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RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: MY FIRST VENOMOUS SNAKE HANDLE!!

If the snake did by chance escape, and let's face it, snakes are escape artists, then the snake wouldn't survive in the wild
that is a good point in reality because they wouldnt be native to the area.

Also no one glues snakes mouths together(i hope) thats why i pointed out what actually happens
 
RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: MY FIRST VENOMOUS SNAKE

ha, more venomoid sympathises. unbeliveable.! sounds like you might be in the wrong game too, try growing flowers instead.
 
RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: MY FIRST VENOMOUS SNAKE

That's funny, Wrasse!

I would like to see some of Australia's uni's offer a degree in Incompetence, with the option of post-grad work.

Incompetence 101 - Revoming Venom Glands Using Refridgeration as Pain Control, and Supporting Subject on Plank of Wood with Rusty Nails.
 
Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: MY FIRST VENOMOUS SN

TrueBlue said:
ha, more venomoid sympathises. unbeliveable.! sounds like you might be in the wrong game too, try growing flowers instead.

Who TB?

And flowers are also dangerous.... bees... hmmmm... plus hayfever... yep.. allergies...
 
RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: MY FIRST VENOMOU

No sympathy here for neither Ray or the Elapids he owns.
Sympathy is not in my vocabulary when it comes to items of no concern to myself. My statement is made in the attempt to have atleast 1 thread go past without the whinging, complaining & slagging which seems to be the norm.
 
Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: MY FIRST VENOMOUS SNAKE HAND

cris said:
for those that havnt heard about it he sticks them in a fridge(this makes them go into a state of torpor and MAY reduce or eliminate pain) then surgically removes the venom glands and replaces them with silicone implants, According to him all opperations have been successful without any casualties. The snakes feed soon after the surgery and apparantly return to the exact same life style as before(without being tailed, hooked and pinned).

Its abit like tail docking in dogs it is of benifit to the owner and animal alike but obviously alot of ppl think it is wrong.

Actually, this is NOTHING like tail docking in dogs. Which I might add, is now illegal and had no benefit to owner or dogs, it is purely cosmetic.

Tail docking was done when the puppies are a few days old. A scissor snip, tail is cut and either a quick cauterise to the tip, or a stitch. Very quick, I will not say it was painless, as the puppies would jump and yelp, so they clearly didn't like it, but over in less than a minute.

There is no way that sticking a snake in a fridge, then performing an open surgery, without anaesthesia or pain killers can be considered similar to tail docking.

Did I mention tail docking, for all it's quickness, is illegal due to unneccessary cruelty ? Yeap, I think I did.

'Devenoming' would be rather akin to debarking a dog, which involves a similar sort of procedure, although debarking is done under anaesthesia and with pain killers. Did I mention that debarking is illegal too ? Another unneccessary procedure.

I still don't understand how it can be that docking tails, quick and over in a minute, and debarking, done with anaesthesia can be illegal, and yet devenoming isn't. Go figure.
 
RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: MY FIRST VENOMOU

cris seems to think its a good idea.?? :shock:

...and JandC, dont know nor have ever spoken to the bloke.?? I dont care whos done it, but IMO ANYNOE who has to do such things to diplay reptiles for their safety is incompetent, period.
Ive displayed snakes over the years in display cages, pits etc, at schools, shows etc and have never had a problem with venomous snakes and handled them all.??
 
RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: MY FIRST VENOMOUS SNAKE

ha, more venomoid sympathises. unbeliveable.! sounds like you might be in the wrong game too, try growing flowers instead.
I admit i dont keep reptiles for the danger or to make me feel more secure as a man. I keep them because i find them interesting i dont care one bit about them being able to kill a captive elapid is the same thing to me even if it doesnt have venom glands. After all the only thing it can use the venom for is injecting into the keeper and i dont find that makes them any better(or worse) of an animal.

each to their own.
 
RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: MY FIRST VENOMOUS SNAKE

oooooooh.. Does Ray know this Wrasse??? Wow... that's the best statement yet... if this was a debate you clinched it! it's like you practiced that... Hands down it beats my "won't survive in the wild" and "if it aint broke don't fix it" comments.... (the latter being doctored to make it sound good)... I think we should put Wrasse and Ray in the same enclosure and let them debate it out.... I say.. without a doubt, Wrasse would win hands down...
 
RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: MY FIRST VENOMOU

I am NOT condoning what he does here.
I am simply asking that 1 thread go by without the usual comments associated with the names "Ray Hoser or Venomoids". It has all been said a million times before. We all know your opinion on the subject and honestly I think the majority can decide for themselves how they feel about the proceedure. It would of been nice if somebody could have shared the original posters excitement & maybe even encouraging them in this hobby. Instead it has yet again resorted to arguments for & against venomoids.
 
RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: MY FIRST VENOMOUS SNAKE

:shock: :roll: unbelivable, is that how you justify your stance.?? pretty lame.
keeping elapids has nothing to do with being a man and if people keep them for such reasons they also should not be keeping them. (funny how its the first thing that pops into your head.?)
Evolution has given these animals what they have and its part of what they are and if you truely belive that removing their venom glands is a justifiable procedure for any reason, let alone to make you feel safe then IMO you are definitly in the wrong game mate.
Try growing pansies, i think roses might be a bit risky.
 
RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: MY FIRST VENOMOUS SNAKE

I just signed the petition... disgustingly tho... only 1321 signatures and yet some 16548 visitors to that site... But I guess, as per usual, the populace go about their every day life with the attitude... what i don't know can't harm me

Well fooey to that... Everyone who has written on this thread surely must sign that petition (this is the first I knew it was there or even where it was).
 
RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: MY FIRST VENOMOUS SNAKE

JandC_Reptiles, encouraging someone to be happy and excited about a cruel act is cruelty in itself. Quite possibly the original poster had no idea how this procedure was performed.

Yes, we could have all kept quiet, but how would people learn about this sort of thing if we all shut up and keep it to ourselves.

Ray could have just as good a show with pythons and non ven colubrids.
 
RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: MY FIRST VENOMOUS SNAKE

"bad things happen when good men do nothing"

There are some topics that get people so het up they cannot help but voice their disgust and disapproval. The benefit of this is that those who were not aware or such an issue may be made aware.
 
RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: MY FIRST VENOMOUS SNAKE

I couldnt care less if you think the way i think is lame, Im not looking for an arguement i was just putting foward the way i see the issue. If you dont like it its your problem not mine.
 
Re: RE: Re: RE: MY FIRST VENOMOUS SNAKE HANDLE!!!!

TrueBlue said:
i find this practice totally and utterly incompetent, any body that has to remove venom glands from snakes to feel safe should NOT be keeping them in the first place.
I truley belive that it is about time that the bunch of incompetent fools that go under the name snakebusters need to be removed from the industry, by choice or force, and take up another profession.
maybe keeping budgies or goldfish would be more suited to their incompetence.

nicely said trueblue

couldn't have said it better my self
 
RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: MY FIRST VENOMOUS SNAKE

well i, for one, am glad that this post has continued the way it has. I had very little idea of this procedure and the debate has raised some interesting points. I have one question though, does the venom have any purpose outside of incapacitating prey? Does venom, specifically hemotoxic, aid with digestion for example?
 
tebz..... Glad you are so excited about your experience and hope you have more good times ahead.

As for the rest of you read the first post and start again... you should be ashamed of your behaviour... the post was not about you and your opoinions but about someone elses exitment.

Shame Shame Shame.
 
RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: MY FIRST VENOMOUS SNAKE

Does venom, specifically hemotoxic, aid with digestion for example?
apparently it makes no differance in australian species, but it does play a role for some exotic species. Also just as not all pythons constrict dead prey ot all elapids inject into dead prey.
 
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