Rats V's Mice, which is better?

[Manda1032]

The question is;

Which is better to feed your snake, Rats or Mice?

The reasons behind this question/ debate. I have been keeping for 6 years now. Recently I've decided I'd like a new addition to my brood. There are many wants and desires but I'm being smart and thinking of what room I have and it's future needs etc. Many years ago when I use to live in Townsville, food got scarce and I decided to by some rats and mice and breed my own. The mice bred like... well mice! The rats on the other hand found most disturbances too much and would abandon their bubs and stop breeding (mostly thanks to the cat two doors down that always found a way in and sat on their cage). For the last couple of years I have sucessfully bred a small hoarde of mice, replacing the genes every 6 months or so. My freezer is full, my cages are full and with some fine tuning over that time finding enclosures that worked really well. They breed like crazy, don't care about the foxes, cats and other feral rodents that frequent where I live. Something that rats would mind.

So the other day I found an ad in the paper for BHP's. I'm like OMG one of my desires, possibly local to purchase. Phoned up and asked the usual questions, where are you, how old are they, what are you feeding them etc. its the last one that shot my confidence dead. I was told that I shouldn't be feeding my babies mice, they are not good enough and I'd never get them onto rats (PS 4 of my 5 snakes gladly eat both rats and mice). I should put them on rats and stay on rats. They (mice) aren't as nutritional for snakes as rats and I pretty much got the feeling that if I don't get rats I won't get a snake.

All night I felt like I'd done wrong by my babies. I was so sad thinking I've harmed their health all because I didn't try harder to find supplies for them. Locally there's nothing, and costs for bulk are huge. I'm doing right for the mice, I mix top quality foods for them and give them fresh fruit and veg daily. I ensure my mice are top quality because they go to my babies. I've gone thru every magazine and every book I own and none say anything against mice as food. My snakes are plump, clear eyed, smooth scaled, healthy, active snakes. I do not feed weekly and I do not offer too much food in one sitting. Poor Ross was trying to tell me that I'm a good mum and my bubs are A ok, but I just have to ask is there really a difference?:?

 

[1woma]

I'll keep an eye on this thread as im interested to know to

 

[saximus]

Look up nutritional value tables. I'd do it but I'm on tapatalk and it's too hard. I think when you compare small adult rats to adult mice they have better protein vs fat and also have denser bones. Large rats have a lot of fat though so can be kinda bad. Heaps of people feed ants exclusively on adult mice with no real issue so you shouldn't feel bad.

 

[beeman]

Your not doing anything wrong at all feeding mice, The person you were talking to has the wrong information!
The benifit of feeding rats come with keeping large snakes, easier to feed one or two rats than 15 or so mice.

 

[nico77]

I think the only difference is that the rats have more calcium and hair at the same size as mice and also once your snakes get big it can be a pain trying to feed them lots of mice instead of 1 rat ( thats if they wont go from mice to rats) , i still have a few that only take mice but they are starting to take fresh killed rats now .

cheers nico

 

[saximus]

The other obvious advantage to using rats is size. You'd never feed an adult BHP on mice just because of the sheer number you'd require every feed

 

[Waterrat]

Manda, this a prey nutrition table. Unfortunately, they didn't include small rats and they also omitted roughage contents, which is very important. Adult mice are better than small rats because of the higher values of calcium, phosphorus and roughage.

 

[wokka]

Before you start to compare nutritional values of various foods for snakes you need to know what is the optimen nutrtional requirement for snakes. Just because higher protein, up to a point, benefits growth in mammals; it does not necessarily mean that the same applies to snakes. Similarly, what is the optimen calcium phosphorus or roughage percentage for snake food?

 

[Waterrat]

Similarly, what is the optimen calcium phosphorus or roughage percentage for snake food?

If you know that wokka, then tell us. I am not aware of any studies being done on optimal requirements. Gavin Bedford may shed some light on it, he has done his PhD on snake's digestive processes, it would be as close as one could get.

 

[wokka]

My point is we don't know. I doubt that there is any detectable difference in performance between snakes fed on rats and snakes fed on mice. Then again , What parameters of performance are important?

 

[Waterrat]

I would always prefer to feed adult mice rather that equal sized rats (weaners). Reason: adult mice have well developed bones and gut contents. For the same reason I switch juveniles from pinkies to fuzzies as early as practical.

 

[Manda1032]

Thank you all so very much for your input. I know the benefits of size for obvious reasons, but with a freezer full I don't care that Malachi can take up to 5 adults in one sitting. I knew I'd have to upgrade one day but with the Georgetown only eating mice (I was told he took both and ate well, but I have had this snake for 4 years and he has only just started to strike food in the last year) and the other Antaresia only ever eating a couple each feed I didn't see a point of upgrading til Malachi was bigger. I know breeding mice would be futile if I only ever had large snakes like carpets and with the disturbances I didn't want to travel to the city to find nice rats to try and breed with again.

The person who told me this is a breeder of BHP's and other large snakes like carpets etc also had lizards and from what I can gather many many years of experience. I on the other hand have only kept for 6, but worked in the pet trade for half of my life. I know I don't know everything about reptiles and just the thought of doing wrong scares me. I also thought adult mice would be more beneficial than baby rats because their bodies had developed.

 

[Sel]

Your not doing anything wrong at all feeding mice, The person you were talking to has the wrong information!
The benifit of feeding rats come with keeping large snakes, easier to feed one or two rats than 15 or so mice.

I agree with this ^
I dont see any difference in either, just alot of people feed rats because they are larger and they need a larger meal.
This question has been asked before, if you do a search im sure you will find the same answers.

If you have Anteresia, i dont see the need in upgrading to rats??