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Waterrat

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There is a post in another thread from Herptrader saying: “Standing still at this stage of the hobby's development is pretty much going backwards!” These people should know what is going on! I hinted on my views of the reptile-keeping hobby in another thread and received few emails asking; “what do you mean?” As much as I hate predictions and the crystal ball, there is some writing on the wall and this is my interpretation of it:

Herpetoculture in the US took a considerable dive this year (perhaps even earlier). The Expos and reptile shows that once attracted thousands of visitors and exhibitors, are now half empty, some were even cancelled. That’s not to say that this will influence the Aussie scene but looking at all the other trends, the chances are that it may.

It seems to me that our hobby has reached the point of saturation and the recruitment has slowed down. Thanks to the low prices, most serious reptile keepers already have all they ever wanted to have and this will affect the already shattered market. In the not so distant past, breeders made money from sales of their offspring and spent the money on buying other reptiles – this is not likely to continue because currently there are more reptiles on the market than buyers and even the dirt cheap stuff is not selling.
Another factor is - every keeper has his / her threshold. We all have our limitations when it comes to expanding our collections. Constraints such as shortage of room, more time spent on maintenance, costs (the ever increasing power bills, increasing costs of reptile food, vet bills, etc.) and family relations e.g. when missus say ‘enough is enough’, these facts can't be ignored.
The increasing costs may lead to downsizing of collections, which means more animals for sale … and they would be hard to offload, as most keepers prefer to buy juveniles.
All this may also have a snowballing effect on manufacturers and retailers of equipment and reptile foods.
If the NSW Gestapo steps in with the proposed cage size restrictions and some action on jags, that would be another nail in the coffin.

It’s not all doom and gloom, we will be swapping reptiles rather than selling and buying like in the old days and those who entered this “industry” for the wrong reasons will fall out, making the hobby cleaner and more respectable.


Cheers
Michael
 
I agree with you Michael, seeing thousands of reptiles on dozens of sites, especially those which are now almost commonplace on the market - Jungles, Macs, Coastals, Beardies - makes me wonder how long it will be before we start seeing reptiles in the RSPCA and mass reports of animals released into the wild
 
Well, I reackon it's a double edge sword situation at the moment. It's harder for breeders to move their excess at the moment and prices are dropping. In the same respect the low prices are enticing albeit slowly new people into the hobby. The real problem is with the availability of cheap specimens it ain't that expensive to obtain a pair, pairs are bred to hopefully recoup some money or for learning and hatchilings flood an over saturated market already.

On the flip-side with the licensing laws changing in Vic and a few more species added to the list, the ones we could not get access to before will most likely boom in the next few years as the peeps in mexico quench their thirst for species they were forbidden to keep before. This is already happening to the new gecko species added to the Victorian list.
 
I posted this on another forum earlier.

You have quoted a different poster in your title to the one that made the plateau comment.
To plateau is to level out so if you looked at activity levels in the hobby on a graph it would be a straight line, more or less.
In my opinion to say the hobby was plateauing would depend on what level you are in the hobby.

If you were a higher end breeder who had paid substantial money for pairs of some of the more top end morphs or breeds and with the drop in prices, some would consider it fair to say the hobby is in a downward spiral.

If you were mid level making a bit of pocket money and subsidizing your hobby by paying a few expenses, then you may have found it a bit more difficult to move animals and had to drop prices but still made ends meet, that would be a plateau.

If you were just starting out in the hobby with a first snake say and along with all the other people in the same boat who are able to afford cheaper animals and indulge in their interests by expanding collections and attracting new people to the hobby it may be fair to say the hobby is growing.

Pretty basic example of plateauing and market trends I know, but that,s my simplified take on things.
 
Interesting but as long as there are shops and breeders who sell reptiles the hobby will stay alive.
Thats the point though, there are so many people who breed as a hobby (nothing wrong with this if thats all its done as, a hobby, not a money making venture) that there are too many reptiles available at such a low cost, but there arent enough people to buy the animals
 
Not all aspects of the hobby are experiencing a downward trend. You might be experiencing that with greens but in the mean time the morph market is booming. Food producers are also laughing all the way to the bank. Maybe you should breed rats instead of greens Michael?
 
So, WHAT im not going to make my millions now.Gee i only started keeping-breeding reptiles 18 odd years ago to make millions and retire on a desert island..Oh well looks like im staying here in Aus...lol..Totally agree Michael,TOOO many reptiles being bred compared to how many people that are buying them..Look at Aspidities for instance,2-3 year ago you couldnt get one cheaper then $500-$700 each,now there $250each...Greens-$4500 now $1000 and the list goes on..Sellers are having trouble unloading Jungles for $100-$150 each,Coastals $50each...If only bugga all reptiles were bred for a few years,then maybe there may be a increase in sales,especially if more people got into the hobby..Now the new morphs are in,SOME are getting in early,as with all the newer snakes in the hobby,the people who get in quick can generally make a few $$$..Same thing that happened with the Albino Darwins,those who brought them years ago and bred them did make a few $$$..My 2cents worth..
 
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Not all aspects of the hobby are experiencing a downward trend. You might be experiencing that with greens but in the mean time the morph market is booming. Food producers are also laughing all the way to the bank. Maybe you should breed rats instead of greens Michael?

I don't think it's the greens, the blacks, the blues or oranges and I don't even see any morph market? Where is it?
I hear from a big rodent breeder the very opposite to what you're saying. Perhaps it's because I live on the opposite side of the town. LOL
 
Seems it is heading the same direction as the rest of the world (UK, USA). Whether that is good or bad depends on your personal opinion.
 
this is a passion, Not a hobby, and the people that feel the same way about this passion will stick through it thick and thin.. 90% of us are here due to a Sheer Love for these animals and their Protection.. If WE want this "Hobby" to last, we can make it last..
 
It's a catch 22. We are desperately trying to recruit new herpers trough expos, pet shops, forums, etc, because we believe the growth will support the hobby. These new recruits will buy X number of animals, breed them in a year or two and then try to sell XXXXXXX number of animals. Is this good or bad for the hobby? Just a thought.
 
It's a catch 22. We are desperately trying to recruit new herpers trough expos, pet shops, forums, etc, because we believe the growth will support the hobby. These new recruits will buy X number of animals, breed them in a year or two and then try to sell XXXXXXX number of animals. Is this good or bad for the hobby? Just a thought.

Good for people getting in, bad for people trying to recoup expenses and make money
 
this is a passion, Not a hobby, and the people that feel the same way about this passion will stick through it thick and thin.. 90% of us are here due to a Sheer Love for these animals and their Protection.. If WE want this "Hobby" to last, we can make it last..

Of course it will last. It lasted for decades and will last for decades in the future BUT it will be very different to what it is today. We probably won't call it "industry" or even "hobby" any more.
You are probably referring to a small, dedicated group, which will not be able to stage Expos, Reptile Festivals, etc.. We would be that much poorer.
 
As well as a flooded market individual state laws inhibit industry growth. It will be interesting to see what happens to the market over here in WA over the next couple of years, with the possibility of new species available and an easier system WA it is still yet to flourish. On the other hand DEC is likely to keep a firm thumb pressed on the heads of keepers here and continue to impede growth
 
Maybe if there was a way to limit the amount that is being breed, might be able to stop the market from being flooded, like a breeders licence. So that way it amount of reptiles could be controlled and the price might be abit more stable.
Just a thought.
 
There are several factors involved in the slowing of the market, increased breeding success being one of them. Another factor that is more apparent than ever is new keepers desperate to offload their impulse buys. Realising once the gloss wears off their purchase that there is real work and cost involved in their investment long term, they advertise them at decreasing cost just to be rid of them. This has a real impact on the market value of many species, as it adds a competitive edge in the market place and drives prices down.
 
Is the reptile hobby on a downward spiral? No
Is the reptile industry? Yes
 
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