well said Sdaji, i couldnt agree more. Well actually i like red roos better than grey ones and i wouldnt be able to choose a favorite animal without listing 50 or more. I hope ppl will pay more attention to someone with your education than they did to me.
To cull or not to cull... that is the question...
- Thread starter slim6y
- Start date
-
- Tags
- aspidites ramsayi
Help Support Aussie Pythons & Snakes Forum:
- Status
snakes4me2
Very Well-Known Member
Mayo
Very Well-Known Member
The only solution that has been found so far is regular cull's and nutill someone comes up with a better idea this will continue. We are losing many native species for many reasons, saddly we created most of them. But it doesn't change the fact that culling is the most practical solution. We created the problem and now we are doing our best to keep it in check.
Feral animals are and should most rightly be killed on sight, they are a pest. We have introduced many species to Aust that have done a lot of damage, but we have also caused many native species to do a lot of damage to the country as well. We need to rectify this problem as best we can, and the answer at this point is to cull. Most of the pest species introduced happened befor I was born so I had no chance of stopping them, but I will fight to ensure that less mistakes are made now.
I saw some of the cull at Pucka and saw nothing wrong with it. I have also done many culls on my parents property's. The people that came to do my parents cull were not bad people by any means. Some of my friends did it on there breaks from UNI to make extra cash. Don't let your bad experiances cloud your judgement on the people who do the culls, your area might be one that has the wrong type of people doing the work but our's have the right type of people.
All my opinion and I could be wrong but to sit by and do nothing is not going to help the matter. Plague proportions need to be dealt with sooner rather than later, and practical solution sought.
Feral animals are and should most rightly be killed on sight, they are a pest. We have introduced many species to Aust that have done a lot of damage, but we have also caused many native species to do a lot of damage to the country as well. We need to rectify this problem as best we can, and the answer at this point is to cull. Most of the pest species introduced happened befor I was born so I had no chance of stopping them, but I will fight to ensure that less mistakes are made now.
I saw some of the cull at Pucka and saw nothing wrong with it. I have also done many culls on my parents property's. The people that came to do my parents cull were not bad people by any means. Some of my friends did it on there breaks from UNI to make extra cash. Don't let your bad experiances cloud your judgement on the people who do the culls, your area might be one that has the wrong type of people doing the work but our's have the right type of people.
All my opinion and I could be wrong but to sit by and do nothing is not going to help the matter. Plague proportions need to be dealt with sooner rather than later, and practical solution sought.
slim6y
Almost Legendary
Hey, this is definitely the stance I am talking about Sdaji....
To be totally honest with you... I'm not some environmentalist hippie.. I just took an underdog's side to get emotions going so people write what i am considering an important topic of modern culture. it's great to get so many people's opinions.
But sadly, as it happens... i don't kill flies, roaches, spiders and other nasties that come into my house. I laugh at this myself... But i... haha... relocate them... Im not kidding. I figured that i would run my life as pesticide free as possible... So no sprays in the house. the reason being for one I had fish tanks, and fly sprays are not recommended. For two, my daughter is to grow up respecting all animals... no matter how big or small. now that does not say not to kill them, but it is to say have a respect for them. no about them, understand them... To at least th ebest of our knowledge.
I am lucky in my house that pests are at an all time minimum.
I use companion planting... and I except some crop losses.
I feed my snake on mice... and I certainly won't be sarcastic and feed my snake carrots... Life is life... But to no suprise... It's humans responsibility.
My initial argument is:
We change our environment to suit our lifestyle... But what we could do is change our lifestyle to suit our environment.
No one said it was easy. It takes forward thinking. But we need to look to a sustainable future... would you not agree?
We need to get balance... Difficult to assertain maybe... And with economies etc it's probably impossible to assertain.
I am of the opinion that culling is a neserscary evil... I don't like it... I am actually at the same, contradicting, against it because of the cause... But I see no easier way out either. I wished there was.
But attitudes also need to change...
I think we have also circled around roos way to long in this thread... as they're the easy target here. So I guess they're easy to talk about
I have found statistics that I found interesting... It doesn't change the way I do things... but I just think it's interesting...
R. L. Metcalf suggests that crop losses to insects remain as high today as they were before the wide-spread usage of insecticides.He cites a USDA estimate of annual losses for six major crops treated with insecticides at 11.3% in 1900-04, whereas David Pimentel estimates the average annual loss for these crops in 1995 at 13%. The suggestion has been made that the use of modern chemicals has been counterproductive -- pesticides control insect pests but destroy beneficial insects; they led to the abandonment of effective non-chemical control practices; and they led to resistant pest populations that continue to cause crop losses. By focusing solely on crop losses resulting from insects, Drs. Metcalf and Pimentel do a disservice to the enormous positive contribution that modern synthetic chemicals have made to the agricultural food supply.
Sorry for the copy and pasting... It's the mini version of what happens to macroinverterbrates when we change something in a closed ecosystem....
It's hard to find these examples... but our attitudes need to change in order to stick with our sustainable cultures - if they are indeed to be sustainable.
I don't think human effects can be reversed yet... but I think it's only a matter of time before we're forced to... perhaps not in our lifetime, or even our childrens, but most likely within the next 150 years there is going to have to be dramatic changes and we're going to have to stop ostriching, stop saying it's impossible and start actually doing...
Can't wait till oil runs out!
This blurb was made a little sleep deprived... But the jist of it is our attitudes will need to change at some time, because in our current status we're not sustainable...
ps.. I eat all red meats, including roo... and it's damned tastey... I have also eaten crocodile... also tastey...
To be totally honest with you... I'm not some environmentalist hippie.. I just took an underdog's side to get emotions going so people write what i am considering an important topic of modern culture. it's great to get so many people's opinions.
But sadly, as it happens... i don't kill flies, roaches, spiders and other nasties that come into my house. I laugh at this myself... But i... haha... relocate them... Im not kidding. I figured that i would run my life as pesticide free as possible... So no sprays in the house. the reason being for one I had fish tanks, and fly sprays are not recommended. For two, my daughter is to grow up respecting all animals... no matter how big or small. now that does not say not to kill them, but it is to say have a respect for them. no about them, understand them... To at least th ebest of our knowledge.
I am lucky in my house that pests are at an all time minimum.
I use companion planting... and I except some crop losses.
I feed my snake on mice... and I certainly won't be sarcastic and feed my snake carrots... Life is life... But to no suprise... It's humans responsibility.
My initial argument is:
We change our environment to suit our lifestyle... But what we could do is change our lifestyle to suit our environment.
No one said it was easy. It takes forward thinking. But we need to look to a sustainable future... would you not agree?
We need to get balance... Difficult to assertain maybe... And with economies etc it's probably impossible to assertain.
I am of the opinion that culling is a neserscary evil... I don't like it... I am actually at the same, contradicting, against it because of the cause... But I see no easier way out either. I wished there was.
But attitudes also need to change...
I think we have also circled around roos way to long in this thread... as they're the easy target here. So I guess they're easy to talk about
I have found statistics that I found interesting... It doesn't change the way I do things... but I just think it's interesting...
R. L. Metcalf suggests that crop losses to insects remain as high today as they were before the wide-spread usage of insecticides.He cites a USDA estimate of annual losses for six major crops treated with insecticides at 11.3% in 1900-04, whereas David Pimentel estimates the average annual loss for these crops in 1995 at 13%. The suggestion has been made that the use of modern chemicals has been counterproductive -- pesticides control insect pests but destroy beneficial insects; they led to the abandonment of effective non-chemical control practices; and they led to resistant pest populations that continue to cause crop losses. By focusing solely on crop losses resulting from insects, Drs. Metcalf and Pimentel do a disservice to the enormous positive contribution that modern synthetic chemicals have made to the agricultural food supply.
Sorry for the copy and pasting... It's the mini version of what happens to macroinverterbrates when we change something in a closed ecosystem....
It's hard to find these examples... but our attitudes need to change in order to stick with our sustainable cultures - if they are indeed to be sustainable.
I don't think human effects can be reversed yet... but I think it's only a matter of time before we're forced to... perhaps not in our lifetime, or even our childrens, but most likely within the next 150 years there is going to have to be dramatic changes and we're going to have to stop ostriching, stop saying it's impossible and start actually doing...
Can't wait till oil runs out!
This blurb was made a little sleep deprived... But the jist of it is our attitudes will need to change at some time, because in our current status we're not sustainable...
ps.. I eat all red meats, including roo... and it's damned tastey... I have also eaten crocodile... also tastey...
Not gonna contribute to the roo debate one way or the other, but I will make a couple of points:
The word 'feral' refers to a domesticated animal that has gone wild (eg. cats, dogs, horses, goats, pigs etc.). If the animal in question was never a domesticated species, and it is outside it's home range then it is 'introduced'.
No they're not.
This was a theory proposed in the 1980s, and in the mid 90's the basic premise was found to be flawed, and the idea was abandoned. Fruit Bats and Micro bats are both derived from a common ancestor and recent molecular evidence suggests that the closest relatives to the Chiroptera are the South American camelids.
Incidentally, before the primate-fruit bat relationship theory, one of the evolution theories for Bats was a relationship with Flying Lemurs or Colugos, a different order altogether.
Hix
The word 'feral' refers to a domesticated animal that has gone wild (eg. cats, dogs, horses, goats, pigs etc.). If the animal in question was never a domesticated species, and it is outside it's home range then it is 'introduced'.
No they're not.
This was a theory proposed in the 1980s, and in the mid 90's the basic premise was found to be flawed, and the idea was abandoned. Fruit Bats and Micro bats are both derived from a common ancestor and recent molecular evidence suggests that the closest relatives to the Chiroptera are the South American camelids.
Incidentally, before the primate-fruit bat relationship theory, one of the evolution theories for Bats was a relationship with Flying Lemurs or Colugos, a different order altogether.
Hix
...and so the thread went off topic...
Hix: Um, am I misreading you or are you saying that Lemurs aren't Primates? (I didn't bother getting into the issue earlier in the thread, as along with the definition of the word 'feral', it seemed a bit too trivial to address. I suppose you've just put a straw on the camel's back ). The word 'feral' is colloquially ("incorrectly") used so often now that it seems pointless to correct anyone.
I was very upset when DNA testing disproved the Flying-fox Lemeur hypothesis. I wanted native flying Lemurs! :cry: :lol:
Hix: Um, am I misreading you or are you saying that Lemurs aren't Primates? (I didn't bother getting into the issue earlier in the thread, as along with the definition of the word 'feral', it seemed a bit too trivial to address. I suppose you've just put a straw on the camel's back
). The word 'feral' is colloquially ("incorrectly") used so often now that it seems pointless to correct anyone.I was very upset when DNA testing disproved the Flying-fox Lemeur hypothesis. I wanted native flying Lemurs!
:cry: :lol:...and so the thread went off topic...
Hix: Um, am I misreading you or are you saying that Lemurs aren't Primates? (I didn't bother getting into the issue earlier in the thread, as along with the definition of the word 'feral', it seemed a bit too trivial to address. I suppose you've just put a straw on the camel's back
I was very upset when DNA testing disproved the Flying-fox Lemeur hypothesis. I wanted native flying Lemurs!
Yeah, I know it's off-topic but somebody else breought it up, and this old theory has been mentioned on the site before. People are gonna read it and believe it.
Anyway, Flying Lemurs, or Colugos, are not Primates. They belong to an order called the Dermoptera. And the Dermoptera, these days, are considered to be closely related to the Primata.
Lemurs, however, are definitely Primata. Sub-order Prosimii, Family Lemuridae.
This is a Lemur (Ringtailed Lemur)
This is a Flying Lemur
And this is why they are called Flying Lemurs (they actually glide)
Hix
slim6y
Almost Legendary
I'd like to add, as the bringer up of the topic, that it is NOT off topic about the bats... It was stating that they're not pests/feral or any of the other and they're natives to this country... Therefore culling, killing or destroying bats is also not an option.
Seeing as the bats contribute heavily to the survival of the rainforest.
I haven't been up-to-date with the lemur/bat relationship. But now that this theory appears 'disproved' I need to go tell my source who on;y recently told me the lemur/bat closeness.
So apology accepted for the 'off-topic' comment and let's continue... The question is to cull or not to cull.. it never once stated in the question it was ot do with roos...
Another prime example I brought up was that of crocodiles. One person asked what good can a crocodile do for a city like Cairns... Simple.. Tourism... Removal of crocs is absolutely unneserscary... Signs are in place to warn people. And if people are stupid enough to enter the crocs domain, then the risk should be theirs.
The crocs shouldn't be culled unless for health reasons... eg... Disease (which apparently there is - hopefully it doesn't enter to TNQ or are we too late?).
Again... I went to bed with these thoughts.... (last night)
It's not what we have to change physically to start with... it's our initail attitudes that have to change.
The 'it can't be done' attitude simply must change for a sustainable Australia and infact world!
Seeing as the bats contribute heavily to the survival of the rainforest.
I haven't been up-to-date with the lemur/bat relationship. But now that this theory appears 'disproved' I need to go tell my source who on;y recently told me the lemur/bat closeness.
So apology accepted for the 'off-topic' comment and let's continue... The question is to cull or not to cull.. it never once stated in the question it was ot do with roos...
Another prime example I brought up was that of crocodiles. One person asked what good can a crocodile do for a city like Cairns... Simple.. Tourism... Removal of crocs is absolutely unneserscary... Signs are in place to warn people. And if people are stupid enough to enter the crocs domain, then the risk should be theirs.
The crocs shouldn't be culled unless for health reasons... eg... Disease (which apparently there is - hopefully it doesn't enter to TNQ or are we too late?).
Again... I went to bed with these thoughts.... (last night)
It's not what we have to change physically to start with... it's our initail attitudes that have to change.
The 'it can't be done' attitude simply must change for a sustainable Australia and infact world!
slim6y
Almost Legendary
I want to add another point about the bats:
My statement (which later appear incorrect, but will verify this over the next week) was that bats contain some 95% of our DNA making them Australia's closest native to humans (please note this is NOT proven and I can not actually justify this comment as of yet).
But the point is... You wouldn't kill a human for being a pest and eating your fruit. So why something that is 95% human? Just because they look so different?
To add to this point my daughter (100% human, although again not proven but most likely consists of 100% human DNA) exhibited fairly similar behaviour to bats. Firstly she pooped everywhere and secondly she went around devastating my strawberry crops. Altough she was sick afterwards.... The point is she was a pest, but we tolerated her... she since has grown up to be a very fine upstanding non-crop-destroying citizen. The same can not be said of bats.
However, the fact that I believed, at the time of printing, that bats were 95% human then therefore should not be culled as a pest was the original point.
Crop protection strategies, replanting bat food trees, and land use strategies need to be incorperated to live with this wonderful animal. And they are wonderful! I strongly dislike their pest status and the only good bat is a dead bat status. I hope these views change for the people who have them.
Visit the BatReach Centre in Kuranda to have your eyes opened just a little about these magnificent creatures.
My statement (which later appear incorrect, but will verify this over the next week) was that bats contain some 95% of our DNA making them Australia's closest native to humans (please note this is NOT proven and I can not actually justify this comment as of yet).
But the point is... You wouldn't kill a human for being a pest and eating your fruit. So why something that is 95% human? Just because they look so different?
To add to this point my daughter (100% human, although again not proven but most likely consists of 100% human DNA) exhibited fairly similar behaviour to bats. Firstly she pooped everywhere and secondly she went around devastating my strawberry crops. Altough she was sick afterwards.... The point is she was a pest, but we tolerated her... she since has grown up to be a very fine upstanding non-crop-destroying citizen. The same can not be said of bats.
However, the fact that I believed, at the time of printing, that bats were 95% human then therefore should not be culled as a pest was the original point.
Crop protection strategies, replanting bat food trees, and land use strategies need to be incorperated to live with this wonderful animal. And they are wonderful! I strongly dislike their pest status and the only good bat is a dead bat status. I hope these views change for the people who have them.
Visit the BatReach Centre in Kuranda to have your eyes opened just a little about these magnificent creatures.
I think Sdaji's comment about off-topic was directed at me, for focussing on a point not related to the culling issue.
And I'd be surprised if bats share 95% of out DNA. That suggests that the entire bat genome has been mapped. To my knowledge only the human, mouse and chicken genomes have had that done.
Hix
And I'd be surprised if bats share 95% of out DNA. That suggests that the entire bat genome has been mapped. To my knowledge only the human, mouse and chicken genomes have had that done.
Hix
slim6y
Almost Legendary
I think Sdaji's comment about off-topic was directed at me, for focussing on a point not related to the culling issue.
And I'd be surprised if bats share 95% of out DNA. That suggests that the entire bat genome has been mapped. To my knowledge only the human, mouse and chicken genomes have had that done.
Hix
Sorry about that accusation hix.... Ummmm... I don't know about the genome mapping... I am repeating sources I have heard... So your point is well taken. I need about a week to re-prove or disprove my source and then we can all live happily ever after...
My science field is physics/chemistry, not genetics. Although I did study fungi genetics at uni... but was rather bored with it.... But the only thing I can say is we're closer related to fungi than plants
D
dynea
Guest
Hi guys, It looks like a good debate so far.
I think I need to clear things up a little bit.
I never said that all areas of roos and Bats are a problem, and so i wouldn't like to hear that they were culled in all areas. I'm not even saying that I personally would cull these animals, I would leave that up to the propper authoritys.
There is a town in QLD called Charters Towers and every year millions of bats come into the main park in town and overpopulate the area, to the point of a fowl smell from the dying bats and poop, and terrible noise at all hours of the night and day. It sends the town crazy for the months that they cant do anything about these animals that become pests every year for months at a time.
I do not hate bats i think that they are cute.
And although i may have stated that I hate roos, I don't hate them. I was attacked buy a roo that had been rescued as a baby and humanized. It was 6ft tall and i was 5ft and 47kg. I came off second best, when all i was doing was walking past the house that it was living at. I didn't do a WIRES course because i hate australian native animals i did it because i care, but i couldn't afford the costs, and i couldn't handle the idea that i would have to put an animal down if it wasn't affraid of me. Even though my pesonal experiance would show good reason for not humanizing them.
I also Know for a fact that Australians arn't going to cull there native wildlife to any point where they will become a threatened species. We do love our native wildlife, there is just a point where even the drought has not stopped these animals from over populating themselfs.
I think I need to clear things up a little bit.
I never said that all areas of roos and Bats are a problem, and so i wouldn't like to hear that they were culled in all areas. I'm not even saying that I personally would cull these animals, I would leave that up to the propper authoritys.
There is a town in QLD called Charters Towers and every year millions of bats come into the main park in town and overpopulate the area, to the point of a fowl smell from the dying bats and poop, and terrible noise at all hours of the night and day. It sends the town crazy for the months that they cant do anything about these animals that become pests every year for months at a time.
I do not hate bats i think that they are cute.
And although i may have stated that I hate roos, I don't hate them. I was attacked buy a roo that had been rescued as a baby and humanized. It was 6ft tall and i was 5ft and 47kg. I came off second best, when all i was doing was walking past the house that it was living at. I didn't do a WIRES course because i hate australian native animals i did it because i care, but i couldn't afford the costs, and i couldn't handle the idea that i would have to put an animal down if it wasn't affraid of me. Even though my pesonal experiance would show good reason for not humanizing them.
I also Know for a fact that Australians arn't going to cull there native wildlife to any point where they will become a threatened species. We do love our native wildlife, there is just a point where even the drought has not stopped these animals from over populating themselfs.
OdessaStud
Very Well-Known Member
Who is this directed at???
If it is me... I don't have a 'save the roos' mentality... i have a 'it's our mistake, let's make it right' mentality. I don't care if it's roos or the carnivorous snail of NZ... they have their claim to the land, and we need to co-exist and do so sustainabley.
No it wasnt directed at you more so Richard Wells if anyone at all.
Cheers Odie
If it is me... I don't have a 'save the roos' mentality... i have a 'it's our mistake, let's make it right' mentality. I don't care if it's roos or the carnivorous snail of NZ... they have their claim to the land, and we need to co-exist and do so sustainabley.
No it wasnt directed at you more so Richard Wells if anyone at all.
Cheers Odie
slim6y
Almost Legendary
Thanks odie... appreciated... incidentally the carnivorous snail of NZ is in a bad prediciment... there's mineable land under there very small habitat. And only a few thousand of these wee pets still exist. relocating isn't an option as they're 'carnivourous' and their food source is very limited in distribution too.... Sad sad sad... mining companies say... fooey to snails.. so do many people... but if you look at these magnificent creatures you would be suprised... so it's not just cute cuddly (or attacking) roos... It also goes down as deep as moluscs...
Dynea: Sorry I thinki might have been over the top... I didn't direct the 'hate' statements at you - but at a general populous.
I know all about chateris towers... But you see it's the attitude... ok.. smell yucky.. poop.. youckier.. but bats should be treated with respect... turn it into a tourist attraction... Come see the 2 million bats... You'd be suprised... A good David Attenborough film, followed by a few "travel Oz" shows... Before long Chaters Towers comes the place to be for the months of the bat... A highly respected, wonderful creature...
See... it is an attitude... You might not say that if it was ulysees (sp??) butterflies... But they would (or their offspring) eat more and damage more than any bat ever will.... I think it all lies in an attitude...
the WIRES course, i know nothing about sorry... Can't comment.. but it seems a little off if you have to ice a roo because it likes you....
Culling is also not meant to be species genocide, but in fact meant to encourage healthy populations of the said species... no one in aussie, i hope, would kill all natives of a species to satisfy their farming needs... If there are such people then they need real education...
i totally agree with the no humanising... I think a healthy fear of animals by humans and a healthy fear of humans by animals is very important. The cassowary is one such case.
where you say 'we do love our wildlife' it's not that I believe contrary to this point, but evidence suggests some aussies are less willing to accept that their wildlife is some of the most diverse, and wonderful in the world. And without them, Aussie wouldn't be Aussie!
richardwells
Not so new Member
Save the Roo !
I have never intentionally mocked anyone for their thoughts, although some quite readily mock me ! What may appear as mocking, should really be interpreted for what it is...a total and unbridled contempt for the stupidity, wickedness and waste of a priceless heritage...that's all.
Richard Wells
I have never intentionally mocked anyone for their thoughts, although some quite readily mock me ! What may appear as mocking, should really be interpreted for what it is...a total and unbridled contempt for the stupidity, wickedness and waste of a priceless heritage...that's all.
Richard Wells
Mayo
Very Well-Known Member
We stuffed the country I get it. But now some arte trying to fix the problem as best we can. Doing nothing and blaming people for mistakes that were done befor we were borne doesn't help. If a cull of a species is required to keep it in check because of the way tings are now then guess what, it's going to be done untill someone comes up with a better solution.
Introduced species are doing a lot of damage, no arguement there from anyone I should think, but some of our natives are now doing damage and yes it is our fault's but instead of sitting on our hands and saying how noble they look we have to stop them from doing damage as well.
Qoute
"I have never intentionally mocked anyone for their thoughts, although some quite readily mock me ! What may appear as mocking, should really be interpreted for what it is...a total and unbridled contempt for the stupidity, wickedness and waste of a priceless heritage...that's all."
Richard Wells
Yes I have mocked you Richard but you have mocked a lot of people in this thread, and in an arguement like this I take no personal offence. You are generalising people and abusing people regularly,( take a look at your last post) so I say practise what you preach.
I'm not trying to mock you here but can I ask what it is that you farm Richard well's. My Grandfather (handed down to my father) had a sheep farm, my mother breeds horses, and my step father has a dairy farm.
Introduced species are doing a lot of damage, no arguement there from anyone I should think, but some of our natives are now doing damage and yes it is our fault's but instead of sitting on our hands and saying how noble they look we have to stop them from doing damage as well.
Qoute
"I have never intentionally mocked anyone for their thoughts, although some quite readily mock me ! What may appear as mocking, should really be interpreted for what it is...a total and unbridled contempt for the stupidity, wickedness and waste of a priceless heritage...that's all."
Richard Wells
Yes I have mocked you Richard but you have mocked a lot of people in this thread, and in an arguement like this I take no personal offence. You are generalising people and abusing people regularly,( take a look at your last post) so I say practise what you preach.
I'm not trying to mock you here but can I ask what it is that you farm Richard well's. My Grandfather (handed down to my father) had a sheep farm, my mother breeds horses, and my step father has a dairy farm.
Last edited:
Speaking of mucking things up there is a development not far from us that backs onto a local Koala sanctuary. There was a hell of a stink about the whole thing but obviously big business won out in the end, a week or so ago the bulldozers moved in and ripped down every tree so they could build another 100 or so houses. On the very first day of destruction there was a dead koala on the road and another stranded and bewildered in a tree isolated from it's stomping ground.
This apparently is progress, we seem to have an endless capacity to destroy, it is human nature. Animals get pushed out of their land and are then destroyed when they encoach on human territory.
It's quite amazing what 20 million people are able to do to a huge country in a very short time.
This apparently is progress, we seem to have an endless capacity to destroy, it is human nature. Animals get pushed out of their land and are then destroyed when they encoach on human territory.
It's quite amazing what 20 million people are able to do to a huge country in a very short time.
Mayo
Very Well-Known Member
Things are changing but very slowly. We do need to change things and proper solutions are required, as well as a change in peoples way of thinking.
slim6y
Almost Legendary
This really upsets me... But when I think about it, hypocritically, my house is built where a woodland forest once stood.... even though swampy, i bet my area had some wonderful and beautiful ecosystems... I rent the house... don't own it... But my eco footprint is remarkabley small... But what we have done is done... what are we doing to prevent it happening from now needs doing!
- Status
Similar threads
