OPMV will kill an animal quicker then 9 months . Hard call , JungleRob , i would watch the legal side of things , you may end up in a very large pile of poo . Thats why there are 2 types of people , the ones that stand up and say what most people are thinking even if it makes them unpopular , ( TrueBlue ) :lol: , and those that don't want to hurt anyones feelings . I think most people would now know where i stand . Magpie & olivehydra , is it getting lonely up there by yourselves , not a nice feeling eh ? I take my hat off to both of you . Jim
OPMV....know much about it?
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junglemad
Very Well-Known Member
i haven't had a snake die on me as yet. I don't feed with tongs, i change the paper each week and wash the water bowls in boiling water and wipe the tubs with straight pine-o-clean. I wash my hand every time i touch my snakes. I breed my own rats.Fingers crossed i have no diseases but threads like this are definitely a worry.
ps here is a bikini pic. Looks like an intergrade, perhaps Scandinavian and Australian...
ps here is a bikini pic. Looks like an intergrade, perhaps Scandinavian and Australian...
beknluke
Very Well-Known Member
It's lasted longer than previous threads on the subject Jim. I am just glad that people are finally comfortable to discuss the subject for you. Even if they do require some half naked women fondling snakes to inspre them to do so 
Bex
Bex
peterescue
Very Well-Known Member
If the disease was transferable to humans, as with flying foxes, or effected a billion dollar agricultural industry we'd be sending sample off to Geelong or brisbane all the time. The upshot is that I or the organisation I rescue for do not have the money or the rescources to test deceased reptiles where the cause of death is unknown. On the occasion that test have been done OPMV hasn't been found. IBD has on occasion.
OPMV is nothing like HIV. OPMV is about losing face as a reptile keeper and losing money as a breeder and seller. You have to come to terms with an ethical situation. Do I tell everyone about this or do i shut up and carry on as normal. Well Jim, you made descision. I dont call it couragous, just honest and responsible. An admirable one though. Couragous when people put their own well being on the line.
HIV is killing millions of people, Couragous describes the people who worked with HIV infection in the early days. Not knowing how it worked.
Anyway, i digress.
Im not sure about your with me or agin me stance. The thread is far to convoluted to be able to ascertain your manifesto. What do you want people to do. Buy F10. Its one of several products available that will do the same job. Its good but its not going to save you. Just help.
If you are serious about stopping it then you should call for and support a moratorium on the sale and movement of all reptiles. Lock it down. Is the situation that bad? Is that what you are implying.
Im not sure where you stand at all.
ps, I dont know where all the rest of you have been for the last few years but no one has said anything that hasnt been discussed at length before. This isnt the first thread of this and other diseases and it wont be that last. Maybe I should ask, where were you last time when you didnt stand up to be counted.
I dont want to sound negative but there is a sanctimonious tone to the thread.
pss, is that Kirsty Hinze? Wasn't that supposed to be a diamond. Even the Packer Billions couldnt get a pure diamond.
OPMV is nothing like HIV. OPMV is about losing face as a reptile keeper and losing money as a breeder and seller. You have to come to terms with an ethical situation. Do I tell everyone about this or do i shut up and carry on as normal. Well Jim, you made descision. I dont call it couragous, just honest and responsible. An admirable one though. Couragous when people put their own well being on the line.
HIV is killing millions of people, Couragous describes the people who worked with HIV infection in the early days. Not knowing how it worked.
Anyway, i digress.
Im not sure about your with me or agin me stance. The thread is far to convoluted to be able to ascertain your manifesto. What do you want people to do. Buy F10. Its one of several products available that will do the same job. Its good but its not going to save you. Just help.
If you are serious about stopping it then you should call for and support a moratorium on the sale and movement of all reptiles. Lock it down. Is the situation that bad? Is that what you are implying.
Im not sure where you stand at all.
ps, I dont know where all the rest of you have been for the last few years but no one has said anything that hasnt been discussed at length before. This isnt the first thread of this and other diseases and it wont be that last. Maybe I should ask, where were you last time when you didnt stand up to be counted.
I dont want to sound negative but there is a sanctimonious tone to the thread.
pss, is that Kirsty Hinze? Wasn't that supposed to be a diamond. Even the Packer Billions couldnt get a pure diamond.
Peter , with testing the animals , i was referring to animals that are in our care not in the wild . With my with or against stance , i'm not sure what to say ? People can do what-ever they want , i don't think that this topic will change much at all to be honest .I suppose if it saves someone going through what i went through and saves 1 x animal , i would be happy With F10 , it came highly recommended from the vet , it seemed to work for me and i was only trying to help . I must have been the only 1 besides the rest of you that didn't see the OPMV topic , sorry for wasting peoples time with something so negative . I suppose thats why i don't comment too much about stuff that i don't know much about . Excuse me while i go and stick my head back in the sand .
Well said peterescue.
Not sure if the 'rare' comment was aimed at me or not. To make myself clear, (which I thought I had done already), I am not saying that OPMV is rare. Not at all. I am simply saying that it is being screamed too loudly in the wrong situations. I think a little more education is the key and discussing it is the way to go.
Too many people call OPMV when it isn't neccessarily the case. As long as everyone is happy to settle for calling everything OPMV, then the other diseases won't get diagnosed and learned about and our herps will still suffer.
Clearly, as mentioned above, I had not made myself clear. In my first post I stated I had a snake diagnosed with OPMV. When that was the case, I certainly didn't go into hiding and there are numerous posts about that situation all over various snake forums. I did a lot of reading on the subject, attempted to pull him through it and when he died, I passed his body over for testing and the testing came back inconclusive.
In hindsight, I don't think he had OPMV at all, I think it was poisoning. (But I already mentioned that). I think if the Vet had put a little more thought into possible causes, especially given no new arrivals into my collection or possible contaminants, my snake may have been treated differently and may still be alive today.
Even so, I also stated in that post, that since it happened, his cage mate has been in quarantine and to this day, is still in strict quarantine. If, by any chance at all, it was OPMV, I don't intend to pass it around even though the 'use by' date is theoretically past.
Now, back to peterescue's post: Rockman, where are you taking this thread? Are you attempting to flush someone out of the woodwork ?
:?
TrueBlue said:
Not sure if the 'rare' comment was aimed at me or not. To make myself clear, (which I thought I had done already), I am not saying that OPMV is rare. Not at all. I am simply saying that it is being screamed too loudly in the wrong situations. I think a little more education is the key and discussing it is the way to go.
Too many people call OPMV when it isn't neccessarily the case. As long as everyone is happy to settle for calling everything OPMV, then the other diseases won't get diagnosed and learned about and our herps will still suffer.
rockman said:
Clearly, as mentioned above, I had not made myself clear. In my first post I stated I had a snake diagnosed with OPMV. When that was the case, I certainly didn't go into hiding and there are numerous posts about that situation all over various snake forums. I did a lot of reading on the subject, attempted to pull him through it and when he died, I passed his body over for testing and the testing came back inconclusive.
In hindsight, I don't think he had OPMV at all, I think it was poisoning. (But I already mentioned that). I think if the Vet had put a little more thought into possible causes, especially given no new arrivals into my collection or possible contaminants, my snake may have been treated differently and may still be alive today.
Even so, I also stated in that post, that since it happened, his cage mate has been in quarantine and to this day, is still in strict quarantine. If, by any chance at all, it was OPMV, I don't intend to pass it around even though the 'use by' date is theoretically past.
Now, back to peterescue's post: Rockman, where are you taking this thread? Are you attempting to flush someone out of the woodwork ?
:?
africancichlidau
Almost Legendary
Only saw this post tonight for some reason? I had an adult snake die recently from old age, had the P.M. done and was told it was old age, (I don't know for sure how old the snake was), but how do I know this is the case? Short answer is, I DON'T!
africancichlidau
Almost Legendary
Is that safe?
Vets talk crap, in almost all cases (including the well respected ones, I won't name names, but most of the highly recommended ones don't know much more than your average frozen pink mice), they have no idea what they're talking about. They have to say something as an excuse for charging you a heap of money, so they'll come up with something. I know of countless cases of absurd diagnoses made by vets and I know many people who know a heck of a lot more than any vet. I suppose if you don't have knowledgable contacts and you have a sick animal, you're in a lot of trouble and might be desperate enough to go to a vet, but in most cases you'd be better off doing nothing at all. I'll probably get a heap of people giving testimonials about how a vet helped them etc etc and yes, at times a vet might help, but for every time they help there are times they've hurt and many, many times they've done nothing more than charge money for wasting peoples' time.
Giving a false diagnosis, especially when they're telling people they have highly destructive diseases, is horribly irresponsible. This is not a case of erring on the side of caution, it causes problems. If snakes are diagnosed with OPMV/IBD etc etc, which actually don't have these diseases, people notice that their other snakes aren't dying and start thinking that these diseases actually aren't a big problem. They describe their experiences to others and others think they know how to deal with the situation, but if they do happen to get a genuine case of a disease, they'll not deal with it appropriately. Giving out serious misdagnoses also makes people apathetic. If we all hear about these diseases floating about everywhere, but nothing much ever comes of it, we think it's common but not a real problem, thus, we take the situation less seriously. This is all another case of misinformation being spread, causing damage to our hobby. It's sad that in this case the so called professionals are being paid to do it by naive keepers.
Giving a false diagnosis, especially when they're telling people they have highly destructive diseases, is horribly irresponsible. This is not a case of erring on the side of caution, it causes problems. If snakes are diagnosed with OPMV/IBD etc etc, which actually don't have these diseases, people notice that their other snakes aren't dying and start thinking that these diseases actually aren't a big problem. They describe their experiences to others and others think they know how to deal with the situation, but if they do happen to get a genuine case of a disease, they'll not deal with it appropriately. Giving out serious misdagnoses also makes people apathetic. If we all hear about these diseases floating about everywhere, but nothing much ever comes of it, we think it's common but not a real problem, thus, we take the situation less seriously. This is all another case of misinformation being spread, causing damage to our hobby. It's sad that in this case the so called professionals are being paid to do it by naive keepers.
beknluke
Very Well-Known Member
africancichlidau said:
Most certainly is Af
And if it wasn't, mine along with many other animals in peoples collections and at unis, would be dead.I could have used a 2ml/lt dosage, or even a 4ml/lt dosage for the fungi spores, but after a chat with the biochemist, we decided that it was best to use the 'resistant virus' dosage just to make sure that there was no chance that the fungi could survive.
It's a very safe product and has been recommended to me (at the higher dilution rate as well) by many other keepers and vets whom I trust.
The main point is that it worked and all of the animals are now healthy
Bex
Wrasse i'm not sure what you mean by this ! This was and is not , what did you say " flushing someone out of the woodwork " , mate i got no idea what you are on about . This sort of crap makes me laugh , my snakes had OPMV , ( as tested post mortem by a lab ! ) i lost some animals because i did not know what i was doing wrong , i came on here to try to bring it out in the open so it gets discussed as this is the only way to stop it . . Wrasse , i'm didn't realize that you said you had a snake die as well , sorry about that , i'll put you up next to Magpie and Olivehydra .
I suppose that was aimed at me ! I suppose you woke up one day with 20 years experience , wisdomand knowledge and you didn't start from scratch , sorry for being naive , probably makes half the people on this site naive . I should have just come to you for advice , OH GREAT ONE ! I don't have years of experience , i will admit it , but i do have some little bit of knowedge about OPMV having been there and go through it with some success.
That sounds a smart thing to do people ! :roll: What are you saying Sadji , that they should come to you ? , saying this makes me laugh , but its sad really that you give out this great advice , i hope that not that many people take you that seriously . Some vets are not into herps , some are , find a good vet that is highly recommended and use them , or just ask Sdaji :lol: To Sdaji , to question the vet , as long as you have MORE KNOWLEDGE then the vet , then you can have a go at the vet , but until then its makes me laugh that people can stand up will their worldly advice . There are some crap vets out there , but there are some very good vets as well .
Peter , If i have something to say i will , its just i don't open my mouth for the sake of hearing my own voice , i not having a dig at you also ,i'm sorry i have only been on this site for about a year and i haven't seen where i was supposed to stand and be counted . Let me know please !. If there is anyone that i have missed having a go at , please remind me :wink: . The original topic started by trying to help someone that asked a question ( being naive ) , thats how you learn , isn't it ? This topic was never meant to scare anyone , it was meant to educate people a little bit . If it didn't hurt you before , just go back to acting like it doesn't exsist , thats the easist way out , and you will have a positive outcome . :lol:
P
Pythoninfinite
Guest
I've been using Virkon S for cleaning for the past couple of years, it's a broad spectrum biocide as well, and an excellent deodoriser, with low toxicity - can be used to rinse hands etc without harm or irritation. Anyone else using this? These viral things are a worry, can have very long incubation periods, and some animals appear to be able to carry the infections silently and appear to be in good health for their entire lives.
Jamie
Jamie
P
Pythoninfinite
Guest
I would have thought that most definitive diagnoses would be accompanied by a pathology report (from a veterinary pathologist, not a vet) which should be shown to the client as confirmation of the diagnosis. Also, these days with the ease of email, it's not difficult to send photos of microscopic sections showing details such as viral inclusions etc. If the diagnosis is clear from the pathology work done, then that should be the end of the argument, but sometimes with these viral things, clear diagnosis may not be possible.
I take my hat off to you Jim,
I couldnt imagine the heartache involved in watching your collection die, you may have prevented this happening for someone, you have opened a lot of eyes Im sure.
Cheers
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I couldnt imagine the heartache involved in watching your collection die, you may have prevented this happening for someone, you have opened a lot of eyes Im sure.
Cheers
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peterescue
Very Well-Known Member
Jim, dont take offence please. I also speak my mind, or attempt to write it. If I have something to say I generally say it and spend the next couple of days either explaining what I meant or in reality not worrying about it and going with the misinterpretation.
I think I side with you. It was just the minute' that I was having trouble with.
Sorry about the F10, its just that I have people trying to ram it down my throat with zeal of the Amwaysect inductees.
It puts me off straight away.
You forget also that a proportion of snakes that we catch end up in private hands through herp societies etc and until a couple of years ago they tended to be looked after in the interim by people who kept reptiles. The same people breed and sell them as well. so there is no distinction between WC and pet reptiles in my mind.
I think I side with you. It was just the minute' that I was having trouble with.
Sorry about the F10, its just that I have people trying to ram it down my throat with zeal of the Amwaysect inductees.
It puts me off straight away.
You forget also that a proportion of snakes that we catch end up in private hands through herp societies etc and until a couple of years ago they tended to be looked after in the interim by people who kept reptiles. The same people breed and sell them as well. so there is no distinction between WC and pet reptiles in my mind.
JungleRob said:
You are are friggin hypocrite Robin, you had no problems selling me your (no doubt quarantined) male jungle without disclosing your knowledge that your collection has been exposed to this virus! When I look at the enclosures you keep your other snakes in I can only wonder why you housed this male on newspaper.
Your last comment shows you have no idea WTF you are talking about. Lets hope you are correct in your assunptions.
Brett Allen
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