Check this womaxcarpet

[S.D.]

http://www.aussiepythons.com/showthread.php?t=54862

Please read this thread. I don't want to start this debate here but true intergrades are naturally occuring animals, not to be confused with hybrids/crosses.

Oh I know that and I’ve read that thread before. What I meant by “getting into” was getting an intergrade line unnaturally and purposefully – a naturally occurring Diamond line that appears to have some Coastal in it and a Diamond crossed with a Coastal purposefully are two different things. But some people out there are more worried about selling their animals rather than owning up (and this seems to happen a lot more than people would like to admit) and just claim the “intergrade” clause. I mean the only way to call a person out on this is if they admit to it, and I’m sure a lot of us have seen and read the “Is This A Pure Diamond?” threads and it gets quite heated – and the results are:

20% say the animal is a hybrid,
20% say it’s an intergrade,
20% say it’s a Coastal,
20% say it’s a Diamond and,
20% (usually those with the experience and knowledge) say that you just can’t tell for sure.

I am REALLY hoping not to start all this over again either and in no way am I trying to get an argument going out of this, but I’m just saying I think there is a difference and you can get the two confused as we have all seen happen before.

 

[iceman]

thats just wrong!!!!

 

[Khagan]

Just a little info on Kara and Kevin at NERD...They are the foremost unethical breeders here...They have been at the forefront of basically ALL morphs here in the States..They use venomids at shows and let children play w/ them.

The Purists (ppl like me ) believe snakes should be as they are..this is a HUGE debate here...Purists and morph lovers...HUGE!

Many ppl I know who have many decades in Herpetology are trying to stop this disgrace to herps.

So please dont think its ALL of us..We are very passionate about stopping this..but money talks

Check out Snakehook.net..Brett Gardin owns the site and has decades of experience..(he was the 1st to speak up about them when nobody would) and theres a thread all about NERD..check it out

Was just looking at their site, it looks like they'll crossbreed/inbreed anything for a quick buck.. Like this 'thing' for example . http://www.newenglandreptile.com/available/showproduct.php?product=194&sort=2&cat=28&page=1

 

[TrueBlue]

ill just stick to my locale specific stuff, im not into playing god, (the devil is much more fun).haha.

 

[Rennie]

S.D. Fair enough, I know exactly what you mean now.

 

[Tatelina]

Please let it be sterile.

Agreed. First thing I thought was YUCK!


How much would someone pay for a mongrel like that?

 

[Isis]

Why do some humans think they can mess with Nature. It would be one of the wierdest looking things I have seen. Its a big dose of that good old human arrogance shining through again,"We are the master species, we will play with all things natural for our own amusement" Hmmmm and I thought there was only one Hoser on the planet....
In my opinion crossbreeding on purpose should be illegal. If its not stopped it will get to a stage where there will be no "true" species left other than a small population that will end up so inbred that they will have all the negative traits come through.

 

[Frozenmouse]

can you cross an elepid with a python ...freaky possibilities.. thorny devil cross perenti. leopard gecko cross kimodo dragon..
evoloution or revoloution..

 

[Vincey]

that snake is amazing..... i quite like it. imagine the colours and stuff when it grows...

 

[Horsy]

http://www.newenglandreptile.com/available/showproduct.php?product=280&cat=22&page=1

Well I personally think this one is stunning.

 

[junglepython2]

can you cross an elepid with a python ...freaky possibilities.. thorny devil cross perenti. leopard gecko cross kimodo dragon..
evoloution or revoloution..

Thankfully no.

Except for the naturally occuring carpet x tigersnake

 

[Charlie]

I actually think it's gonna look awesome when it's older, but still i'm with the majority and think it's wrong.

 

[beeman]

the people that are creating this rubbish shold be taken out the
back and shot, why do people have to try and stuff up the beautiful
natural variations that we have in the python species just for the
sake of doing so. VERY INFURIATING!!!!!!!!!!

 

[euan]

I have known Kevin for more than 15yrs and do not feel it is correct that you bring this personal attack onto this forum. Besides which your first paragraph is false.
Kevin has never been into wildlife for the money, because he makes money from wildlife does not mean he is in it for the money. He earns a living from wildlife and there is nothing wrong with that. Without dealers we would all still be in the dark ages with herpetoculture. Ask the old timers what it was like thirty and more years ago.
The hybrid debate is emotional and I do beleive this thread was not started as a debate but rather to show an interesting animal.
Kevin's hybrids have more to do with attaining a difficult breeding than money or anything else. Do you understand the mechanics that must have gone into such a breeding.The comments on such a cross genera breeding are what is interesting. The animal pictured has wonderful markings and a very interesting head, IMHO. I for one am very interested in how such a breeding came about. Not as simple I would think as putting two snakes together.
For the record I have never owned a spp hybrid and never will. But I beleive that everybody has the right to their views and not be infringed on by others. Unfortunately from your post you do not seem to beleive this.
It seems to be a sad direction that we are moving in, in that others feel their opinion overrides another's because they beleive they have the moral high ground. This vocal minority seems to beleive that they have the right to have laws enacted against those who follow a different lifestyle etc..
If someone engages in an activity you find objectionable then don't deal with them simple.
Euan




QUOTE=Cristina;856427]Just a little info on Kara and Kevin at NERD...They are the foremost unethical breeders here...They have been at the forefront of basically ALL morphs here in the States..They use venomids at shows and let children play w/ them.

The Purists (ppl like me ) believe snakes should be as they are..this is a HUGE debate here...Purists and morph lovers...HUGE!

Many ppl I know who have many decades in Herpetology are trying to stop this disgrace to herps.

So please dont think its ALL of us..We are very passionate about stopping this..but money talks

Check out Snakehook.net..Brett Gardin owns the site and has decades of experience..(he was the 1st to speak up about them when nobody would) and theres a thread all about NERD..check it out [/QUOTE]

 

[Horsy]

Here here, Euan.

 

[Khagan]

Kevin has never been into wildlife for the money, because he makes money from wildlife does not mean he is in it for the money. He earns a living from wildlife and there is nothing wrong with that.

If hes not into it for the money then why not just breed pure snakes? He could make a living still off that, without all the stupid crossbreeding and crap. You can go on all you like that people don't purposely make these crossbreeds etc for money, but imo higher demand and money than an average reptile is the only reason i see for making crossbreeds etc..

No one would go to the trouble of making some weird ass crossbreed or something if it didn't benefit them in some way, whether it be money or 'recognition'.

 

[rodentrancher]

Well I think that having a snake like that is nearly as bad as breeding labradoodles, beagadoodles etc etc. Why not keep them pure??? That is really bad taste stuff in my book. Cheers Cheryl

 

[Cristina]

If hes not into it for the money then why not just breed pure snakes? He could make a living still off that, without all the stupid crossbreeding and crap. You can go on all you like that people don't purposely make these crossbreeds etc for money, but imo higher demand and money than an average reptile is the only reason i see for making crossbreeds etc..

No one would go to the trouble of making some weird ass crossbreed or something if it didn't benefit them in some way, whether it be money or 'recognition'.

EXACTLY!

Thier are so many ANTI-NERD Herpslovers here....showboating venomoids in front of children... what kind of message does that send? If u have a true love for Herps than it isnt about $...NERD makes hundreds of thousandsof dollars...YEA hes not in it for the $$$

NERD will crossbreed ANYTHING it can...

 

[theduclos]

I don’t really have enough experience to comment on the snake. But do all you people not agree with cross breeding anything at all? For example look at the dog world you have all sorts of crosses. Rotty x boxer, lab x retriever, staffy x ridgeback (which happens to be my favourite cross) my ignorance will probably spark a debate but I just wanna ask. Crossing a dog doesn’t lead to anything that will cause the dogs life to be led in any way different to a pure, is it the same scenario with snakes? If so and crossing 2 breeds of snakes cause nothing more then an ugly/great looking pattern then why bother getting upset?

Don’t bag me out for being ignorant, if it is a different story with snakes then it is with most other domesticated animals (assuming that the reptiles in captivity are ‘domesticated’) just say so.

 

[Miss B]

^ I think the difference between dogs and snakes, is that man has already modified dogs to the point where most of them are absolutely nothing like their original natural form ... the wolf. We've got bulldogs with breathing difficulties, many breeds with hip dysplacia, etc - man has bred some pretty poor traits into dogs throughout the various domestic breeds available these days.

The thing with these snakes is that they are currently mostly in their naturally occuring form, and these hybrids would have an almost zero chance of ever occuring in the wild. The canine equivalent, for example, would be like crossing a dingo with a wolf, or crossing a wolf with an african wild dog (etc). That just wouldn't happen naturally, and it's bound to cause problems in the subsequent offspring of these pairings.

Oh and when they are selling their hybrids for US$15,000 I find it very hard to believe that they are not in it for the money. I personally don't agree with it, myself.