Underwoodisaurus or Nephrurus

[GeckPhotographer]

bit of a shame really!

Now I have something to work on in the future. Do you know how many specimens of sheai and asper were used?

 

[Nephrurus1]

Now I have something to work on in the future. Do you know how many specimens of sheai and asper were used?

sheai = 1
asper = 3
amyae = 4

 

[killimike]

This is an awesome thread

I can't comment directly on the numbers of animals used as I don't know the field, but it's interesting that the same number weren't used for every species. And no pilbs if I read that right? I'm gonna have to get that paper.

 

[Moreliavridis]

Where can i obtain a copy of this paper?

 

[GeckPhotographer]

Scott put his email and said email and he would email a copy above.

 

[Treknotechelaps]

I would of liked to see the paper assign names to the milli complex as well including the reserecting of husbandi etc.

I would have also... I read on another forum that the isolated Pilbara population will be described as a new species 'seorsus' by Doughty and Oliver
The western and eastern 'milii' look quite different from one another, how many species are lumped under the eastern 'milii'

 

[GeckPhotographer]

Hmm interesting I have heard the Eastern and Western milli are not really different when it comes down to it. I have seen both in the wild and saw no superficial differences. Nonetheless for a paper with such a broad title it could have done a bit more species specific work than it did.

 

[eipper]

Stephen,

It really depends on where your eastern and western "milli' are from. They are genetically distinct from each other and there are consistant yet subtle morphological differences.

My understanding was the genetics of the pilibara milli are just that (milli) and are more or less genetically identical to the western (type pop) animals.

Cheerss,
Scott

 

[GeckPhotographer]

Thanks Scott, I don't really know much about milli and was not looking at them in detail when I was in WA.

 

[JasonL]

Jason,

It is not really heresay...it comes down to the interpretation of the author(s) from the data that is available to them at the time. The point of difference for many taxonomists is the interpretation of the species concept. As methods is both the taking of and the analysis of data evolves, there will be a number of changes accordingly.

Whether or not a particular author takes on a taxonomic changes is really up to the author themselves. This usually is determined from the evidence presented in the paper itself, but certainly personal bias can seemly attribute to the general consensus.

Cheers,
Scott

Ha ha scott, thats just a technical way of saying what I meant ... plenty of papers get published and species split up every year but only a small portion of these get accepted by the main stream herpetological society, the rest get lost by time, only remembered by the old school and believed by the extremist splitters :lol: And a change in genus doesn't change the reptile, just the parameters of which it was boxed in... and many sway back and forth for some time before people decide to leave them alone......
Jamie James eh? never heard of him, is that a book? I'll look it up.

 

[eipper]

Jamie James eh? never heard of him, is that a book? I'll look it up.

Jason,

Not quite sure what the above means?

In a recent conversation with a well known author re taxonomy and I will paraphase slightly but....
"the animals know which is which. We have a problem in the sense that we (Humans) are forever trying to put square pegs into round holes. All the while trying to arrange the holes in a certain order that seems to change with the seasons"

Spliters/Lumpers and all between, get used to the taxonomic rollercoaster......at least its always changing and it never seems to end.....I'd rather enjoy the ride myself, than worry about the next change in direction!

Cheers,
Scott

 

[JasonL]

Thats a good quote Scott... and was sort of what I was saying by my initial comment that upset a few... basically I know what a milii is, I've kept and bred heaps, found literally thousands of them, and don't really care what the latest name is for them.... I was basically pointing out that some people place too much emphasis on a name.

 

[Elapidae1]

Jason, I quoted from the book, The Snake Charmer A Life And Death In Pursuit Of Knowledge, by Jamie James. It is the story of world renowned herpetologist Dr Joe Slowinski who died from the bite of a Many Banded Krait while leading one of the most arduos and ambitious expeditions ever into the jungles of Burma.
Rather light reading but I found it very enjoyable.

 

[JasonL]

cheer's Steve, I'll try and look it up.

 

[Treknotechelaps]

"the animals know which is which. We have a problem in the sense that we (Humans) are forever trying to put square pegs into round holes. All the while trying to arrange the holes in a certain order that seems to change with the seasons"

Spliters/Lumpers and all between, get used to the taxonomic rollercoaster......at least its always changing and it never seems to end.....I'd rather enjoy the ride myself, than worry about the next change in direction!

Great quote!
Taxonomy is really interesting, it will always be forever changing and always look forward to seeing new species described. It would all be pretty boring if every herp had a name that didn't change and every species had been described.
Especially places like Australia, where our herpetofauna is extremely diverse and alot of places have not been explored and surveyed for herps, there will constantly be taxonomic changes for a long while. There are so many new species to be named, species complexes to be split up, and more undiscovered species to be found, and few taxonomists in Australia (compared to other countries in the world). Enjoy the ride!

 

[JasonL]

hahaha, there will NEVER come a day where every animal is described, too many people sharpening their razors to split hairs into microscopic pieces!

 

[GeckPhotographer]

hahaha, there will NEVER come a day where every animal is described, too many people sharpening their razors to split hairs into microscopic pieces!

We split with lasers these days. But I do think eventually all animals would be described, if we kept record of those already described and no major disaster wiped out humans, but that might end up problematic.