Take a look please.

[Lizard]

http://www.aussiereptileclassifieds.com/phpPETITION/

 

[JandC_Reptiles]

*yawn*

 

[Australis]

Very good

 

[NoOne]

About time something was done about that, some big names on that list to, i saw Mark O'shea in there somewhere, good to see it's got international support.

 

[soulweaver]

I have signed, couldn't agree with it more.

I agree duga, good to see some big names backing it.

 

[Kersten]

Perhaps it should be pointed out to those who perhaps haven't read through all the pages on the site that the animal in the picture hasn't been anesthetised for surgery, and there's no pain relief of any kind given to them before, during or after. That's nothing to yawn at IMO.

 

[JandC_Reptiles]

And maybe I should point out that what you have just pointed out has already been pointed out 10000 times on this site as well as 2 handfuls of others. I yawn because I am sick of hearing about Ray & his un-ethical proceedure.

 

[stencorp69]

*yawn* *yawn* & get a life, if it was anyone else it would barely raise a whisper.

In a closed society where everybody's guilty, the only crime is getting caught. In a world of thieves, the only final sin is stupidity.

 

[JandC_Reptiles]

Agreed.
And even if the snakes were anesthetised before surgery the majority would still be whinging about it because "Elapids should remain venomous"

 

[mertle]

I don't think it matters how many times we hear about it, it still needs to be stopped, i signed it because it needs to be done.

 

[OuZo]

Call yaselves Herpetologists do ya? :x

ADMIN!!! CAN WE PLEASE HAVE A VOMIT SMILEY IN HERE!?!

 

[NoOne]

I don't think it matters how many times we hear about it, it still needs to be stopped, i signed it because it needs to be done.

Exactly, does it really matter how many times we have heard it, someone has finally done something about it.


So if you think it's wrong sign it, if you don't care then don't sign it, but don't whinge about the people who are signing about it or the fact that something has been done.

 

[JandC_Reptiles]

Rays argument will be that they serve an educational purpose for his displays. For that reason it will not be stopped. Better, safer & more humane techniques during surgery may be employed at the most, but you won't be able to put a complete stop to it.

And I garuntee even if/when that was to happen we will still read several hundred posts about how if Ray wanted non venomous snakes he should keep pythons etc.

 

[Kersten]

:lol: :lol: Yes Sir Mr Stencorp Sir (whoever you are?) you let me know how I go about doing that and when I officially have a life now wont you? :lol: :lol:

Anyway to get back to the topic at hand and away from petty personal judgements....

Yes actually I would still voice my concerns J and C....for the simple fact that I don't merely have one reason for objecting to it but many well considered reasons. I didn't realise we were only allowed one particular objection :wink:

(oh and PS...I actually tried to circumvent the Hoser debate in a thread the other day due to it's not being appropriate to the message the person who started the thread was trying to get across...this however is a time when it's actually the topic at hand...so where's the problem in discussing it maturely?)

 

[JandC_Reptiles]

There is no problem in discussing it.
And there is no problem in yawning about it either.
However you chose to direct your attention to me so I replied.
So what exactly is your objections Kersten?

Ouzo, no I do not consider myself a Herpetologist as I have had no formal & accredited training in that area. I am merely a Reptile keeper. How about you?

 

[Australis]

The petition is against the illegal manner Ray performs the voiding.

Im sure he would say he does it for education, but in reality hes doing it for profit.



Matt

 

[JandC_Reptiles]

Nothing illegal in what he does.
He has advertised publically what he does & has even included photo evidence. As for profit he does not sell the animals he displays them which will just help his case (claiming educational purposes)

My point is that the most anyone can ask for is more humanity in his approach. Do you really think this is the first time people have tried to stop venomoids?

 

[Kersten]

Advertising soemthing doesn't make it legal, does it? I see an awful lot of research and reasons on that site which justify why the people who've started the petition consider it to fall outside the law....

 

[OuZo]

My point is that the most anyone can ask for is more humanity in his approach. Do you really think this is the first time people have tried to stop venomoids?

How about some humanity?

I'm not even bothering to assess the actual venomoid issue. It's the manner in which it's done. If someone took their snake to a reptile vet and asked for it to be voided that's fine. But you don't operate on anything without an anaesthetic :roll: . How could you justify that?

 

[MrBredli]

But you don't operate on anything without an anaesthetic . How could you justify that?

Touché.