waruikazi
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And did it hurt?
Does anyone know how Jonno from ERD is?
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Jonno from ERD
Very Well-Known Member
The recovery is going well, I'm doing a bit of typing as it is helping the swelling in my hand decrease.
Aaron,
The bite happened around 11:15am on Saturday. I think you need to do a bit more research on the incident with the loose Collett Snake fang, as I wasn't envenomated and the entire process was simply following protocol of the facility I was working at. I wouldn't consider that a bite, considering the fang wasn't attached to the snake.
I think you will find that by me saying "it was 100% avoidable and 100% my fault" concludes that there is no if's or but's about the reason it happened. I was simply stating that the three factors that contribute to the safe handling of captive snakes were compromised. I fail to see any reason that someone would need to handle a captive elapid in the bush, so your juxtaposition is null and void.
Aaron,
The bite happened around 11:15am on Saturday. I think you need to do a bit more research on the incident with the loose Collett Snake fang, as I wasn't envenomated and the entire process was simply following protocol of the facility I was working at. I wouldn't consider that a bite, considering the fang wasn't attached to the snake.
I think you will find that by me saying "it was 100% avoidable and 100% my fault" concludes that there is no if's or but's about the reason it happened. I was simply stating that the three factors that contribute to the safe handling of captive snakes were compromised. I fail to see any reason that someone would need to handle a captive elapid in the bush, so your juxtaposition is null and void.
RevDaniel
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I don't know you but happy to read that you are okay
austherps wrote
All bites are avoidable, yes. And no one deserves one (nor do the families of those who receive them).
But good comes from all that's bad. In this case, I can only hope that reality kicks in.
there is a difference between an idealist and a realist. if you are going to handle vens it will happen one day.as long as you know the procedures to take if it does happen and are willing to take the chance hopefully all is good.i for one fully support these people like jonno doing these shows educating the public with these critters.sometimes criticism should be taken on board aaron
All bites are avoidable, yes. And no one deserves one (nor do the families of those who receive them).
But good comes from all that's bad. In this case, I can only hope that reality kicks in.
there is a difference between an idealist and a realist. if you are going to handle vens it will happen one day.as long as you know the procedures to take if it does happen and are willing to take the chance hopefully all is good.i for one fully support these people like jonno doing these shows educating the public with these critters.sometimes criticism should be taken on board aaron
*said in the nicest, gentlest possible way with a slight grin* Shut up Aaron. There is a difference between my stirring the pot a little and your antagonistic comments. Jonno has received a lesson and doesn't need your vitriol too. 
Keep your out of shape nose on your face please. Thanks
Mia.
Keep your out of shape nose on your face please. Thanks
Mia.
AustHerps
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whatsup - We are all entitled to our opinions. Mine is that all tags are avoidable. They are caused by incompetencies on the handler's behalf. I am a realist - bites will happen. I keep a small and modest selection of venomous snakes, and I face the possibility of a bite each and every day. Will I stand here and say that I'll never get bitten? No. I wouldn't make such a definitive statement. No person is perfect, we all have our own little incompetencies. I applaud Jonno for admitting he stuffed up. What I dislike is the disclaiming 'but' at the end.
Of course there's merit to educating the public. I completely and utterly support that humans should be taught to live with our native animals. There's a saying - 'Knowledge is key', and the more that the general populus know about our wonderful neighbours, the safer we all are. Another saying - 'Safety first is safety always'. With his above quote, Jonno is suggesting that doing live displays in shopping centres with venomous animals places himself in a position where he cannot operate to the same safety standards as if he were standing in his herp room. Is it okay to compromise one of the factors that contribute to the safe handling of captive snakes??
Certainly, constructive criticisms should be taken on board. They are what help us to better our skills. What steps is ERD going to take to ensure (as far as possible, of course) that another tag won't happen? Luckily it was a shallow bite, with a low yield - I'd hate to think how the laws as to venomous snake keeping might be altered if a professional snake handler come to an end in front of a crowd at a shopping centre.
Admittedly, I probably wouldn't have even bothered to post had Jonno not portrayed himself so righteously. Antagonistic? Perhaps to some. But I have a right to know what a business, who's activities pose risk to my rights, plans to do in order to correct it's shortcomings.
Cheers,
Aaron.
Jonno said:
Of course there's merit to educating the public. I completely and utterly support that humans should be taught to live with our native animals. There's a saying - 'Knowledge is key', and the more that the general populus know about our wonderful neighbours, the safer we all are. Another saying - 'Safety first is safety always'. With his above quote, Jonno is suggesting that doing live displays in shopping centres with venomous animals places himself in a position where he cannot operate to the same safety standards as if he were standing in his herp room. Is it okay to compromise one of the factors that contribute to the safe handling of captive snakes??
Certainly, constructive criticisms should be taken on board. They are what help us to better our skills. What steps is ERD going to take to ensure (as far as possible, of course) that another tag won't happen? Luckily it was a shallow bite, with a low yield - I'd hate to think how the laws as to venomous snake keeping might be altered if a professional snake handler come to an end in front of a crowd at a shopping centre.
Wrasse said:
Admittedly, I probably wouldn't have even bothered to post had Jonno not portrayed himself so righteously. Antagonistic? Perhaps to some. But I have a right to know what a business, who's activities pose risk to my rights, plans to do in order to correct it's shortcomings.
Cheers,
Aaron.
Well said Austherps.
Actually, I was thinking a different angle... A weekly tag could really pull the crowds... Perhaps we could run a poll here and see who will step up each week to take the tag like a man and help teach young aussies about our natives ?
:lol:
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cement
Very Well-Known Member
Hmmm, a humbling experience maybe.
Glad to hear your ok, sometimes we have to eat our words though.
Glad to hear your ok, sometimes we have to eat our words though.
Hi all,
First off....
Jonno you have one on me...I only simulate a bite in pit for educational purposes, Mulga's eat anything but it even spit you out.
So Aaron you copped a lecture, you will get many more, from people both more and less experienced than yourself, while you keep venomous snakes ..just deal with it. However, I do suggest that if you are going to continue to show people how to handle venomous snakes then you should learn how quickly tiger snakes can slide down a hook and onto a newbies hand when the hook is held above the persons hand. As posted in a photo a while back.
Cheers,
Scott Eipper
First off....
Jonno you have one on me...I only simulate a bite in pit for educational purposes, Mulga's eat anything but it even spit you out.
So Aaron you copped a lecture, you will get many more, from people both more and less experienced than yourself, while you keep venomous snakes ..just deal with it. However, I do suggest that if you are going to continue to show people how to handle venomous snakes then you should learn how quickly tiger snakes can slide down a hook and onto a newbies hand when the hook is held above the persons hand. As posted in a photo a while back.
Cheers,
Scott Eipper
P
-Peter
Guest
How about getting over the male posturing and get back to the real issue. A bite from any venomous snake can kill you. This was shown recently with the death in Vic from a Little Whip snake. A species not regarded as dangerous and the death last year of a teenager from a Brown snake envenomation where no amount of ttreatment could have saved him.
Statistics on what kills more people than snakes are irrelevant in a situation where snakes are kept as pets and yes I include those animals held for display by people like Jonno and Scott. While they educate they also promote reptile keeping as a hobby and teir animals are captive pets.
I'm sure Jonno would be the first to admit that the bite was his fault alone and takes full responsibility. In that Aaron raises points that are relevant but in the end the event has become a point scoring exercise that is more about machismo than reality.
Do your zips up and settle down
Statistics on what kills more people than snakes are irrelevant in a situation where snakes are kept as pets and yes I include those animals held for display by people like Jonno and Scott. While they educate they also promote reptile keeping as a hobby and teir animals are captive pets.
I'm sure Jonno would be the first to admit that the bite was his fault alone and takes full responsibility. In that Aaron raises points that are relevant but in the end the event has become a point scoring exercise that is more about machismo than reality.
Do your zips up and settle down
and dont get anything caught in those nasty metal teeth....
snakesrule
Active Member
Jonno ,
Im glad to hear you are okay.
Now maybe you realise there are no excuses
People make mistakes and this applies to you as well. So you are not so perfect after all.
Welcome to reality.
We all stuff up from time to time
Im glad to hear you are okay.
Now maybe you realise there are no excuses
People make mistakes and this applies to you as well. So you are not so perfect after all.
Welcome to reality.
We all stuff up from time to time
Jonno from ERD
Very Well-Known Member
G'day snakesrule,
I don't recall stating that there were any excuses for my bite or any snake bite for that matter? I stated earlier that the bite was entirely my fault.
A bit of an update - my thumb has gone numb, I keep on dropping stuff!
I don't recall stating that there were any excuses for my bite or any snake bite for that matter? I stated earlier that the bite was entirely my fault.
A bit of an update - my thumb has gone numb, I keep on dropping stuff!
wood_nymph
Very Well-Known Member
numb thumb hey maybe its time the see those nice doctors again before it drops off
Jonno from ERD
Very Well-Known Member
G'day nymph,
I spoke to them last night and we coloured in the numb area with a texta to see if it was spreading. 15 hours later and it hasn't moved at all. It's quite a strange feeling really, as if my thumb is covered in wax. You can feel pressure in the deep tissue but not on the surface of the skin.
I spoke to them last night and we coloured in the numb area with a texta to see if it was spreading. 15 hours later and it hasn't moved at all. It's quite a strange feeling really, as if my thumb is covered in wax. You can feel pressure in the deep tissue but not on the surface of the skin.
Some ppl need to grow up, in that other thread Jonno didnt say anything that has changed now he has been bitten, mistakes happen luckily it wasnt as bad as it could have been.
Its was good of you to share your mistake so that maybe others can learn from it. I hope you can make a full recovery.
Its was good of you to share your mistake so that maybe others can learn from it. I hope you can make a full recovery.
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