Buying Jags

[rick]

Same me and a few drinks do not help i probably read just about the first two lines and commented on it sorry mate
Honestly from my experience they are not as bad as people have said thats just from my few that i have and a few people i know?
Rick

PS maybe we can make them a little more stronger than the states ????????????

 

[ad]

Same me and a few drinks do not help i probably read just about the first two lines and commented on it sorry mate
Honestly from my experience they are not as bad as people have said thats just from my few that i have and a few people i know?
Rick

PS maybe we can make them a little more stronger than the states ????????????

My goodness, Rick you obviously havent read the thread or are aware of current issues amongst the jag breeders.


How can we make them stronger than the USA has tried??

Because your 4 snakes are ok - she'll be right hey.

The Devil from this site may not agree with you, he has a 3yo animal just starting to corkscrew everywhere that he wanted his money back for,
He also supplied an animal that the customer returned and he euthanized the animal and refunded the money. The snake showed severe neuro after being shipped airfreight.

The reason these threads are brought up, not because we are jealous, because we have concerns that you all know what you are doing with these animals. AS this has been brought to the forefront - ie it was all tried to be swept under the carpet for months to 'protect' the jags, this is why this thread exists.


You have just brilliantly highlighted the "she'll be right" attitiude of many and expressing your ignorance to the problem,

So, your customers will have no recourse whatsoever after the snake has left your house?

Simon is offering a 2 months guarantee,
CarpetPythons.com has no guarantee whatsoever,

Barramundi on the other hand - wants to cull 'comprimised' lines and try to minimize the issued animals in the country,
He is giving good guarantees with his animals.
http://www.aussiepythons.com/forum/australian-snakes-37/seasons-pairings-148548/


I think Jag buyers should be aware of their breeders attitudes and how they intend to manage this issue,
Are you a responsible one or a 'she'll be right' breeder?
Cheers
Adam


ps Simon, so depending on severity, if you dont euthanize it - will you re-sell it???????

 

[PimmsPythons]

My goodness, Rick you obviously havent read the thread or are aware of current issues amongst the jag breeders.


How can we make them stronger than the USA has tried??

Because your 4 snakes are ok - she'll be right hey.

The Devil from this site may not agree with you, he has a 3yo animal just starting to corkscrew everywhere that he wanted his money back for,
He also supplied an animal that the customer returned and he euthanized the animal and refunded the money. The snake showed severe neuro after being shipped airfreight.

The reason these threads are brought up, not because we are jealous, because we have concerns that you all know what you are doing with these animals. AS this has been brought to the forefront - ie it was all tried to be swept under the carpet for months to 'protect' the jags, this is why this thread exists.


You have just brilliantly highlighted the "she'll be right" attitiude of many and expressing your ignorance to the problem,

So, your customers will have no recourse whatsoever after the snake has left your house?

Simon is offering a 2 months guarantee,
CarpetPythons.com has no guarantee whatsoever,

Barramundi on the other hand - wants to cull 'comprimised' lines and try to minimize the issued animals in the country,
He is giving good guarantees with his animals.
http://www.aussiepythons.com/forum/australian-snakes-37/seasons-pairings-148548/


I think Jag buyers should be aware of their breeders attitudes and how they intend to manage this issue,
Are you a responsible one or a 'she'll be right' breeder?
Cheers
Adam


ps Simon, so depending on severity, if you dont euthanize it - will you re-sell it???????

i would most likely keep it so i can keep track of its progress for my own interest.
but if if i did sell it,it would be very cheap and the buyer would be made well aware of its condition and he will also be given 2 months to decide if her wants to keep it.

for people who might be interested,there is a great and honest thread that Roger started on the overseas forum. it is an interesting read from first hand reports from overseas jag owners and i would recommend anyone who is thinking of buying a jag in the future to check it out.
cheers
simon

 

[mojo73]

My goodness, Rick you obviously havent read the thread or are aware of current issues amongst the jag breeders.


How can we make them stronger than the USA has tried??

Because your 4 snakes are ok - she'll be right hey.

The Devil from this site may not agree with you, he has a 3yo animal just starting to corkscrew everywhere that he wanted his money back for,
He also supplied an animal that the customer returned and he euthanized the animal and refunded the money. The snake showed severe neuro after being shipped airfreight.

The reason these threads are brought up, not because we are jealous, because we have concerns that you all know what you are doing with these animals. AS this has been brought to the forefront - ie it was all tried to be swept under the carpet for months to 'protect' the jags, this is why this thread exists.


You have just brilliantly highlighted the "she'll be right" attitiude of many and expressing your ignorance to the problem,

So, your customers will have no recourse whatsoever after the snake has left your house?

Simon is offering a 2 months guarantee,
CarpetPythons.com has no guarantee whatsoever,

Barramundi on the other hand - wants to cull 'comprimised' lines and try to minimize the issued animals in the country,
He is giving good guarantees with his animals.
http://www.aussiepythons.com/forum/australian-snakes-37/seasons-pairings-148548/


I think Jag buyers should be aware of their breeders attitudes and how they intend to manage this issue,
Are you a responsible one or a 'she'll be right' breeder?
Cheers
Adam


ps Simon, so depending on severity, if you dont euthanize it - will you re-sell it???????

That would meaning culling every jag /RPM within Australia as there is no line that is better or worse than another. It is a genetic defect which cannot be bred out, the carpets with jaguar patterning come with the neuro issue just as animals with a lack of pigment tend to suffer a higher incidence of skin cancer. Its a great shame but that's the way it is; all the information is out there and it has been out in the open overseas for quite some time now.

At least when the zebra jungle carpet spontaneously appears in Australia you will be comforted to know that there are not the issues attached with it as there are with the jaguars!

 

[Jungle_Freak]

The zebras are another topic .
But they are a pure jungle morph etc

 

[mojo73]

The zebras are another topic .
But they are a pure jungle morph etc

Yes, but the crosses will be something to behold...

Just take a look at the zebra jaguars for starters!

 

[aussie-albino]

That is Spectacular 1 or 2 of those would be real nice.

cheers
Scott

 

[Braidotti]

Just wondering how much are these Jags and other morphs going for now.

 

[mungus]

i would most likely keep it so i can keep track of its progress for my own interest.
but if if i did sell it,it would be very cheap and the buyer would be made well aware of its condition and he will also be given 2 months to decide if her wants to keep it.

for people who might be interested,there is a great and honest thread that Roger started on the overseas forum. it is an interesting read from first hand reports from overseas jag owners and i would recommend anyone who is thinking of buying a jag in the future to check it out.
cheers
simon

Ahhh, this reply concerns me a bit Simon................
Why sell an animal with this servere condition to anyone ??
Sorry mate, but the word " cheap " has just taken on a new descriptive meaning.

 

[D3pro]

That would meaning culling every jag /RPM within Australia as there is no line that is better or worse than another. It is a genetic defect which cannot be bred out

A lot of people don't get this point. It is a genetic mutation that effect more then the snakes colouration. The neuro effect is part of the co-dom jag gene. You can not, by no mean what so ever, breed it out. The worst effected snakes will throw perfectly normal acting jags, while the best can throw the latter.

You want to keep jags you have to accept this. The most breeders can do is make the buyer fully aware of the condition.
I seriously doubt "guarantees" will last long. Eventually people are just going to have to come to terms with it.
This is not a bite at any jag breeder or at anyone who's felt ripped of from buying a jag.

Cheers,

 

[Gusbus]

the zebra one looks awesome but, alot of money to be spent on an animal that will tie its self into a knot.

 

[PimmsPythons]

Ahhh, this reply concerns me a bit Simon................
Why sell an animal with this servere condition to anyone ??
Sorry mate, but the word " cheap " has just taken on a new descriptive meaning.

it would be depending on the severity.its a case by case situation. if i wasn't confident that it would live a comfortable life i would be euthanaised. if it was having a casual head wobble every now and then but not having a problem doing every day things,feeding ,shedding etc,then i would either keep it to watch its progress. or if i put it up for sale ,the buyer will be made well aware of the condition and will be given 2 months to decide if they wish to keep it.i think this time frame is fair. i make a point to be very honest with people purchasing anything from me.if an python is a bit of a picky feeder ,i tell them before they purchace and offer my phone number if there are any issues.when i was breeding diamonds ,i made people aware on DPS and how to try and combat it. i can't give them a 10 year guarantee that it wont get DPS,i can just inform them of the issue.i'm not in it to make a quid,i do it because i want people to own and enjoy reptiles and get the right info.

So as a potential future breeder of a few jags them i'll go to the effort of putting the facts out there that i know of
-most or all have a neuro issue to a varying degree
- only a very small percentage that have a neuro issue severe enough thay they wont be able to live a comfortable life.some develop it earlier in life, some later
- no amount of outbreeding will get rid of it.it is part of the jag gene
-jag sibs don't get the neuro issue,they don't have the jag gene. if a sib has a neuro issue, its from another problem
-breeding 2 jags together will get 50/50 jags/fatal leucys
-they produce some hot bubs

a buyer is certainly at risk of buying one that may end up with serious neuro issues in the future. it is up to the buyer to do the research and up to the breeder to inform the buyer what can possibly happen to them. once this is done,the buyer knows the risks and accepted it.i am still happy to put a "guarantee" of 2 months on top of this incase an early issue arises.

as stated earlier, buyer be aware. if people have an issue with them ,dont buy them.they are here to stay.like them or not, we now have to live with them.

cheers
simon

 

[buck]

A lot of people don't get this point. It is a genetic mutation that effect more then the snakes colouration. The neuro effect is part of the co-dom jag gene. You can not, by no mean what so ever, breed it out. The worst effected snakes will throw perfectly normal acting jags, while the best can throw the latter.

You want to keep jags you have to accept this. The most breeders can do is make the buyer fully aware of the condition.
I seriously doubt "guarantees" will last long. Eventually people are just going to have to come to terms with it.
This is not a bite at any jag breeder or at anyone who's felt ripped of from buying a jag.

Cheers,

I totally agree with these points but I'm pretty sure you and others had a go at me for bringing this up a couple of days ago. "Sick of hearing it" was the wording from memory.

 

[buck]

it would be depending on the severity.its a case by case situation. if i wasn't confident that it would live a comfortable life i would be euthanaised. if it was having a casual head wobble every now and then but not having a problem doing every day things,feeding ,shedding etc,then i would either keep it to watch its progress. or if i put it up for sale ,the buyer will be made well aware of the condition and will be given 2 months to decide if they wish to keep it.i think this time frame is fair. i make a point to be very honest with people purchasing anything from me.if an python is a bit of a picky feeder ,i tell them before they purchace and offer my phone number if there are any issues.when i was breeding diamonds ,i made people aware on DPS and how to try and combat it. i can't give them a 10 year guarantee that it wont get DPS,i can just inform them of the issue.i'm not in it to make a quid,i do it because i want people to own and enjoy reptiles and get the right info.

So as a potential future breeder of a few jags them i'll go to the effort of putting the facts out there that i know of
-most or all have a neuro issue to a varying degree
- only a very small percentage that have a neuro issue severe enough thay they wont be able to live a comfortable life.some develop it earlier in life, some later
- no amount of outbreeding will get rid of it.it is part of the jag gene
-jag sibs don't get the neuro issue,they don't have the jag gene. if a sib has a neuro issue, its from another problem
-breeding 2 jags together will get 50/50 jags/fatal leucys
-they produce some hot bubs

a buyer is certainly at risk of buying one that may end up with serious neuro issues in the future. it is up to the buyer to do the research and up to the breeder to inform the buyer what can possibly happen to them. once this is done,the buyer knows the risks and accepted it.i am still happy to put a "guarantee" of 2 months on top of this incase an early issue arises.

as stated earlier, buyer be aware. if people have an issue with them ,dont buy them.they are here to stay.like them or not, we now have to live with them.

cheers
simon

I have to say I'm amazed that you would offer a 2 month guarantee on your Jags. Not having a dig at all here BTW. I think that if you were to tell a potential buyer of the risks and they continued to purchase an animal than it is at their risk. There are too many factors that could trigger the neuro which would be out of your control.
Someone said in another post(not sure which thread) about the breeders honesty with the neuro condition at the time of sale. I guess if someone is continuelly dishonest and selling known neuros word of mouth would soon tarnish their reputation as a breeder so the onus is on the breeder to do the right thing.

 

[MR_IAN_DAVO]

it would be depending on the severity.its a case by case situation. if i wasn't confident that it would live a comfortable life i would be euthanaised. if it was having a casual head wobble every now and then but not having a problem doing every day things,feeding ,shedding etc,then i would either keep it to watch its progress. or if i put it up for sale ,the buyer will be made well aware of the condition and will be given 2 months to decide if they wish to keep it.i think this time frame is fair. i make a point to be very honest with people purchasing anything from me.if an python is a bit of a picky feeder ,i tell them before they purchace and offer my phone number if there are any issues.when i was breeding diamonds ,i made people aware on DPS and how to try and combat it. i can't give them a 10 year guarantee that it wont get DPS,i can just inform them of the issue.i'm not in it to make a quid,i do it because i want people to own and enjoy reptiles and get the right info.

So as a potential future breeder of a few jags them i'll go to the effort of putting the facts out there that i know of
-most or all have a neuro issue to a varying degree
- only a very small percentage that have a neuro issue severe enough thay they wont be able to live a comfortable life.some develop it earlier in life, some later
- no amount of outbreeding will get rid of it.it is part of the jag gene
-jag sibs don't get the neuro issue,they don't have the jag gene. if a sib has a neuro issue, its from another problem
-breeding 2 jags together will get 50/50 jags/fatal leucys
-they produce some hot bubs

a buyer is certainly at risk of buying one that may end up with serious neuro issues in the future. it is up to the buyer to do the research and up to the breeder to inform the buyer what can possibly happen to them. once this is done,the buyer knows the risks and accepted it.i am still happy to put a "guarantee" of 2 months on top of this incase an early issue arises.

as stated earlier, buyer be aware. if people have an issue with them ,dont buy them.they are here to stay.like them or not, we now have to live with them.

cheers
simon

I agree Simone, Maybe I should just say +1 or 2.

 

[da_donkey]

i think i would rather have a 100% healthy snake that didnt look as "cool" as one that even had a slight tik.

And i dont think i would marry a really hot chick if she had tourettes.

 

[da_donkey]

can we drop the RPM name and just call them jags now that they have come out of the closet?

donks

 

[buck]

can we drop the RPM name and just call them jags now that they have come out of the closet?

donks

+1

(Geez I hate +1....)Lol

 

[D3pro]

I totally agree with these points but I'm pretty sure you and others had a go at me for bringing this up a couple of days ago. "Sick of hearing it" was the wording from memory.

No mate, I didn't have a problem with your thoughts, tho I am over this constant back and forth. What I said just then is the bottom line (so to speak). The rest is up to the individual buyer/seller to choose where to go from there.

Cheers mate

 

[junglepython2]

- no amount of outbreeding will get rid of it.it is part of the jag gene
-jag sibs don't get the neuro issue,they don't have the jag gene. if a sib has a neuro issue, its from another problem
-breeding 2 jags together will get 50/50 jags/fatal leucys
-they produce some hot bubs

cheers
simon

Breeding two jags together results in 50% Jag, 25% sibs and 25% fatal leucy's