luv this hybrid 75% diamond x jungle

[Sdaji]

So l will just stick to my beautiful Olive Python's least l know l wont end up with either crosses or hypos.

Olive Pythons have a lot of genetic variation too, it's just not displayed with obvious variation in colour and pattern like it is with Carpet Pythons. I find it puzzling that some people cringe at crossing a Jungle Carpet with a Diamond, yet are fine with crossing a Mt Isa Olive with a Katherine Olive because of ethical concerns. Not that I am saying their personal feelings are wrong, but I can't work out what their motives/ideals are.

I can't tell a Townsville Water Python from a Cairns Water Python, but I would much prefer a pure animal of either locality than a mixed QLD animal (but don't ask me to explain it, because I can't provide a reasonable explanation! I just want it that way!). If I liked Olives I would be equally particular.

Hypo bredli are a normal thing found in the wild by the way.

 

[Zoltag]

I'm a little bit confused with what you're trying to say. Morphs in ball pythons are still 100% ball python. My pastel ball python is still a ball python. As I understood it, hybrids were crosses between different breeds or localities of species, not different genetics of the same species.
So, are Jungles and Diamonds two morphologies in genetics? Or are they two different localities or species?
Breeding morphs together has no effect on the species (usually) unless they were planned to be released. Breeding different species can pose health issues and problems.

Back to the original topic, I like the two patterns, but I personally prefer stripes myself.

Ball pythons do not have officially recognised sub-species.

If you were to recognise Australian pythons only down to species level (as per ball pythons), then all Diamond x carpet or carpet x other carpet would simply be recognised as Morelia Spilota, everyone would be happy that the animals are pure M. Spilota (as they are) and there would be as much (or even more) variation than you see in Ball Pythons.

 

[Sdaji]

Can't this girl show us some pics of snakes, without all of you starting what will eventually turn into an aggressive 7 page debate, that she never intended it to be?

Of course not! This is the internet and emotional reptile keepers you're talking about!

 

[Zoltag]

...I can't work out what their motives/ideals are.

Everyone wants to discover a new species and that is easiest done when the genetic differences are colouring / patterning or a difference in the number of scales (but still plenty of overlap, mind you, so it is debatable whether there really is a difference).

Most of the world doesnt recognise sub-species or (worse still), locality specific variations of sub-species.

 

[Mitch1]

Love The Look Of That Second one.

 

[bluey66]

Olive Pythons have a lot of genetic variation too, it's just not displayed with obvious variation in colour and pattern like it is with Carpet Pythons. I find it puzzling that some people cringe at crossing a Jungle Carpet with a Diamond, yet are fine with crossing a Mt Isa Olive with a Katherine Olive because of ethical concerns. Not that I am saying their personal feelings are wrong, but I can't work out what their motives/ideals are.

I can't tell a Townsville Water Python from a Cairns Water Python, but I would much prefer a pure animal of either locality than a mixed QLD animal (but don't ask me to explain it, because I can't provide a reasonable explanation! I just want it that way!). If I liked Olives I would be equally particular.

Hypo bredli are a normal thing found in the wild by the way.

Sdaji, l use to have Olive Python's here in my home and let me tell you they all came from Darwin Northern Territory, and one pair also came from Katherine from Reedy's Reptile's, and they never ever got to breed with my Darwin phase Olive Python's, least none of what l kept ever came from Mt Isa QLD, so least what l kept all came from the same state Northern Territory, Darwin & Katherine are not far apart.

 

[Sdaji]

Everyone wants to discover a new species and that is easiest done when the genetic differences are colouring / patterning or a difference in the number of scales (but still plenty of overlap, mind you, so it is debatable whether there really is a difference).

Most of the world doesnt recognise sub-species or (worse still), locality specific variations of sub-species.

I also understand the motive for taxonomists to be splitters rather than lumpers (splitters get something to put a name on, lumpers don't). I understand that because of the motive to get their name on something new they'll take any excuse they can get. But I'm not sure why 'herper Joe with his pet Carpet Python' wants it to be locality/taxonomically pure rather than just looking pure, while on the other hand it doesn't matter if his Olive Python is a mongrel, because it still looks like a wild one. Would they suddenly care if there was some subtle scale characteristic they learned to check for on their Olives? The thing which puzzles me is that there seem to be two possible motives - having something which looks pure, and having something which is pure. If your motive is for the animal to look pure and you're not fussed about that invisible genetics stuff, sure, it makes sense if you cross your Olive localities, but wouldn't it then be fine to have hybridised Carpets as long as you picked one which looked pure? On the other hand, if it must BE pure, wouldn't it be equally important to keep your Olives pure?

For the record, I'm taxonomically a lumper (which it comes to species and subspecies - the labels) but when it comes to keeping and breeding, to me it's not pure unless it's locality pure, and for reasons I can not figure out myself, I like purity. I'm not fanatical about standing in other peoples' way though... largely because I would have no hope anyway!

 

[cris]

What horrible abominations, if you keep crossing carpet pythons with carpet pythons, one day you wont know if its a carpet python or a carpet python.

 

[Sdaji]

Sdaji, l use to have Olive Python's here in my home and let me tell you they all came from Darwin Northern Territory, and one pair also came from Katherine from Reedy's Reptile's, and they never ever got to breed with my Darwin phase Olive Python's, least none of what l kept ever came from Mt Isa QLD, so least what l kept all came from the same state Northern Territory, Darwin & Katherine are not far apart.

You don't need to justify yourself to me I'm not the purity police What you do is your choice. If it was me I'd breed true to locality if I could source the animals, but if it is legal to cross a WA Olive with a QLD Olive it's not my call to tell you you're not allowed to do it, let alone a Darwin x Katherine. What is your motive though? It sounds like you would prefer to keep them pure to either Katherine or Darwin if possible, but if you can't tell the difference between a Katherine Olive and a Darwin Olive, why? I'll admit I would want to keep them pure despite not being able to tell the difference, and I'll admit I have no better reason than sentimentality, which I couldn't expect anyone else to understand or share.

 

[bluey66]

You don't need to justify yourself to me I'm not the purity police What you do is your choice. If it was me I'd breed true to locality if I could source the animals, but if it is legal to cross a WA Olive with a QLD Olive it's not my call to tell you you're not allowed to do it, let alone a Darwin x Katherine. What is your motive though? It sounds like you would prefer to keep them pure to either Katherine or Darwin if possible, but if you can't tell the difference between a Katherine Olive and a Darwin Olive, why? I'll admit I would want to keep them pure despite not being able to tell the difference, and I'll admit I have no better reason than sentimentality, which I couldn't expect anyone else to understand or share.

Sdaji,
yes there is a difference between the Olive Python's found in either katherine or Darwin Northern Territory, and what the difference is between the 2 Olive Python's is their head shape it was Greg Fyfe who told me about this in 2005.

Greg Fyfe knows his Reptile's more than you and l ever will ( John - Sdaji ), now you can see why l decided to depart with the 2 Olive Python's l got from Reedy's Reptiles, cause l did not want them breeding with my 2 adults Olive python's from Darwin NT.

 

[Sdaji]

I'll have to try to remember to bring that up next time I talk to Greg.

Assuming it to be the case that you can tell a Darwin Olive from a Katherine Olive, would you be willing to breed them together if you couldn't tell the difference? Doesn't this kill what you were saying about being happy that no one was going to taint Olives with pattern or hypo morphs? (not that it's out of the question that we might have hypo Olives at some point).

So l will just stick to my beautiful Olive Python's least l know l wont end up with either crosses or hypos.[/quote

 

[xxlauraxx]

wooow!!

wow i love the first pic its so beautiful so is the 2nd but i defo prefer the first pic lol sorry but i dont like the 3rd pic i think its kind of whird looking but in a good way lol ?....
frm laura

 

[Kurto]

I wont be posting any more hybrid threads..:| to many people havin ago at me all the time i feel like i am bck in school...

Please feel free to post some awesome looking snakes! Some of us really enjoy seeing snake's that just look freak'n sweet! I wouldn't worry about any comment on here or any other forum thats mean or having a personal attack at you. At the end of the day there only words from poeple with tunnel vision! :lol:

 

[Colin]

good on you kurto I think its outrageous a grown man sends rude bullying private messages to some poor teenage girl in england because she loves her pythons and is excited to post pics of them in our forum..

If some people doesnt like threads about hybrids then dont read them - simple.

go for your life junglejaguar.. lets see some more hybrid pics please

 

[Retic]

Absolutely agree Colin, keep 'em coming

 

[ShadowDragon]

good on you kurto I think its outrageous a grown man sends rude bullying private messages to some poor teenage girl in england because she loves her pythons and is excited to post pics of them in our forum..

If some people doesnt like threads about hybrids then dont read them - simple.

go for your life junglejaguar.. lets see some more hybrid pics please

You're absolutely right Colin, it's truly awful when grown men send young girls disgusting PMs like that. I'm frankly surprised and sickened at the idea that men on this site would send innapropriate messages to girls/women. I can only hope it isn't a terribly common experience.

 

[TigerCoastal]

Jungle i love the pics you post, keep em comming. It mightn't be legal in some states here in aus but if it isnt done we will never know the possible results. All snakes are beautiful, individual animals that somebody somewhere will be happy to keep. Just because there is the odd person who has to act like a jo ho an force their beliefs down your throat dosnt mean we are all that way. If it wanst for line breeding we wouldnt have the "quality" of snake we have today, and what is line breeding? HUMANS forcing snakes to inbreed. Sure this isnt a big problem in reptiles, but to what degree does it happen in the wild? Do mother/son, father/daughter breed for generations or is there more possibility of another snake breeding with them? So whats the diff with cross breeding? Really, on a basic level? Its all just humans playing with nature to get what they think looks better

 

[venskeeper]

I don't think he will be bothering you anymore JungleJaguar...I see he has been suspended...hehe.

So please go ahead and throw some more pics up if you have any.

I for one really appreciate anyone that has put in the hard work and care for their animals, so don't let one jealous person put you off from what your doing

 

[Sdaji]

I wont be posting any more hybrid threads..:| to many people havin ago at me all the time i feel like i am bck in school...

If you're going to talk to reptile people you're going to get people abusing you. Unfortunately, you'll get it even if you post nothing more than "Hi everyone, I like snakes, nice to meet you" (I'm exaggerating less than you might think). Seriously, people will nit pick and cause a fight no matter what you you say. Reptile people polarise themselves on many issues, so if you're on a side you'll have people on the other side abusing you, and if you're on the fence some people will even abuse you for that! Don't let it worry you

 

[richardsc]

alot of coastals have that red coloring when young