Snake_Whisperer
Very Well-Known Member
You've got that spot on BM. I have found that the "live" experience is nothing at all like the bickering you see on the internet. All of the horrible "old timers" have been nothing but helpful to me.
Breeding Debate
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You've got that spot on BM. I have found that the "live" experience is nothing at all like the bickering you see on the internet. All of the horrible "old timers" have been nothing but helpful to me.
The stergeon is an exotic fish :lol:
cwtiger
Active Member
It doesn't matter what you want to breed there is never a sure thing that you will make money. All offspring cost money to raise, house until they can go to potential new owners. I feel that people have a right to breed if they want to. I agree that research should be done and they should know what to expect and be prepared to have some hatchlings 12months later. As for the old hats and their prized snakes again it is the way of the times that things aren't worth as much as when they bought them. To think that any animal will fetch what you paid for the parent is being ignorant. I also know breeders who complain that they paid the high price for their GTP or their ALBINO"S and now they are selling for minimal yet they again are sitting on 30plus new hatchlings of each breed that they continue to breed each year. I have found a great deal of joy in purchasing a hatchling watching it grow and mature raising it to breeding age breeding with it and having great success in the egg laying letting nature take it's course and allow Mum to incubate then watch all said eggs hatch, shed, feed and go on to new homes with very excited new owners the things that I and my children have learnt is priceless and will be worth all the old hats thinking and saying that I have helped flood the market. But I am a strong believer that you need to know about your snake and be prepared fully before taking the plunge. The above is just my opinion.
cwtiger, there are few things in your post that I would like to comment on. First of all, who are the breeders that spent lots of money on their stock are complain now? Could you clarify? I am in contact with many of them but I don't hear any complaints. In my opinion, this is a rumour that some "Johny came lately" made up and successfully spread it around. Please PM me at least some names of those who complain. Secondly, the old hats are not flooding the market, they choose carefully what to breed and what not, and in what numbers. At least that's my observation. You are right that it's everybody's right to breed but it's also everybody's responsibility to take care of the consequences i.e. what to do with the babies.
RIGHTS ALWAYS COME WITH RESPONSIBILITIES.
RIGHTS ALWAYS COME WITH RESPONSIBILITIES.
Southern_Forest_Drag
Well-Known Member
this thread hurt my head.
Agreed. Tough to know if to comment.
One thing I can't quite get my head around is that many/most of the so called "big name breeders" were pioneers of a particular animal (e.g. Albino Darwins, Albino Olives, Greens, Roughies) and the hobby then holds these particular people on a pedestal (wrightly or wrongly) & in turn their breeding seems to carry more weight than "average joe herp keeper". I wonder if "average joe herp keeper" could have acheived the same breeding success with these rarer animals if given the chance? Then their breedings of other animals been more respected? That sounds like I'm disrespecting the seasoned herpers that have paved the way for me but its not my intention, I have plenty of respect for those "old hats"
, especially those that have published papers on their experiances with their animals. I'm just throwing out some food for thought.In my opinion new people to herp should concentrate on being the best "keeper" they can be. After reaserching all you can & if you feel you have the space to keep all your hatchies for a year or more, then consider breeding. I was a keeper of pythons for 7 or 8 years before breeding.
GeckoJosh
Almost Legendary
So you are saying that there arent breeders out there who are not happy with the fact the animals they hoped to breed and make some money aren't worth half as much now?
Colin
morelia
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good comment.. I think people should concern themselves with what they are personally doing instead of worrying about the next person. and should not knock people with more or less experience than themselves.. we're all in this hobby with a common interest for reptiles and the hobby would be better off if everyone tried to help each other and showed more tolerance to others instead of the infighting we seem to see a lot of these days.
people should buy animals on their merits at the time instead of worrying about what the price will be in a year or two.. enjoy the animals you have and forget the dollars.. the pleasure and enjoyment I get from my animals is worth much more than the dollars I've paid for them.
Tell me who they are. Of course there is an element of disappointment but don't hear anyone complaining...... and I know quite a few people who paid big bucks for their snakes, they call it investment. They will still get there money back (and so they should) just not so fast and they seem content with it. Whenever I ask to name those who complain (PM, privately) there is a silence - do you know anyone in particular?
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Totally agree Colin, I have helped more newbies than I care to count and have ALWAYS given then info to the best of my knowledge, When I was wholesaling reptile products into pet shops over a 3 yr period I would have helped at least one person a day with absolutely no benefit to myself. I do it because I love to help people with any problems they may have. It is jsut a shame when you hear newbies say 'whats the best setup for a a pair of adult bredli I just bough. I want to breed them cause they are worth $250 ea and they can have a clutch of 40+ hatchies'....I still give them advice, but also warn them of the time involved in setting up, caring for and disposing of the hatchies. Most then think twice about it.
GeckoJosh
Almost Legendary
shortstuff61
Well-Known Member
Hugsta, I agree. I have personally met people that will take it one further and look to get a male and 2, 3 or 4 females and do the same for more than one species in a hope to mass produce (affordable, readily available species) and make money. This is the exact attitude I was trying to divert in a thread from the other week, however I did use a less than perfect species as an example, which seemed to detract from my point.
Perko
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V
Virides
Guest
The funny thing is, you buy the lower end (price wise) in the market and expect to make a motsa on it, but if everyone else has the same idea, you end up just trying to sell 50 of ur lower end with the other 1000 lower end animals. This would happen with all price brackets more or less.
I am not sure that there would be people just buying snakes for the sake of having another snake if all they could choose from were just bredli.
$250 per snake does not equal $250 per hatchy as you would expect...
When I came into this hobby I thought it was all about the snakes and while that is true, it would seem some, just want to exploit their pets. Reputable breeders and the ones who want to help the hobby with quality animals and research into making the whole experience better are the ones I commend.
Each to their own, just find it unfortunate.
Umbral
Very Well-Known Member
I have great news, Im going to try and breed some of my herps this season, I haven't bred them before and am looking foreward to it. I'm not sure the nuns breeding at home deserve such bad press. I for one look after my pythons well ie my male costal has a 6x3x4 enclosure with a warm and cool hide he has a hot and a cooler side of the enclosure which is cleaned weekly. How many big breeders offer an enclosure like that? I already have homes for four offspring (should I manage to get them) and if I can't sell the rest Ill house them well and look after them so IMO there are good and bad people on each side of the scale (I have 6 pythons all bought from big breeders and have had a most pleasurable time with them, very helpful and friendly) Get off your high horses and stop putting everyone in one basket.
saximus
Almost Legendary
lol Umbral did you actually read this whole thread?
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