Getting started with Snakes

[mrbaggins]

First off, Hi. I'm a High School teacher in Wagga NSW and have recently gotten it into my head that I'd like a pet snake. I've done a whole heap of research and just wanted to clarify a few things.

I'm looking at getting a Children's or Spotted python as a first snake. I'm also looking at getting a second one later that I would like to keep in the same enclosure as the first (friendliness between specimens permitting). With this in mind, I've been looking at pre-fab vivariums of assorted sizes.

Based on what I've read, I'm looking at the 60x45x45cm (24x18x18") Exo Terra PT2610 enclosure (121L or 32Gal total capacity). It appears to have all the requisite features, and is big enough for two but not waaaaay to big for a young one. Is this right? Or should I look at making a click clack til it's bigger, or should I look at bigger enclosures?

I've priced a large number of things. Substrates, heat pads, thermostats, thermometers, hydrometers (Haven't read much about these. Really needed?) the light canopy for the enclosure (Uses standard screw in fittings, so can mount any fluro, UV or incandescent light), the bulbs for the canopy, water bowls, hiding holes, branches, plants, the actual snake itself, price of frozen food... It's a rather long list.

I've also read all the licensing fees/conditions and import requirements if I buy from interstate.

Have I accounted for everything?

As for specific questions (and I know this post is getting quite long, thanks for sticking with it):
Do heat mats normally go inside the tank, or under it? The ExoTerra has a nice half to an inch of clearance underneath and it seems like this is where it should go (with styrene to protect whatever the pad sits on, with the thermostat probe inside the styrene).
When I'm buying things like a water bowl, and decorated hides, should I be looking at small sizes (Water bowl in small seems to be about 8cmx14)? They seem very small considering the snake is going to end up a meter long.
I've read not so good things about full glass enclosures (such as the ExoTerra). With a decent heating setup and located in a consistent temperature room, is this likely to be a large problem?
I have two options for the canopy, both from ExoTerra. One has two sidemount screw in fittings, where I can place any standard (or reptile special but standard fitting) bulb. The other one costs 5 times as much, and instead has two fluro tube fittings and a halogen spot heat lamp fitting. Is this even worth considering? With an appropriately warm tank, is a basking light required?

Thanks for any help/answers, looking forward to getting one of these guys soon!

 

[Tortoise]

Sorry I cant be of much help mate my hubby snake man me Tortoise

 

[syeph8]

the bigger the enclosure the better, if you are going to have two in the same enclosure. get a click clack for your juvies (for christ sake be careful with putting them together, because they may not go well together. my uncle only has them in groups of 2 or 3, but some snakes just dont like housemates.)
heat mat goes under, not inside
Glass enclosures lose heat very fast and unless you are keeping your house around a constant 25 degrees then i would reccomend less glass, especially if you are only using a heat mat. (although if you keep it covered during cold months it should lose less heat.) I suggest a premade enclosure with fittings, you can find some with three glass windows for viewing from many angles if this is an issue.
i would get seperate flouro and basking lamps.(but i dont think anteresias require UV) but if you are keeping your house at consistently high temps you probably wont need one.
as long as there is water and it is changed regularly it wont make too much difference what sized water bowl you use. but maybe a bit larger for two, especially if you want to ever go away for a long weekend.

other than that, it seems you have done some good research. make sure, especially if you do buy glass, that you feild test the enclosure for a week before you get your snake.

 

[razeunit]

I have only recently acquired my first 5 month old jungle python and I am in the process of setting my 4ft glass tank for her. She is currently in a click clack for now. The heat mat will go under the tank and I am using a screen type lid similar to this one http://lllreptile.com/load-image/StoreInventoryImage/image/3305 . I'll be setting up my Heat bulb on top of the mesh because apparently snakes can coil themselves up around the bulbs and seriously burn themselves. A lot of people use glass for tanks so I can't imagine it will be a problem. As far as sizing goes for things such as hides I have brought things a little larger than probably required but not big enough that its going to work in a year or two mainly because I think they will feel a little safer in something smaller. Water bowl I have brought is 15cm (l) x 12cm (w) x 5cm (d). Feel its a decent size and could probably get in and get wet around shedding time if she wants too. I would purchase the basic canopy as that size tank should only require the mat and one heat bulb.

Good luck on choosing your snake and buy it privately if you want to save a lot of money. Good luck with it, i'm sure you wont regret it

 

[Fantazmic]

Hi Ya

just thought id mention
the topic of keeping snakes together has really mixed reactions.
There is always a risk with doing it (one making a mistake and eating the other). Some people have horror stories about it and others wouldnt ever keep their snakes separately.

Myself....I dont think I would house mine together

Regards

Elizabeth

 

[pythonz]

i have 3 spotted pythons there Beautiful snakes i keep them separate usually but recently started breeding two so their in the same 4ftx1.5ftx1.5ft tank i have a 1 year old 1 and she's for sale if your interested. but mainly all you need to know is dont buy a hatchling snake because its hard to get them feeding go for around the age of maybe 9 months to 1 year, as for the bowl and hides yeah you should get pretty small ones the bowl only has to be big enough for the snake to fit in. i dont exactly worry about the fluro bulbs but i do recommend a basking lamp with a cage around it and turn it off at night or just get a night basking lamp. ok good luck and remember you can personal message me if you have more questions or if your interested in my female spotted.

 

[pythonz]

oh and elizabeth the only snake that would get eaten would be like a children's python going in with an olive

 

[goneself]

Agreed- two snakes of the same species is risky, two different species will probably not end well.

 

[shellfisch]

Hi Ya
just thought id mention the topic of keeping snakes together has really mixed reactions.
There is always a risk with doing it (one making a mistake and eating the other). Some people have horror stories about it and others wouldnt ever keep their snakes separately.
Myself....I dont think I would house mine together
Regards Elizabeth

I agree. I wouldn't do it.
It's not the worth the risk, just to save a few dollars on another enclosure.

 

[pythonmum]

Just to throw the cat amongst the pigeons, here's my enclosure which houses a male spotted (out on the branch) and female stimson. Much of the cage furniture is labelled. Heat is controlled by a pulse proportional probe thermostat (from HerpShop, as were the ceramic heater and light cages). I got both snakes as yearlings, so that they were feeding well. I use Breeder's Choice as substrate with regular spot cleaning and a full clean out every school holidays. (I'm a teacher, too.) I introduced the snakes and kept an eye, but they were the same size and opposite sex, so no issues. I feed the spotted in a tub so that there are no conflicts over food, which HAS happened in the past. They are great little animals. Light is a normal compact flouro - no need for UV. They have been kept together for nearly 7 years.

PS - 1.2 meters long, 0.6 m high, 0.6 m deep. Before this they lived in a converted aquarium. I have also used sand as substrate, but Breeder's Choice is easier.

 

[syeph8]

I agree. I wouldn't do it.
It's not the worth the risk, just to save a few dollars on another enclosure.

Space is usually the determinative factor in people housing multiple snakes in one enclosure. Not money. just be careful regarding relative sizes (bigger snakes can sometimes size up smaller ones for food), feeding reflexes (if they bite and swallow anything that moves in their enclosure, then not a good idea), species (anteresias tend to hunt in communal areas), temperament (real bastards can bite and then subsequently try to eat other snakes).

 

[shellfisch]

Space is usually the determinative factor in people housing multiple snakes in one enclosure. Not money

I know, from reading the threads on here that people do it. Some of them even get away with it. Sometimes for a long time.
No matter what the reason, to me, it's not worth having one or both of your snakes dying.
Just my opinion.

Which is probably why my son has been allowed to take over his own bedroom , and a second bedroom, and fill them with enclosures.....

 

[eitak]

I recently got two diamond hatchies (one male, one female) they live together and are always curled up happily ontop one another. Although they are the same age (about a month or two apart), the same species and I feed them in tubs seperate from the enclosure and each other.

 

[Dipcdame]

Just to throw the cat amongst the pigeons, here's my enclosure which houses a male spotted (out on the branch) and female stimson. Much of the cage furniture is labelled. Heat is controlled by a pulse proportional probe thermostat (from HerpShop, as were the ceramic heater and light cages). I got both snakes as yearlings, so that they were feeding well. I use Breeder's Choice as substrate with regular spot cleaning and a full clean out every school holidays. (I'm a teacher, too.) I introduced the snakes and kept an eye, but they were the same size and opposite sex, so no issues. I feed the spotted in a tub so that there are no conflicts over food, which HAS happened in the past. They are great little animals. Light is a normal compact flouro - no need for UV. They have been kept together for nearly 7 years.

PS - 1.2 meters long, 0.6 m high, 0.6 m deep. Before this they lived in a converted aquarium. I have also used sand as substrate, but Breeder's Choice is easier.

I have my two MD Carpets (snugglebunnies) in the same enclosure - have done for four and a half years! We make sure we take one out at feeding time, athat's all
Got a tiny juvenille, same species, but that one will permanently stay separate because of size discrepancy!!

 

[pythonmum]

I know, from reading the threads on here that people do it. Some of them even get away with it. Sometimes for a long time.

I keep my Morelia individually, but a good friend has a pair of diamond/coastal hybrids which have lived together since hatching - 20 years this past January! That's definitely "getting away with it" for a long time.

 

[mrbaggins]

Thanks for all the input people. I'll likely be getting the 2ft enclosure later this week, along with all the accessories, setting it all up and getting temperatures right. Then I'll get my license and start looking for snakes. (About now would be a good time yes? A few months old from the summer/spring hatchings?)

 

[pythonmum]

Apply for the license now - it takes a while. HerpTrader is a good place to look, as well as the many animals for sale on this forum. Then, of course, you have Southern Cross, SnakeRanch and URS. You will have no trouble finding a lovely animal. I suggest getting a 'heat gun' thermometer which measures surface temperature. Air thermometers are not nearly as accurate and you can discover some nasty hot spots with heat pads.

 

[razeunit]

Apply for the license now - it takes a while. HerpTrader is a good place to look, as well as the many animals for sale on this forum. Then, of course, you have Southern Cross, SnakeRanch and URS. You will have no trouble finding a lovely animal. I suggest getting a 'heat gun' thermometer which measures surface temperature. Air thermometers are not nearly as accurate and you can discover some nasty hot spots with heat pads.

On the licence, I hope I got the right thing but mine was pay the government 66 bucks and then print it off. Was instant.

 

[pythonmum]

On the licence, I hope I got the right thing but mine was pay the government 66 bucks and then print it off. Was instant.

Different in different states. In NSW you have to wait at least 2 weeks for the paperwork to go through.

 

[syeph8]

On the licence, I hope I got the right thing but mine was pay the government 66 bucks and then print it off. Was instant.

???? what state do you live in? obviously not victoira