Really liking and wanting a diamondxcoastal

[Kam333]

The difference is the ones against aren't doing any damage by muddying the hobby.

. . . .
Because when a pure breed gets out into the wild it at least know better than to breed with the locals. And the hobby was kept pure right from the start even before the apparent sub sp got brought into it. Pure breeds are not responsible for diseases unlike those filthy hybrids. Terrorists are funded by Hybrid breeding, it is also a known fact that a jag was on one of those planes. If we let the snakes do it then people will think its OK for them to do it. There are no hybrids outside of the Matrix........

 

[notechistiger]

I think you lot are missing the point entirely. There are naturally occurring coastal x diamonds called integrades. The crossbred coastal x diamonds in captivity should NOT be labelled as such, unless they are from the naturally occurring integrade lineage.

You don't have to respect other people's want to keep it pure, but you should respect the need to call things as they are.

 

[Kam333]

I think you lot are missing the point entirely. There are naturally occurring coastal x diamonds called integrades. The crossbred coastal x diamonds in captivity should NOT be labelled as such, unless they are from the naturally occurring integrade lineage.

You don't have to respect other people's want to keep it pure, but you should respect the need to call things as they are.

I agree but I think the naturally occurring transition from Diamond to coastal should be called intermediates as opposed to intergade. As intergrade implies a meeting and merging of the 2 when really it is just a morphing of the pattern form from point A to point B, so therefore intermediate implies the point of change between the 2

 

[Timmy-Morelia]

ok we have people here saying that breeding diamonds with coastal is wrong i agree BUT they are as people have stated are the same species.
so yet know one seems to kick up a stink when you see someone breeding lets say a bredli with a diamond sure they look fantasic but in real life those two animal will never come across each other in the wild so why do it (no disrespect to the people cross breeding) im just having my say i love intergrades i bought one 4 yrs ago and here he is the mum was 100%diamond the dad was a natural intergrade

 

[Kam333]

ok we have people here saying that breeding diamonds with coastal is wrong i agree BUT they are as people have stated are the same species.
so yet know one seems to kick up a stink when you see someone breeding lets say a bredli with a diamond sure they look fantasic but in real life those two animal will never come across each other in the wild so why do it (no disrespect to the people cross breeding) im just having my say i love intergrades i bought one 4 yrs ago and here he is the mum was 100%diamond the dad was a natural intergrade

And black and white becomes grey, "pure" diamond x diamond carpet intergrade = hybrid according to popular argument?

 

[Timmy-Morelia]

lets keep it natural it looks better

 

[ForgottenXo]

How would you heat something like that, considering that diamonds dont need as much heat as a coastal...or even a Bredli x Diamond for that matter...

Boggles the mind!

 

[D3pro]

This thread is giving me dejavu.

The "Hybrid escaping and causing havoc" isn't, IMO, a good argument because a pure out of place sub-species could do the same "damage".
But then what kind of damage are we talking about? If a rouge would breed with the local population, the genes it carries would eventually be swallowed up by the locals.
(unless of course you would release 100s of hybrids at the same time)

The intergrade argument is beyond me. When does a sub-species stop becoming a sub-species? Or should the argument be ended by just taking out that extra name after Morelia Spilota?

How would you heat something like that, considering that diamonds dont need as much heat as a coastal...or even a Bredli x Diamond for that matter...

Boggles the mind!

You would have a hot spot and a cool spot so it can thermo-regulate :O

 

[Shotta]

here ill go ahead an post my albino darwin x Coastal nothing wrong with a mix
lol sorry had to resize them!!

 

[Kam333]

This thread is giving me dejavu.

The "Hybrid escaping and causing havoc" isn't, IMO, a good argument because a pure out of place sub-species could do the same "damage".
But then what kind of damage are we talking about? If a rouge would breed with the local population, the genes it carries would eventually be swallowed up by the locals.
(unless of course you would release 100s of hybrids at the same time)

The intergrade argument is beyond me. When does a sub-species stop becoming a sub-species? Or should the argument be ended by just taking out that extra name after Morelia Spilota?



You would have a hot spot and a cool spot so it can thermo-regulate :O

Morelia spilota. . . it is quiker to say than adding another word on. And if they really want more to add then all the local purist can just call it by its local M.S. palmerston local or MS pet shop local etc.

have a look at the thread regarding MD's in the Blue Mountains, it has been discussed there that you have no defining line from sub to sub. This is from field observations and not forum, web or captive observations. . . .I hope that made sense.

 

[ForgottenXo]

You would have a hot spot and a cool spot so it can thermo-regulate :O

Hahahahaha I understand that! I guess the actual heat requirements (how hot the hot end should be) is what im interested in with an integrade of multiple localities...like one from a hot climate and one from a cold climate. Im aware of thermo-regulating...i was just interested

Kayte Xo

 

[GeckPhotographer]

To clarify the term used is. Intra-sub-specific Hybrid.

D3's touched on an important argument in taxonomy at the moment. Lots of active scientists working on describing new animals are moving to a phylogenetic definition of species in which sub-species aren't used. More and more arguments are becoming present for sub-species being completely invalid. (Don't ask me to argue it, I agree with it but I agree based off the arguments I hear from much more experienced people not arguments I make).

 

[MR_IAN_DAVO]

Hahahahaha I understand that! I guess the actual heat requirements (how hot the hot end should be) is what im interested in with an integrade of multiple localities...like one from a hot climate and one from a cold climate. Im aware of thermo-regulating...i was just interested

Kayte Xo

First of all Snake_ Newbie get the snake that you want & like, that way you will be happy with it & it will be your decision.
If you listen to everyone on here you would not have one at all. They are too costly & if you have normal they are not worth breeding? if you have something different then you are a radical & not a conservationist? the list goes on, SO i am saying do listen BUT make up your own mind & get want YOU want, there will allways be arguements one way or the other.

Secondly with the heating question, that is a good one. I have given it some thought in the past myself & i am not saying that i know but this is how i see it.
I reckon that a lot of people keep thier snakes too hot anyway. An intermediate like a Diamond x Coastal, i would keep it cooler rather than warmer. As for Diamond pythons they only need a warm spot of around 30c give or take a couple of degrees for say daytime periods & should allways have access to cool areas & hides. This would allow any carpet python to warm up to working temperature.
Sure other snakes such as BHPs have a higher heat requirement, but we are not talking about them.
Just my two bobs worth.

Cheers
Ian

 

[ForgottenXo]

Secondly with the heating question, that is a good one. I have given it some thought in the past myself & i am not saying that i know but this is how i see it.
I reckon that a lot of people keep thier snakes too hot anyway. An intermediate like a Diamond x Coastal, i would keep it cooler rather than warmer. As for Diamond pythons they only need a warm spot of around 30c give or take a couple of degrees for say daytime periods & should allways have access to cool areas & hides. This would allow any carpet python to warm up to working temperature.

Thanks for the answer I have legitametly been wondering about it for a while. Would it also depend on the climate you live in? I mean, IMO an animal from Victoria would have a hard time settling into a climate in say, Emerald QLD... Localities and all that. It doesnt mean you CANT have them...would it just require more fine tuning?

 

[zulu]

Well somebodies obviously trying to mix them up, There are so many coastals in the wild here on the central coast. But I suppose that's good. I wouldn't like to get pedantic about it, they seem to go allright, ive found them breeding in the wild with diamonds and Ive found diamond cross jungle in the wild here too. I guess being the same species with the jungle that makes it ok too.

Oh thats right, your talking about PET snakes. Those ones that never escape.

People let the coastals go allot of the time cement its a real shame been happening for many years,ive caught coastals in diamond country also.
Places like gosford have been getting slammed for years,father told me who was born at kulnura said that snakes were bought by a big produce store back in the 1930s and the guy was told to buy them but didnt like them so he would just tip them over the side of the railway tracks.

 

[MR_IAN_DAVO]

Thanks for the answer I have legitametly been wondering about it for a while. Would it also depend on the climate you live in? I mean, IMO an animal from Victoria would have a hard time settling into a climate in say, Emerald QLD... Localities and all that. It doesnt mean you CANT have them...would it just require more fine tuning?

Mate exactly right imo. The climate anywhere has a part to play & you just have to fine tune the temps & enclosures to suite.
As an example here in Emerald CQ we do have to battle with high temps sometimes in summer, that is where you have to make constant decisions on what type of reptile to keep & how to house it, whether in an air conditioned room on a timer for summer or whatever. There can allways be a way to overcome problems if you just know the right requirments & then sought the right solution.
I have had personal experience with DPS here with my female Diamond RIP god love her.
I am working with a moderatoer & the author of some Diamond Pythons articles that will be soon posted in the wiki section of this forum(hopefully).
There is a great thread on Diamond Pythons just recently(i can't remember the heading) but in there Dee4 has said what he successfully houses his in & i reckon is spot on. Check it out.

Cheers
Ian

 

[Wookie]

Wow. So much herp derp on this thread. There is little difference between buying an intergrade or a cross bred snake. So go for it and buy one if that is what you like. How do we get intergrades if we don't take them out of the wild (which we arent' allowed to do)? We take two natural intergrades and breed them (breeding crossed sub-spec snakes)? Isn't that what you are arguing against? I do not understand the logic...

 

[AM Pythons]

View attachment 250292View attachment 250293pair of intergrade x coastals, 75%coastal,25% diamond....male on the left, female on right, there from the same clutch, 3 1/2 yo..

 

[cwebb]

. . . .
Because when a pure breed gets out into the wild it at least know better than to breed with the locals. And the hobby was kept pure right from the start even before the apparent sub sp got brought into it. Pure breeds are not responsible for diseases unlike those filthy hybrids. Terrorists are funded by Hybrid breeding, it is also a known fact that a jag was on one of those planes. If we let the snakes do it then people will think its OK for them to do it. There are no hybrids outside of the Matrix........

are you saying that all acts of terror in the.world happened because of jags ?

 

[Skeptic]

are you saying that all acts of terror in the.world happened because of jags ?

When the U.S got Bin Laden they found plans for terrorist attacks, pornography and Jags