GTP: Swelling, Cause for concern ?

Discussion in 'Herp Help' started by Drazzy, Apr 28, 2014.

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  1. Drazzy

    Drazzy Donator Donator

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    10276418_10152506684299050_1070047028_n.jpg Untitled-1.jpg

    Kind of worried for my pet Persephone, Here are pictures, zoomed in and out.

    There is swelling between the eye and heat sensing pits, I plan to see the vet mid week.

    Any ideas what it is ?

    Thank you
     
    Last edited: Apr 28, 2014
  2. eipper

    eipper Very Well-Known Member APS Veteran

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    Looks like something for concern.... It could be an abscess. Like any infection the faster you treat the better for the patient..... If it was me I would of already been to the vets
     
  3. Drazzy

    Drazzy Donator Donator

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    If only.
     
  4. Bushman

    Bushman Very Well-Known Member

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    It's normal for Morelia viridis to have subocular fluid deposit under the eye in the lead up to sloughing, although there seems to be more than usual in this case. It's typically a tell-tale sign that a slough is due soon. My theory is that this particularly thinned species exhibits fluid build up that pools into the supralabial scales directly below the ocular scale in the lead-up to sloughing.
    I wouldn't be too concerned and certainly wouldn't be rushing this snake off to the vet.
    Can you post pics of the other side of the head?
    If this swelling is associated with an imminent slough, as I strongly suspect, then there will be a similar or smaller swelling under the eye on the other side.
     
  5. andynic07

    andynic07 Very Well-Known Member

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    That is very interesting. Do you have anymore information on this at all like what stage of shed does this happen, are all GTP's effected like this and does it go away before actually shedding?

    My GTP is coming up to shed and out of interest I pulled its head up for a look and also took a picture. I can not notice the swelling in the picture.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
  6. Drazzy

    Drazzy Donator Donator

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    Thanks bushman =^.^=

    The other side is not swollen, also the lip on said swollen side from looking below her head, it is overlapping slightly, the overlapping part is slight tinge of brown ? I have booked earliest app for vet which is Wednesday this week.
     
  7. andynic07

    andynic07 Very Well-Known Member

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    Brown colouring does not sound good. Hopefully it is nothing to serious.
     
  8. Drazzy

    Drazzy Donator Donator

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    I hope the same..

    The vet called and said they will offer to sex the snake for free on the same app, but to my knowledge you cant do that to a GTP until they are 1 year old. >.<

    Feeling nervous about the appointment...
     
    Last edited: Apr 28, 2014
  9. ThatGuy

    ThatGuy Not so new Member

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    could it be early signs of mouth rot causing the swelling? The brown colouring doesn't sound good, when did he shed last and does he have any rough branches he could bash his head against in his enclosure? does he try and push the glass of the enclosure open with the side of his head at all? Anything that could create a small open wound around his mouth at all?
     
  10. andynic07

    andynic07 Very Well-Known Member

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    I bought mine just under 12 months old and the breeder did not sex it at that stage. I am not sure at stage they can be sexed at though.


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  11. Waterrat

    Waterrat Almost Legendary

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    Drazzy, I wouldn't let anyone to probe a juvenile of that size. I am surprised that the vet actually made such offer. Did you tell him/her that it's a yellow baby?
    To me, it looks like a water blister but can't tell for sure from the pic.
     
  12. Drazzy

    Drazzy Donator Donator

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    Not sure in the container is a:

    plastic garden trellis to climb on that was provided on purchasing the GTP 3 months ago.
    a small ceramic water bowl.
    paper towel.

    As for enclosure the python is in 5 litre plastic tub in temperature controlled hatchling rack.


    To make sure I will check the enclosure tonight.

    - - - Updated - - -

    This is why i worry that the vet wont know how to identify the issue.
     
  13. PythonLegs

    PythonLegs Very Well-Known Member

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    Hmph. What vet are you using?
     
  14. Bushman

    Bushman Very Well-Known Member

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    My pleasure Drazzy. Happy to help.
    Is she due for a slough? Has she gone at all milky or dull in colour lately? It's harder to see this in yellow juveniles, that's why I use the subocular supralabial indicator.
    The brown colouration is not necessarily a cause for concern either imo. I believe that as the fluid condenses or dries a little because of the quantity involved, it often discolours. Re: the overlap that you mention, is the top 'lip' overlapping the bottom lip?

    The fact that it's not bilateral, suggests that there could be something abnormal on the swollen side, as this indicator is usually present on both sides. However, I still would not be overly concerned. These things usually clear themselves up if the animal is kept under ideal conditions. Perhaps it's better to err on the side of caution and follow Scott's advice and get it checked out by a vet.
     
  15. Drazzy

    Drazzy Donator Donator

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    It is the top lip.

    Will see vet thank you again.

    - - - Updated - - -

    I dont think you can give company names nor individual names on the forum ? >.>
     
  16. Bushman

    Bushman Very Well-Known Member

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    No worries Drazzy.
     
    Last edited: Apr 29, 2014
  17. beastcreature

    beastcreature Suspended Banned

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    The swelling seems localized, in my experience pre-slough swelling tends to be less concentrated. It does look like a water blister or abscess of sorts.
    Nobody can point you in the direction of a herp vet?
     
  18. Drazzy

    Drazzy Donator Donator

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    Persephone Slough last night :D and the swelling vanished o.o so did the brown coloration under her upper lip; looks like your right Bushman :D :D

    Thanks everyone and sorry about the concern just I have lost a GTP before, so I am being over caring especially in the neonate stage.
     
  19. Bushman

    Bushman Very Well-Known Member

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    That's good to hear. These subocular supralabial swellings invariably disappear with the slough that soon follows. Other indicators that I look out for are raspy skin and an anterior mid-lateral skin fold.

    It's understandable that you were concerned, as these swellings are not mentioned in any literature that I know of. It's commendable that you were so observant as to notice, as most keepers don't notice them, although this one was bigger than usual. I've seen these swellings this big before though, and it's not necessarily a cause for concern and not a sign of poor husbandry, as occasionally they get noticeably large, even under ideal conditions.
     
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