interest me what so ever. I try not to buy into internal politics on this site, it's important to the job I have to do.
Earthling
Very Well-Known Member
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THE TIME HAS COME TO TAKE UP YOUR ARMS!!!
And wiggle them around a bit....
up to the left and down to the right....
up in the middle and throw em around with all your might!
when your totally buggered and cant move them anymore come back to APS and input.
LOL
jessop
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I have stayed out of this one until now and hope this whole thing blows over quickly.
This is all i have to say on the 'whole' matter (i'm not getting involed or voicing my opinions over the Marc thing, though it saddens me he lost most of his collection)
Although i don't know Adam personally i think he is doing a great job. IMO Adam makes a conscious effort to stay out of the **** that sometimes goes on in this forum. He really doesn't have the time or patience to get involed in the 'goings on' in APS and just sticks to his job of keeping the site running well (coding, fixing up minor issues and dealing with technical complaints from users). By his own admission (in a pm to me when i asked him a technical snake question) he is no expert on snakes nor really wants to be.
I think most members realise this and also know that Adam couldn't care less what goes on in pm's.
That said, Adams "forum breach" was unfortunate but probably good in a way for the normal members to glimpse what goes on in the moderators forum. How is it different that the moderators can chat behind our backs from us jumping on msn and privately doing the same thing behind others backs? They have a job to do and are only human. I don't care what gets said behind my back in a mods forum, it is their right as mods to discuss APS and it's members in anyway they see fit. It is a good lesson to all members to see that it does go on, and they (mods) do judge people without really knowing them, but that is normal/human. This occurrance should awaken all people who post in threads, to think carefully about what they post. And yes, if you are a constant trouble maker you will get talked about and probably banned. I don't have to agree with the mods, i certainly wasn't happy about the whole Agamidae/Marc thing, but thats life. Sure it could have been handled better, nicer etc. too late now...
The mods too should take something from this and just be a little more careful about what they write (nothing is sacred these days lol) Generally i think they do a good job and i hope APS keeps running strong. It is a great wealth of information and experience and has helped me so much already. I would hate to see it go down after something like this. I hope this is just a learning step in the 'evolution' of APS and not the beginning of the end.
jessop
This is all i have to say on the 'whole' matter (i'm not getting involed or voicing my opinions over the Marc thing, though it saddens me he lost most of his collection)
Although i don't know Adam personally i think he is doing a great job. IMO Adam makes a conscious effort to stay out of the **** that sometimes goes on in this forum. He really doesn't have the time or patience to get involed in the 'goings on' in APS and just sticks to his job of keeping the site running well (coding, fixing up minor issues and dealing with technical complaints from users). By his own admission (in a pm to me when i asked him a technical snake question) he is no expert on snakes nor really wants to be.
I think most members realise this and also know that Adam couldn't care less what goes on in pm's.
That said, Adams "forum breach" was unfortunate but probably good in a way for the normal members to glimpse what goes on in the moderators forum. How is it different that the moderators can chat behind our backs from us jumping on msn and privately doing the same thing behind others backs? They have a job to do and are only human. I don't care what gets said behind my back in a mods forum, it is their right as mods to discuss APS and it's members in anyway they see fit. It is a good lesson to all members to see that it does go on, and they (mods) do judge people without really knowing them, but that is normal/human. This occurrance should awaken all people who post in threads, to think carefully about what they post. And yes, if you are a constant trouble maker you will get talked about and probably banned. I don't have to agree with the mods, i certainly wasn't happy about the whole Agamidae/Marc thing, but thats life. Sure it could have been handled better, nicer etc. too late now...
The mods too should take something from this and just be a little more careful about what they write (nothing is sacred these days lol) Generally i think they do a good job and i hope APS keeps running strong. It is a great wealth of information and experience and has helped me so much already. I would hate to see it go down after something like this. I hope this is just a learning step in the 'evolution' of APS and not the beginning of the end.
jessop
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AntaresiaLady
Very Well-Known Member
As a parent, I'd like to say- to everyone freaking out about a 'pedophile' being on the forum- if you think they aren't EVERYWHERE- you are naive. Besides, the fact is that most incidents are perpetrated by someone known to the child, or in a position of trust.
There could be a dozen pedophiles, rapists and other freaks of nature cruising this forum as members- and unless you did a police check on every one who joins/is a member, that risk is ALWAYS going to be there, no matter what forum you're in.
You're kidding yourself if you think I'm wrong. In this day and age we need to do more than ever to protect our families. This includes using common sense when people ask to see pics of your kids...there are many who are innocent (such as Pilbara Dave), and there are not some who's motives are suspect. Use your better judgement. If you post, be aware that your kids pics can and probably will be seen by some freak.
Thats not to say you shouldn't post. Fear is a major factor - we can spend our lives scared of everything.
JM2CW.
My problem with the moderating system was that people in positions of power were degrading, derogatory, disrespectful and using personal problems to determine who would be slapped.
It becomes one set of rules for them, one set of rules for us.
We are all expected to extend common courtesies, and to obey the site rules. So should the moderators, whether in their little private forum or not.
Who moderates the moderators? Obviously no one.
Again, JM2CW.
I believe APS will bounce back, because it is a good forum that just got a little off the path. It is an excellent source of information, and for the most part, the members here are awesome. In fact, there's probably only one or two that I feel I wouldn't get along with IRL, just because we have such varied opinions.
And Adam - This new look is great- you've done a great job! I only have one criticism- that threads can be seen by non members. I think that instead of pretty much the only privilege of being a member is to actually post, it should be to be able to view the forum itself. If that makes sense?? People are gleaning the information without bothering to become members I guess- and I don't think thats fair on those giving out their years of experience, as the purpose of the forum is to provide that information to its members- there's no point becoming a member if you can see all that advice without joining....
I dont' know if I'm making sense or not...I hope so- but anyway- thats just what I think.
There could be a dozen pedophiles, rapists and other freaks of nature cruising this forum as members- and unless you did a police check on every one who joins/is a member, that risk is ALWAYS going to be there, no matter what forum you're in.
You're kidding yourself if you think I'm wrong. In this day and age we need to do more than ever to protect our families. This includes using common sense when people ask to see pics of your kids...there are many who are innocent (such as Pilbara Dave), and there are not some who's motives are suspect. Use your better judgement. If you post, be aware that your kids pics can and probably will be seen by some freak.
Thats not to say you shouldn't post. Fear is a major factor - we can spend our lives scared of everything.
JM2CW.
My problem with the moderating system was that people in positions of power were degrading, derogatory, disrespectful and using personal problems to determine who would be slapped.
It becomes one set of rules for them, one set of rules for us.
We are all expected to extend common courtesies, and to obey the site rules. So should the moderators, whether in their little private forum or not.
Who moderates the moderators? Obviously no one.
Again, JM2CW.
I believe APS will bounce back, because it is a good forum that just got a little off the path. It is an excellent source of information, and for the most part, the members here are awesome. In fact, there's probably only one or two that I feel I wouldn't get along with IRL, just because we have such varied opinions.
And Adam - This new look is great- you've done a great job! I only have one criticism- that threads can be seen by non members. I think that instead of pretty much the only privilege of being a member is to actually post, it should be to be able to view the forum itself. If that makes sense?? People are gleaning the information without bothering to become members I guess- and I don't think thats fair on those giving out their years of experience, as the purpose of the forum is to provide that information to its members- there's no point becoming a member if you can see all that advice without joining....
I dont' know if I'm making sense or not...I hope so- but anyway- thats just what I think.
J
junglepython2
Guest
While I agree with the idea in theory, if non-members can't see anything they won't bother to join as they won't have any idea what the site is like and will move on to another forum.
shamous1
Very Well-Known Member
Smart one
Quite right. Give them a little taste of what APS has to offer and then take their money so they can access more priveledges.
Quite right. Give them a little taste of what APS has to offer and then take their money so they can access more priveledges.
AntaresiaLady
Very Well-Known Member
A little taste, or the whole pie? At the moment they can have the whole pie for free...
Make only the General Herps section available....if you could limit it to the top 10 currently discussed items- that would be cooler...but I think thats probably impossible or a bit of a nightmare.
Isn't there a saying....why buy the cow when you can get the milk for free? I'm not talking about taking peoples money, or making them pay to become members, but am talking about them just becoming members instead of gleaning all the information without having to join the forum.
If you prevent unregistered members from reading the forum threads you also prevent search engines from doing so. At the moment APS has very high google rankings, for instance google bredli enclosure. If you lock guests out of the forum APS' search engine rankings will plummet, which will mean less people can get to the site and benefit from the fantastic information posted herein.
If someone just wants to find out information, why should they have to sign up for a site that may not even contain that information? If they want to actually ask questions and participate then of course they should sign up. This also has the added benefit of preventing automated spam submissions.
I wholely support forums supporting their costs with memberships etc. But shutting off guest access can only hinder the growth and success of the site.
buck
Well-Known Member
If people are made to pay for a basic membership the site will go down hill faster than it is now. It's one thing to ask for a small donation to advertise animals for sale,the cost of which is usually minimal in comparison to the money stood to gain for the sale, but to make people pay to access the basic features of the site - people will turn away in droves. Why would you pay for this site when so many other sites are free? Especially when membership on the other sites increases due to the people leaving here.
I used to frequent a marine aquarium site that I'm sure other members here still frequent. The site is financed by donations from the various marine aquarium societies. The system works really well were each society has it's own forum that only financial members could access, but still had all of the main forums that were accessable to the public. The only reason why I can't see the same happen here is the current "owner" would have to relinguish control of the site. The site would be run by elected members from each society. Oh and for those that say it isn't possible - the marine aquarium site used to be privately run,controlled, and financed by one individual who saw that there was a real chance for the hobby to come together and grow.
Food for thought....
I used to frequent a marine aquarium site that I'm sure other members here still frequent. The site is financed by donations from the various marine aquarium societies. The system works really well were each society has it's own forum that only financial members could access, but still had all of the main forums that were accessable to the public. The only reason why I can't see the same happen here is the current "owner" would have to relinguish control of the site. The site would be run by elected members from each society. Oh and for those that say it isn't possible - the marine aquarium site used to be privately run,controlled, and financed by one individual who saw that there was a real chance for the hobby to come together and grow.
Food for thought....
RodSydAus
Not so new Member
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- Sep 29, 2006
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If a nonmember gets some information from this site that helps them care for their pet better, or even just to be better informed about herp matters, then isnt that a good thing? The current setup seems fine to me. Good job 8) to those responsible.
Same here.
theplantguys
Active Member
Agree here as well. I am happy to pay as I am happy to be here, however I would not be here if I had to pay before I got to play.
don’t want to bring up the kiddie bit (its been dead for 1 whole page), its the internet people, these sort of people are everywhere, if you have concerns over this perhaps get the internet disconnected! as for mods letting people know, mmmm don’t think this would be a good idea myself, what if they were wrong that’s a whole lot of defamation then, I think they did the right thing, you need to be really careful these days with what you say and do even if you don’t you can still spend a lot of money defending yourself against silly people!
BTW I think Adam and the mods are doing a fine job, I wouldn’t want it ! it would be a very difficult thing to police all the posts, etc and the “new site” is a lot faster so who could possible complain, top job I say!.
Hope it continues to improve (and i am sure it will)
)
Ramsayi
Very Well-Known Member
People with knowledge that post on here do so because they want to share that knowledge not so a forum owner can make money from it.Restricting people from "gleaning all the information" from posts is wrong.
For those of you that think a basic membership fee would be ok think again.Why would someone pay for membership for the priveledge of passing on their knowledge to others?
Heres an idea.Why not charge people 10 cents per post (that might slow those that feel the need to comment on anything and everything down and cost some others a fortune).Could also pay people 10 cents for every post that offers solid advice.Then we could have another group that gets charged 20 cents for every bit of bad advice they give.The last one would make a fortune for the site.
Why should people who have stuff for sale have to pay in order to place an ad? Isn't their contribution in offering decent advice enough? Perhaps the site should be paying people to answer the questions of the less experienced members,afterall without input from these people then the site won't be much at all.
scotchbo
Very Well-Known Member
well i pm'd slateman about a banned member breach and it was posted all over that other crappy site and for this im seriously considering leaving this site has gone to the dog's it was great a few month's ago and now it is slowly getting worse and worse
nightowl
Very Well-Known Member
I assume the fee for advertising in the forums is to pay for upkeep of the site? I'd be interested to see how much it actually costs to run this forum each year. According to the member list we have 1738 members. If each member paid the subscription fee of $5 that is almost $8,690 per year! Even if half the members paid $5, that totals close to $4500/year! Profiteering sounds more like the reason for subscriptions as I'm sure a domain and server doesn't cost that much to run.
I agree with Ramsayi in the fact that many member's contributions should be payment enough to be able to advertise here.
I agree with Ramsayi in the fact that many member's contributions should be payment enough to be able to advertise here.
A
Administrator
Guest
Server costs alone are more than $2500 a year (unlike some other sites, we have a dedicated server). This doesn't take into account other costs like software licence fees and domain registration.
Also, of the 1738 members, we currently have 1,236 active members (members who have logged on in the last 30 days) - this means the other 500 or so are "dead" accounts.
We don't expect everyone to pay for a subscription/seller's account - we expect this to be a "little extra" that members who really enjoy the site can do to support it. Currently we don't have anywhere near the amount of subscriptions it would take to be even breaking even on those.
Also, of the 1738 members, we currently have 1,236 active members (members who have logged on in the last 30 days) - this means the other 500 or so are "dead" accounts.
We don't expect everyone to pay for a subscription/seller's account - we expect this to be a "little extra" that members who really enjoy the site can do to support it. Currently we don't have anywhere near the amount of subscriptions it would take to be even breaking even on those.
i see where your coming from but just say i needed info reall bad like some disaster just happend to my snake and im not a member of this site, ill come here in search for info be told that to read anything i need to register, but to register it takes days and i only have minutes to find out my info... ok great i found my info because i didnt need to register BUT i think i should register incase it happens again... thats my little scenario, i hope it can be understood...
6ftpythonsgirl
Well-Known Member
i think the site is great and even if the site was making a profite who cares they worked hard to make it happen if they make a little extra they deserve it...
if you dont want to pay the subscrittion fee dont you dont have to like adam said its an extra thing
if you dont want to pay the subscrittion fee dont you dont have to like adam said its an extra thing
AntaresiaLady
Very Well-Known Member
I guess the prompting for this is that I received quite a few emails regarding this site to people I'd recommended locally.
I recieved complaints that the threads were full of arguing and dissent, and this was deterring them from becoming members.
I admitted I had a small hand in the mess, and I am hoping that my assurances that it is all over and done with will be enough to lure them back.
I thought that maybe if certain forums were blocked from public view, it would prevent this sort of thing....I would hope they would join, see the good stuff in the forums, and ignore the crap. Not have the crap deter them from joining full stop.
Oh well.
I recieved complaints that the threads were full of arguing and dissent, and this was deterring them from becoming members.
I admitted I had a small hand in the mess, and I am hoping that my assurances that it is all over and done with will be enough to lure them back.
I thought that maybe if certain forums were blocked from public view, it would prevent this sort of thing....I would hope they would join, see the good stuff in the forums, and ignore the crap. Not have the crap deter them from joining full stop.
Oh well.
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