Jags, for or against

[GeckoJosh]

Hey guys,

I thought it would be interesting to run an anonymous poll to gauge how the APS community really feels about the subject without the added peer pressure.

So here we go.

 

[IgotFrogs]

For reasons i gave in chat lol ....

 

[GeckoJosh]

Bump

 

[Bel03]

I would never personally own a jag, however i dont think its anyone's business if others do. It is the same as dogs really, some like cross breeds while others only go for pure's. At the end of the day, who cares if someone else has a different opinion to your own, we are individuals for a reason.

 

[abnrmal91]

I wrote this in another similar thread, it still suits.

"Is it just me getting a bit annoyed with all the fuss people are making over all this pure vs jag vs morph. Everyone will have their own opinion on what they like. There will always be people breeding pure reps, there will always be someone breeding something different (jag/morph/rpm). Find a seller who breeds what you want then buy from them. Don't worry yourself with what others are doing."

I would own a jag if I had more room, I voted for.

 

[emmabee]

different veiwpoint on jags

i personally own a mix of Jags, sibs pures and crosses of morelia.
i can say that the Jag nuro issues are nothing like you would be led to believe reading this forum and i also read in another thread that Jag breeders freeze the normals out of the clutch!
whilst some breeders who do it for the money might they are so few its a bit of a joke to state that. i have a Jag sib and the market over here for them is healthy.

as for the nuro stuff i have one that shows NO symptons at all and one who shows as a neck weakness. they are not thick or retarded snakes just a little uncoordinated (the bad one) they are active, healthy snakes who do just the same as all my other species.

im not just totally Jag mad as i own and seek to own many different pure lines of your natives (future list is BHP,darwins, rockhamptons and stimsons, current list inclued olives, womas and morelia)

i havent voted as i dont think its my place to, but before slating them i think some of you need first hand experiance of the issues and not just hear say.

if you want pures buy pures, if you want jags or crosses buy them! choice is a good thing for the hobby anywhere in the world and as long as the snakes are labelled what they are what is the problem????:?

 

[Boidae]

I do not like Jags, but I understand why a lot of people do. They are a beautiful and unique species.
But to me, no 'double het for this X whatever' morph will ever compare to a good old Bredls or Olive.
I just love how naturally beautiful our animals are.

 

[Amazing Amazon]

I think as long as the sellers give the buyers all the info on possible Neuro issues they are OK. I can't help but think that as more come onto the market they will just get sold without any info given on them. This is where buying from a reputable seller/breeder will come into play.
Paul

 

[emmabee]

I do not like Jags, but I understand why a lot of people do. They are a beautiful and unique species.
But to me, no 'double het for this X whatever' morph will ever compare to a good old Bredls or Olive.
I just love how naturally beautiful our animals are.

well said! i adore your natives such as the olives, womas and bredliand think they are simply amazing, my olive is stunning and very interesting to keep, but i keep morphs too and love them for a differet beauty.

 

[Vixen]

"Is it just me getting a bit annoyed with all the fuss people are making over all this pure vs jag vs morph. Everyone will have their own opinion on what they like. There will always be people breeding pure reps, there will always be someone breeding something different (jag/morph/rpm). Find a seller who breeds what you want then buy from them. Don't worry yourself with what others are doing."

There is one major flaw in that idea though why is why I am so against Jags. It's easy for people say well if you don't like them, find a breeder who focuses on pure lines etc. It's the fact that some Jag siblings can be passed off as 'pure' animals - it only takes one mistake for one to be bred into a line by accident, and then THAT seller goes on to sell babies unknowingly - and it will just dig a deeper and deeper hole and make it that much harder for us purists to know the origins of an animal and where some have been muddied. This could easily be fixed by blunt truth and honesty, but that's a world too perfect to even imagine!

That and the fact I have already been accused multiple times that my 'RP Coastals' indeed have Jag in them. They do NOT, they are a pure line thank you! Jags may be pretty but they just cause too much trouble in the hobby, even for people that have nothing to do with them - how dare people try and muddy my name and animals when I do my very best to keep away from the darn things.

Then back to the main point of opposition, that people breed them knowing they are producing inferior offspring that have neurological disorders. Don't try to sugar coat the fact, ALL jags will show signs of it at some point in their life, sadly some more than others.

 

[Cockney_Red]

I think as long as the sellers give the buyers all the info on possible Neuro issues they are OK. I can't help but think that as more come onto the market they will just get sold without any info given on them. This is where buying from a reputable seller/breeder will come into play.
Paul[/QUOTE
But this is just the point! down the line, the waters will be so muddied, that neuro issues will become the norm in all snakes. Comes back to "THE" point in the Jag debate, apart from the obvious greed of some.....If you love reptiles......"WHY" would you buy, or condone inferior herps, for the pretty factor...

 

[GeckoJosh]

Bump

 

[Amazing Amazon]

I think it is unfortunate they we now have them in the country. I don't think they are good for the hobby here at all. In saying that they are here to stay so I think the important thing is everyone doing their part in the education of what this morph actually entails. Yes the big issue is what has been previous stated as our lines all getting muddled. Maybe DSE / Wildlife Authorities need to look at the possibility of giving them their own species code. I know this would not fix the possible problem, but maybe it might help.
Paul

 

[smithson]

I say no to jags

 

[abnrmal91]

Bump

 

[Retic]

A very big yes from me, I particularly like the new XF.

 

[spotlight]

we live in a country that is full of amazing looking carpet pythons but still we have the need to smuggle in another ? and a unhealthy one at that!, i really dont understand this and im glad im in the against group of keepers and breeders because i can only see a unhappy ending for all Morelia in Australia.
it will not be long and pet shops will be selling the non jag siblings from jag breeders and from there who knows what will happen.

 

[Retic]

What's not to love ?

 

[Snake_Whisperer]

I've been trying to get my hands on a Jungle Jaguar but there is some sort hiccup with my recreational licence. I'm not giving up hope though.

 

[rockett85]

I started a similar thread a few days ago and it got very messy. I love jags i think they are amazing i have 1 and another on its way my current male does show signs of neuro but very very slightly (very occasional head shake) but i dont believe that it has an impact on its life (but who am i to say that i am not the snake). People just have to be honest in this hobby especially when it comes to the sibs there is a place for jags here in the Australian hobby but not for the dishonest people that try and pass them off as something they are not. Like it or not they are here to stay and unfortunately it is those dishonest people that ruin it for so many.