scam7278
Very Well-Known Member
im lookin at spotted mac 
Licence issues
- Thread starter glacey
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I'd also like to mention that many of the members of this site learnt how to keep reptiles long before an internet existed, let alone this site. Back then, the only way to get answers to questions was to read books or join a herp society (if one was in your area).
I think that too many people (mainly newbies) are taking the easy way out and just asking the simple questions here, instead of looking in the books or researching it on the net.
Hix
I think that too many people (mainly newbies) are taking the easy way out and just asking the simple questions here, instead of looking in the books or researching it on the net.
Hix
nvenm8
Well-Known Member
There is only one sort of stupid Question- that’s the one that isn't asked.
I must compliment the poster of this thread though. Now all those newbie’s or people who have genuine concerns will be reluctant to ask the questions needed for fear of being ridiculed. Well Done! Damn I wish I could inflict tone of voice and sarcasm into a typed response.
We all learn from our mistakes, and yes some people will never learn. It happens all the time, animals being neglected through ignorance, laziness and a loss of interest. No manner of testing will help these people.
But there is a good chance that if someone needs help and is prepared to ask the questions needed to help their reptiles and they truly want to do the right thing, regardless of how silly some of the questions may seem surely we owe it to the reptile to answer their questions without the ridicule.
I must compliment the poster of this thread though. Now all those newbie’s or people who have genuine concerns will be reluctant to ask the questions needed for fear of being ridiculed. Well Done! Damn I wish I could inflict tone of voice and sarcasm into a typed response.
We all learn from our mistakes, and yes some people will never learn. It happens all the time, animals being neglected through ignorance, laziness and a loss of interest. No manner of testing will help these people.
But there is a good chance that if someone needs help and is prepared to ask the questions needed to help their reptiles and they truly want to do the right thing, regardless of how silly some of the questions may seem surely we owe it to the reptile to answer their questions without the ridicule.
P
Pythoninfinite
Guest
Hixy, from the way some of these guys write, I seriously doubt their ability to read. I'm sorry to disagree Jeramie, but there ARE stupid questions, and sometimes even more stupid answers. The reptile world is full of 1 week experts... A case in point, a couple of weeks ago the question was asked "Can I keep a scorpion with my snake?" The debate was carried by several newcomers, some of whom were supportive of the idea - "could see no problem with it..." Absolutely stupid question, answered sometimes by people who have not the faintest idea of what they are talking about, or the potential consequence to either animal. Or coating a snake with oil or glycerine if it has a rough shed - the very worst thing you can do - there have been some doozies just lately. I believe Glacey has raised a very important topic with this, and although it's difficult on the internet, we need to ensure that the lunatics don't take over the asylum, and that may mean being very blunt on some occasions.
Jamie.
Jamie.
I agree with Hix regarding people being lazy and not researching there questions before they post them. They are taking the easy option and waiting for someone to provide them the info. I have read posts from previous months looking for the answers to a question I might have before I post it and have some one tell me "check previous threads"
There is a world of knowledge on tap with old threads lets learn to use it instead of expecting someone else to provide you with the answers for the simplest of questions.
I spent months and months just reading old thread because I found them extremely interesting, from that I knew the answers to some of my questions have been covered and I would make the point of searching them out again before I posted the question, if I couldn't find the old thread then I would post it with out any hesitation.
Davo
There is a world of knowledge on tap with old threads lets learn to use it instead of expecting someone else to provide you with the answers for the simplest of questions.
I spent months and months just reading old thread because I found them extremely interesting, from that I knew the answers to some of my questions have been covered and I would make the point of searching them out again before I posted the question, if I couldn't find the old thread then I would post it with out any hesitation.
Davo
mertle
Very Well-Known Member
Ok here's my 2 cents worth
Being a new owner of a mac I have found this site a wonderful source of information.
Before being a new owner of my Mac I read as many books as I could lay my hands on and also scoured the net for info on reptile keeping.
Now it seems that because I like to ask questions I am being harmful to my snake even though I have done research.
but asking real live people who have lots more experience than I do is the easy way out and the lazy way to learn?
The reason I use the net is that I can get an answer as soon as a problem may occur, not when I have waited to find a book in the shops or gone on the hunt somewhere else to find the information. How is finding new friends and asking questions being lazy in learning?
People use the internet becaust it's here and now, in many keepers time it wasn't available, but because it is available now does that make us lazy for using it???
Some answers on here may conflict, some people should learn more before buying their reptile, but at least we have this community to help if we are not considered unworthy owners by those with more experience due to asking a few questions to better house or keep our new pets.
Any new owners that want to ask questions, go ahead, the nice people will answer and try to help you and your pet, the ones that think you are stupid or lazy for asking will just sit lazily by and expect you to go read a book.
As I said, just my 2 cents worth......................
Being a new owner of a mac I have found this site a wonderful source of information.
Before being a new owner of my Mac I read as many books as I could lay my hands on and also scoured the net for info on reptile keeping.
Now it seems that because I like to ask questions I am being harmful to my snake even though I have done research.
but asking real live people who have lots more experience than I do is the easy way out and the lazy way to learn?
The reason I use the net is that I can get an answer as soon as a problem may occur, not when I have waited to find a book in the shops or gone on the hunt somewhere else to find the information. How is finding new friends and asking questions being lazy in learning?
People use the internet becaust it's here and now, in many keepers time it wasn't available, but because it is available now does that make us lazy for using it???
Some answers on here may conflict, some people should learn more before buying their reptile, but at least we have this community to help if we are not considered unworthy owners by those with more experience due to asking a few questions to better house or keep our new pets.
Any new owners that want to ask questions, go ahead, the nice people will answer and try to help you and your pet, the ones that think you are stupid or lazy for asking will just sit lazily by and expect you to go read a book.
As I said, just my 2 cents worth......................
snakes4me2
Very Well-Known Member
Monitor_Man said:
Are you reading these posts before replying??? Who said anything about feeding a dead snake?? and why would you even try?.
P
Pythoninfinite
Guest
Mertle, my frustration isn't with people like yourself - you have a considered approach to the problems you may encounter, and because of that, your difficulties will likely be few. If you, and the others who may be critical of my bluntness, care to read the responses I've made in the past few months, you will see I have no desire to deter reasonable enquiry, and always endeavour to be as helpful as I can. Of course animals of all sorts will always suffer at the hands of humans, and I will do all I can to minimize that with people who listen, absorb and think about what they are doing.
I have never said people are stupid or lazy for asking questions, and of course this forum is a great source of info for us all, not just newcomer herp keepers. I have never sat "lazily by" where there is a genuine quest for advice or knowledge (where I may be able to help). I have been a reptile keeper for 40+ years and it concerns me when I read some of the questions here, and the responses given by inexperienced individuals who think they know it all - none of us do.
Jamie.
I have never said people are stupid or lazy for asking questions, and of course this forum is a great source of info for us all, not just newcomer herp keepers. I have never sat "lazily by" where there is a genuine quest for advice or knowledge (where I may be able to help). I have been a reptile keeper for 40+ years and it concerns me when I read some of the questions here, and the responses given by inexperienced individuals who think they know it all - none of us do.
Jamie.
Tristis
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mabye we need a basic do's and dont's list for hatchling snakes and lizards that has the basic question and answers about husbandry (like FAQ). if the people have a problem they can read it first and if they still have problems they can post it on the site. i red the care sheets on here about and macs by slateman and its completely useless (no ofence). most pythons can be kept identicaly to each other, theres no difirence between keeping carpets and keeping macs. so why cant we have a basic care sheet or something close to it. just my 2 cents
Simple
Well-Known Member
I have to say, when I first heard of this site, I was really excited about the chance of having friendly and informative chats with people who share my passion. And although in a lot of cases there are nice people, I sometimes find this site as nasty as high school!!!!! When considering buying a reptile my partner and I researched everything we could possibly think of. I took a written list of questions to the so called reputable reptile shop I purchased my snake from and set everything up according to their advise, and the info obtained by books. I later found out that I was underfeeding my earlier pythons, they are not unhealthy but will probably never grow to the size they could have been. And I lost part of the tail of my first due to shedding problems which didn't become apparent until it was too late - due to lack of education. I now deal with a wonderful breeder who helps with any questions (sometimes gives answers where you have to really think and use common sense in order to understand) and all reptiles at my place are enjoying the benefits from this. As stated before, different books have conflicting info, as does the net, breeders, and herp owners. A book that we find helpful is "The complete Chondro" by Greg Maxwell. Even though it is a book for GTP's you can adapt the info to suit most other types of pythons. The other thing is, licensing is for trace ability not to make sure you know how to look after the animals. I am now breeding (wouldn't call myself a breeder yet) and honestly believe that the person selling the snake should be responsible for educating who they sell to as they have bred them and looked after them. All my animals will be sent with a care sheet stating my opinion of how they should be set up and looked after. Obviously people may find other info later down the track that suits them better, but if they are given the basics at least their new pet has a good chance of making it. I agree about some answers not being ideal, but isn't this web site all about "in our opinions"? And as for the lazy comments, the process of trying to get a straight answer in regards to caring for reptiles is often exhausting on this site, as you get a mixture of people telling you what they believe to be the answer and people bagging you or others for their answers.
As you mentioned Mertle, before owning your herp you read as many books as you could on the subject, this at the very least provided you with the basics. So my comments do not apply to a keeper like your self, you have made the effort! It is more to the people who do not even know what there respective herps even look like. I wont be too specific but someone recently posted a question about features of their snakes head, It turned out to be the heat pits, this person obviously lacked the knowledge or understanding of the animal to identify these features as normal. It is almost like asking "where does my python poo from"? (just an example).
Nome
Very Well-Known Member
I just feel very negative about the future of our hobby.
I feel very sorry for some of the animals out there. There needs to be a good look at our licensing system, for all animals.
I feel very sorry for some of the animals out there. There needs to be a good look at our licensing system, for all animals.
peterescue
Very Well-Known Member
I remember having some of my questions laughed at on occasion when I was about 12 or 13.
My thoughts at the time, what a bunch of A-holes.
So I never went to another herp society meeting again.
Literature at the time was very limited. Cogger's wasnt even printed yet.
My thoughts at the time, what a bunch of A-holes.
So I never went to another herp society meeting again.
Literature at the time was very limited. Cogger's wasnt even printed yet.
Oof
Active Member
I kinda feel, as a new guy here, that i'm in this firing line.
I've raised snakes before but in another country.
I joined this site so that I could garner good, solid and reliable information from people that are already handling the snakes I am interested in.
I can read and read and read and go to as many shops as possible. But going to some of these "pet stores" and being helped by some 16yr old on school holidays that wouldn't know the difference between a dog and a cat is pretty frustrating. I have to agree with one of the other members in another post about how so many aquarium and pet shops have suddenly turned into reptile experts. Me thinks they smelled a tidy profit and away they went.
Hence why i'm here. I'd like to think that before I even purchas a herp that this site and the people on it would be very happy to help out someone seeking genuine information. As I say to all my friends..."I'm smart enough to know that I don't know everything."
My questions have mostly been cage dimensions regarding certain breeds and looking for a good breeder that has some snakes with a good temperment. To me, people that breed and regularly handle the animals are the best to talk to. My questions have had some good answers and I am extremely grateful. Mind you, i'm still probably a few weeks off purchasing my herp as I want to make sure u have a solid setup.
As my father said to me.........."Do it once and do it right."
So for myself, i'm sorry if my questions don't seem to be exquisite enough. But as far as i'm concerned the stupidest question is the one you haven't asked. To me it's better to know too much than not enough. Especially after spending so much money you want to have a happy and healthy snake.
My 2 cents. Soz for the rant.
I've raised snakes before but in another country.
I joined this site so that I could garner good, solid and reliable information from people that are already handling the snakes I am interested in.
I can read and read and read and go to as many shops as possible. But going to some of these "pet stores" and being helped by some 16yr old on school holidays that wouldn't know the difference between a dog and a cat is pretty frustrating. I have to agree with one of the other members in another post about how so many aquarium and pet shops have suddenly turned into reptile experts. Me thinks they smelled a tidy profit and away they went.
Hence why i'm here. I'd like to think that before I even purchas a herp that this site and the people on it would be very happy to help out someone seeking genuine information. As I say to all my friends..."I'm smart enough to know that I don't know everything."
My questions have mostly been cage dimensions regarding certain breeds and looking for a good breeder that has some snakes with a good temperment. To me, people that breed and regularly handle the animals are the best to talk to. My questions have had some good answers and I am extremely grateful. Mind you, i'm still probably a few weeks off purchasing my herp as I want to make sure u have a solid setup.
As my father said to me.........."Do it once and do it right."
So for myself, i'm sorry if my questions don't seem to be exquisite enough. But as far as i'm concerned the stupidest question is the one you haven't asked. To me it's better to know too much than not enough. Especially after spending so much money you want to have a happy and healthy snake.
My 2 cents. Soz for the rant.
Hi All,
I read this post, No going to comment on the type of questions because I have not been around this long enough. However on thing I do know a bit about is the licensing laws. I have move states a few time, and have my final one coming up early next year.
The one state that worries me the most is NSW (home town). It seems to me that it was more about money collection, and providing a very very limit animal control (last Re-renewal was 2004). Victoria is along the same lines, although you need to have the document signed by doc, cop, vet, Accountant.. and other member of the professional community. The ACT rules seem to be the ideal, they seem to based on the idea you need to walk before you can run.. eg little blue tongue before you get your python (example only). W.A is not to bad (moving there next). Hybrid between the NSW and Act law. Certain Categories require no additional Id\information while the high categories require written documentation, plus in some cases an house inspection.
Anyway.. just my two cents as well... have we made a dollar yet?
I read this post, No going to comment on the type of questions because I have not been around this long enough. However on thing I do know a bit about is the licensing laws. I have move states a few time, and have my final one coming up early next year.
The one state that worries me the most is NSW (home town). It seems to me that it was more about money collection, and providing a very very limit animal control (last Re-renewal was 2004). Victoria is along the same lines, although you need to have the document signed by doc, cop, vet, Accountant.. and other member of the professional community. The ACT rules seem to be the ideal, they seem to based on the idea you need to walk before you can run.. eg little blue tongue before you get your python (example only). W.A is not to bad (moving there next). Hybrid between the NSW and Act law. Certain Categories require no additional Id\information while the high categories require written documentation, plus in some cases an house inspection.
Anyway.. just my two cents as well... have we made a dollar yet?
interesting thread cant be bothered reading every post but there are several things i would like to say.
-people are correct imo that many new herpers are tight when it comes to cash, they just dont want to spend the cash, the amount of people that come into the pet shop i work in and i tell them things like..." your dragon NEEDS UV light other wise you will stunt their growth, metabolic bone disease ect..... they respond with "im not paying that...they will have to go without....they will be fine" its people like this that shouldnt be able to keep herps, yes it may be expensive but for god sakes do you want them to live healthy and happy lives or be sick unhealthy and come back a month later asking why isnt mey herp eating. trust me this happens more then i wish it did. things arent going well for them but they never wanted to spend the dosh and do what is right. unfortunatly this will always happen, there are alot more people keeping fisk with this attitude.
-i like the idea about putting the price up 20 bucks and giving them a book, maby even more and give them a couple of books, then they can give them a 20 question quiz or something to see that they are capable of keeping.
-as for the repetative questions that are very simple being asked all the time on this forum......so what!! dont like the question dont read the thread im just pleased that there are a good amount of first timers out there that are willing to admit they dont know what they are doing and are happy to ask the question at the end of the day they are only careing about there herps and if i can help then i will.
- i do see the poin t of the thread though and it is concerning that there are so many questions being asked, imo the ones asking arent the prob its the ones that arent members and that wont bother to ask, if the number of new comers here that need help refect the number that arent members that need help then there are alot of questions out there that need answering for the new herpers.
-people are correct imo that many new herpers are tight when it comes to cash, they just dont want to spend the cash, the amount of people that come into the pet shop i work in and i tell them things like..." your dragon NEEDS UV light other wise you will stunt their growth, metabolic bone disease ect..... they respond with "im not paying that...they will have to go without....they will be fine" its people like this that shouldnt be able to keep herps, yes it may be expensive but for god sakes do you want them to live healthy and happy lives or be sick unhealthy and come back a month later asking why isnt mey herp eating. trust me this happens more then i wish it did. things arent going well for them but they never wanted to spend the dosh and do what is right. unfortunatly this will always happen, there are alot more people keeping fisk with this attitude.
-i like the idea about putting the price up 20 bucks and giving them a book, maby even more and give them a couple of books, then they can give them a 20 question quiz or something to see that they are capable of keeping.
-as for the repetative questions that are very simple being asked all the time on this forum......so what!! dont like the question dont read the thread im just pleased that there are a good amount of first timers out there that are willing to admit they dont know what they are doing and are happy to ask the question at the end of the day they are only careing about there herps and if i can help then i will.
- i do see the poin t of the thread though and it is concerning that there are so many questions being asked, imo the ones asking arent the prob its the ones that arent members and that wont bother to ask, if the number of new comers here that need help refect the number that arent members that need help then there are alot of questions out there that need answering for the new herpers.
P
Pythoninfinite
Guest
If you reckon NSW is into revenue collection, wait till you get to WA Loudenj... I'm from Perth, and was involved in drafting the regs there with CALM. They have presented West Australians with the most complex, restrictive and expensive system in the country, and one which actually allows for (and encourages) major habitat destruction with a seemingly endless legalised wild-taking system.
I hope you're not planning to take anything with you into WA, especially pythons, because you won't be permitted to take anything but WA endemic species, and won't be allowed to take any pythons at all.
Jamie.
I hope you're not planning to take anything with you into WA, especially pythons, because you won't be permitted to take anything but WA endemic species, and won't be allowed to take any pythons at all.
Jamie.
AntaresiaLady
Very Well-Known Member
Monitor Man- as a matter of fact I have. See my thread entitled 'My Whinge' to see the details.
Just in case some people misunderstood: I wasn't saying all newbies are lazy and ask simple questions. There are many I've seen who do the research, and ask the intelligent questions that haven't been asked before. It's just that there appears to many more of the other kind.
How many breeders (of beardies, EWDs, coastals, maccys, stimmys and childrens) get calls each year from people wanting freebies?
Someone, about a year ago, said they enjoyed keeping herps five years ago, when the hobby was not so popular. I know what they mean, it was better back then.
Hix
How many breeders (of beardies, EWDs, coastals, maccys, stimmys and childrens) get calls each year from people wanting freebies?
Someone, about a year ago, said they enjoyed keeping herps five years ago, when the hobby was not so popular. I know what they mean, it was better back then.
Hix
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