Diamonds and Temperature

[OuZo]

Thanks Oldfella, for a while there I thought everyone one on this site were novice herps.

As opposed to you oh holy ROCK :lol:. Sure you may have a lot more experience than most of the people on this site but that doesn't mean you have to act like you're superior and that everything you say is gospel. One thing I have "absorbed" as you put it from other herpers is that there are so many different techniques for keeping/cooling/breeding etc and most people find these diff ways work for them. As a long term keeper has said to me a few times before, ask 10 diff people a question about herps and you'll get 10 diff answers...that doesn't mean that any of them are wrong. I'm sure that there are more than just a few people out there who have kept Diamond Pythons alive for longer than 10 years without using your technique of cooling. And no, I'm not trying to disprespect you by saying this...I just find cockiness annoying

-Zo

 

[junglemad]

Rock made a few statements and because he has so few posts he was hammered for being a newbie and he wore a lot of 'who-is-this-guy??' attitude...he is obviously not a newbie to herpetology and it seems he is quite knowledgeable on Diamonds...
(crawls back into the corner with ears open)

 

[Hickson]

I don't think people are having a go at you so much Rob...just curious.

In case anyone has misinterpreted my posts, I'm not having a go at Rob per se, just some of the things he said. As I've already posted, his techniques obviously work for him, but other things work for other people, and Rob's methods might not work for everyone (eg. throwing away your thermostats if you live in Victoria).

Or is that your justification for stuffing them in the dark in an esky for a few months?

OK, I'll admit, that was a bit catty on my part and I retract that question.

But my original question still stands: How is mimicking Nature dangerous? I ask because I'm curious as to the answer. And possibly because Rob and I have different ideas as to what mimicking involves.



Hix

 

[Hickson]

Justification thats a big word for a Hix.

Had to laugh at that. And I imagine anyone else who's knows me would have laughed as well. :lol: :lol: :lol:



Hix

 

[Guest]

:lol: Well Hix are you a Fool or a Fanatic :?: Just wondered :lol:

 

[The Rock]

Ha Ha Ha, caused a bit of s--t there didnt I!. Love it. Yeah but your right, once I read it After I posted it, it did sound rather pompus and I do need to apologize to everyone as I did not mean it that way. I was refering to the way people werent reading the post properly or interpreting it the way I ment.This typing crap is a real mission for me that is why I gave my phone number (0408461471) for any one who wants an indeth chat on my hypothesis on Diamonds. If you would rather I didnt post my opinions at all, cool, cause I cant type so this takes me ages. But any way sorry did not mean any offence to any one.Love a good debate thou.
Rob

 

[The Rock]

Hix, YES I am saying throw away your thermostats in vic, (although no one will), because the way I keep my animals works better in a cold climate. My old snake room would drop below 5 degrees in winter and youd be amazed at how many species take advantage of those temps even when they have acsess to heat enough to keep their body temp at over 30 degrees. But like you say what works for some. Although if set up correctly its pretty mouch fool proof.
Rob

 

[diamond_python]

Welcome to the site Rob. I will sit back and absorb all information as I have a Diamond who is over a year old now and has never been cooled and I don't know how to do it.

 

[Retic]

Yeah what do they know about breeding pythons :lol:

That method of sticking diamonds away in boxes for weeks on end sounds very American actually.

 

[The Rock]

soulweaver

No I do not feed my Diamons during cooling. Although all my other Pythons get fed during the mating season with cold nights and hot days but once fed the heat stays on until feed is digested, then back to cold nights, hot days, and, plenty of mating. Most Pythons only need a week or two of cooling (hot days, cold nights) before they are willing to start mating. Some none, they will go straight into cooling and mating at the same time, always with success.
I better clarify one thing at this time. I have recently moved north and because I cannot get the desired cold temperatures over winter until I set up a cold room I have left my Diamonds with a colleague down south, to be fair to my animals. I will be setting up a cold room in the next year or two and will get back into breeding Diamonds. PS I am dictating to my girlfriend hence the speed and no spelling mistakes!
Rob

 

[PilbaraPythons]

Rob put away the billy and you will type quicker.

 

[serpenttongue]

Hey Rob, hows things. Good to see you've adopted Stan Chiras' method for cooling down diamonds, but are you aware that he ended up killing off all his adults because of it ?

For all those that are interested, i have been keeping diamonds since 1987 and have been breeding them since 1994. All mine are outside. They are not fed from late April to mid November. Every day of winter they bask as long as the suns out. Nightime temps where i live fall to 9 degrees or less and daytime temps will rise to 24 degrees (on a good day). Diamonds love the cold during winter. They thrive on bloody cold winters.

I have also bred diamonds indoors. They are given no heating throughout the night and i dont allow daytime temps to go higher than 24 degrees. Indoors, diamonds DONT need a dramatic drop in temps to get the hint its winter and start breeding but i believe they DO need dramatic drops in temp for their own health and well being. Diamonds that have their temps dropped very low during winter come out of brumation so very alert, so very lean and absolutely glowing with vitality. For the novices, dont be scared to keep them cold during winter, as long as the have the opportunity to bask for several hours a day they'll do well.

 

[dee4]

Thanks for a little bit more info on Diamonds Rob, it never hurts to have knowledge and to share it. I am no expert and I doubt whether I will ever have experience as vast as yours and some others that frequent this site. I have a diamond and a few more will be coming my way so I will keep your info and your number and will definately be giving you a call at some stage. Thanks again Rob

To all the critics:
Ppl winge because there are supposed secrets in breeding and others just don't pass on info to others ppl's liking. May be if you wish to know something then you should ask the people that actually know rather than the one's that think they do.As soon as someone comes on here and attempts to pass on something there is always someone to shoot them down thinking they know better.
It's plain to me that what works for some may not work for others but for christ sake why don't people just take what they wish and dicard what they deem uselss.
Keep up the good work all you critics as that's the way to keep this forum running.

 

[lutzd]

Well, that was entertaining! And I'm very impressed by the civil discussion from you all! ;-)

Welcome to the site, Rob.

A lot of us here are certainly in the beginners category, and we appreciate friendly advice and help from more experienced people. I'd like to take this opportunity to ask yourself, oldcodger, bigguy and all the others who have had lots of experience to share their knowledge with the rest of us. To that end, we would really love it it you could use the Contact Us link (at left) to submit any articles that you think might help other enthusiasts that don't have your experience.

Obviously there will always be people who will disagree with anything posted, but my opinion is that there is usually something to be gained by reading other's experiences. It's not hard to analyse something you read and make your own decision whether to use it or not.

 

[playwell]

Hey Rob, hows things. Good to see you've adopted Stan Chiras' method for cooling down diamonds, but are you aware that he ended up killing off all his adults because of it ?

For all those that are interested, i have been keeping diamonds since 1987 and have been breeding them since 1994. All mine are outside. They are not fed from late April to mid November. Every day of winter they bask as long as the suns out. Nightime temps where i live fall to 9 degrees or less and daytime temps will rise to 24 degrees (on a good day). Diamonds love the cold during winter. They thrive on bloody cold winters.

I have also bred diamonds indoors. They are given no heating throughout the night and i dont allow daytime temps to go higher than 24 degrees. Indoors, diamonds DONT need a dramatic drop in temps to get the hint its winter and start breeding but i believe they DO need dramatic drops in temp for their own health and well being. Diamonds that have their temps dropped very low during winter come out of brumation so very alert, so very lean and absolutely glowing with vitality. For the novices, dont be scared to keep them cold during winter, as long as the have the opportunity to bask for several hours a day they'll do well.

Well, I thinks SP you have shown your true and practical experienced opion here today.

I agree with you totally(After watching your comments for many months)

I have tried to understand many points of view about Diamond Python care and read many things and had my own experiences with diamonds.

I would not be prepared to stick my snakes in a box for 3 months with no escape, or temp gradiant.

P.S. SP, why do you have Micky Rooney as your avator. it has me very curious :?:

 

[Guest]

The old codger knows squot he spent too much time yahooing and chasing chickybabes so he asks others try Shanes aussie pythons i think he might be able to lend a little help to people in regards to keeping and breeding snakes,he absolutely lives for it. :!:

 

[The Rock]

Lutzd, Thanks for the welcome. I must at this point stress that cooling Diamonds my way is only because I live north of the boarder, (I keep forgetting that theres a part of OZ below QLD ha ha ha.) Other wise it would be silly not to keep Diamonds in averies

Serpentoungue, Who the ---k is stan chiras

Rob

 

[The Rock]

Oh pilbarapythons you are gracing us with your presence how lovely.May the lord some day poo upon your head. LOVE IT!!!!!!!!!>

The Rob to you.
ha ha ha.

 

[Retic]

There is a well known breeder who has kept his Diamonds indoors for 15 years and has bred them very successfully and probably has some of the best looking Diamonds anywhere.
It has already been said that if you ask 10 people for advice you will get 10 different views, all of them right and all of them wrong.
One aspect of all this that worries me is the thinking that you will only succeed if you do it my way. If that indeed were the case then these snakes would be extremely hard to come by.
I have been keeping reptiles for almost 30 years (I started very very young) and am always willing to learn but my experience has told me to view all advice with some scepticism.
Diamonds in some ways are a special case but I think some keepers maybe like to wrap them in cotton wool.
Something I am interested in is the thinking we should throw away our thermostats, I have used them for 20 odd years and have never had one cause a problem, I would like to hear more about this subject and how temperatures acn be controlled without their use.

 

[The Rock]

boa, Exactly my point most people do tend to wrap Diamonds and most other pythons for that matter in cotton wool, they just havent got the balls to risk what are believed to be risky temperatures in captivity for pythons.
OK how I go about achieving my constant heating and constant cool area is quite simple really. Most of my enclosures are in banks of 3 high. The bottom enclosure has a light fitting coming out from the back of the enclosure so that the bulb itself is only a half an inch to an inch from the bottom of the above enclosure, which provides a heat pad for the above enclosure, it is situated at one end of the enclosure, roughly half way is a division. The snake can go from one side to another and thermo regulate its temperature anytime it wants. For larger enclosures there is always a large cardboard box ie. apple box, that the python can lie on top of and get only a few inches or so away from the bowl. I only use 15 - 40 watt blue bulbs, occasionally 60's when an extreme cold snap hits and the animals are being cooled ie. hot days cold nights, depending on size of the enclosure. By doing this the reptile has the same environment or as close to as possible as it does in the wild. Let's face it if a snake gets cold it seeks out warmth, if a snake gets too warm it seeks out cold. By doing this there is no maintenance, the reptile pretty much looks after itself except for feeding and cleaning. If a heat wave comes thru the cold side is always room temperature so the snake cannot be cooked. If a thermostat misfunctions during a heat wave, or like alot of people large wattage bulbs are used, the reptile will be cooked. 60 watt bulbs are only used occassionally in extreme cold and only for cooling as 15-40 watt bulbs will not burn your animals and sufficient heat can be supplied to the animal to reach a body temperature of well over 30 degrees by only using 40 watt and below. Because the heat is on constantly and only turned off by timers when the snake room reaches above 30-32 degrees the reptile can bask indefinitely to stay at what ever temperature it desires. Let's face it the bigger the temperature gradient we can supply to pythons the better they will be as long as they always have a hot spot.
Rob