Coastal or Intergrade???
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A cross is a hybrid not an intergrade. Integrades occur where differant species or subspecies "melt" together where their ranges meet.
I dont think the snake can be classified beyond being a carpet snake without knowing its exact origin and breeding history.
I think it might be from a portmaqurie/coastal integrade jungle cross mother with a diamond cross coastal father
I dont think the snake can be classified beyond being a carpet snake without knowing its exact origin and breeding history.
I think it might be from a portmaqurie/coastal integrade jungle cross mother with a diamond cross coastal father
Australis
Almost Legendary
Rosemary said:
Nothing, until you know what it is, and seeing as though that may never happen, i wouldnt breed from it at all.
Matt
Snake Catcher Victoria
Almost Legendary
it is a bright coastal, no doubt about it ]
shes very nice to.
baz
]shes very nice to.
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SnakeWrangler
Very Well-Known Member
People don't you realise that there are invisible barriers that prevent one carpet from breeding with neighbouring carpets and they can NEVER go passed it and they NEVER will... :roll:
alumba
Well-Known Member
yep hybrid
Snake Catcher Victoria
Almost Legendary
why do you think its a hybrid??
ive seen pure coastals that look just like this
ive seen pure coastals that look just like this
I think it is probably most likely just a coastal, but its virtually impossible to tell without knowing the history. I think ppl are too quick to think it doesnt look like my coastal or the one i have seen so it must be a hybrid.
I would probably breed it with a coastal carpet, just dont claim it to be some type of pure locality unless you can know for sure. IMO its fine to breed from.
I would probably breed it with a coastal carpet, just dont claim it to be some type of pure locality unless you can know for sure. IMO its fine to breed from.
raptor
Well-Known Member
Hybrid
cwarren72
Very Well-Known Member
looks almost the same as my intergrade
Australis
Almost Legendary
cwarren72 said:
Yours is a natural intergrade isnt?
Matt
What Jamie said is spot on.
I have typed out the difference between hybrids and intergrades so many time it's starting to loose all meaning.
In the Port Macquaire area 'intergrades' are found, these are not hybrids or crosses, they are just a locale of carpet python, thousands of years ago it's likely that diamonds and coastals did cross in this area but since then these wild crosses have become isolated from both coastals and diamonds.
So for thousands of years intergrades have been breeding with intergrades to become their own varient of carpet python.
Now people say 'how do you know theres no diamonds or carpets around port macquaire?' The answer is easy, ask anyone who lives or has spent anytime around Port and they will tell you the same thing, it's just intergrades.
I've been to Port mac many many times and have only ever seen intergrades.
As for pyshical lines between the species they probably isn't any but that doesn't mean something isn't stopping diamonds an coastals getting to Port.
To my knowledge there is only one person who breeds the genuine Port mac (intergrades) carpets, that is Greg Hollis, i'm sure Jamie can back me up on this. I don't know if Greg is still breeding them.
As far as i'm concerned the only people who can lay claim to having genuine Port Macs are people who have brought from Greg and IMO it's pretty easy to tell as most of Gregs animals have the same look to them.
It's a shame that people lable hybrids as intergrades because they are pretty much stopping any chance of the real thing being bred in any great numbers, this is the very reason i have never tried to find a mate for my Port mac because people from other states who have never been to Port Macquaire or ever seen a real Port Mac carpet seem to think they know the difference and tell people the wrong thing, something which isn't their fault or they don't believe what is KNOWN about about them.
Port mac carpets are very pretty pythons and it's a real shame that those poeple who have animals from Greg can't breed and sell them without people getting the wrong idea or trying to breed them with hybrids.
As someone else said you CAN NOT make an intergrade in captivity end of story, the only way you can breed intergrades is to have animals from a known line from Port Mac or you have caught your own animals from that area.
Carpets and Diamonds aren't the only species that do this, Tremains line of Platinum blonde macs are and intergraded varient between stimsoni and macs, another really nice natural varient.
Here is a pic of a Port mac carpet bred by Greg Hollis, he is about 8yrs old and i have had him since he was about 2 weeks old......nasty bloody thing though
Sorry about the small pic, will have to get some new pics of him, he's just a tricky one to play with lol.
I have typed out the difference between hybrids and intergrades so many time it's starting to loose all meaning.
In the Port Macquaire area 'intergrades' are found, these are not hybrids or crosses, they are just a locale of carpet python, thousands of years ago it's likely that diamonds and coastals did cross in this area but since then these wild crosses have become isolated from both coastals and diamonds.
So for thousands of years intergrades have been breeding with intergrades to become their own varient of carpet python.
Now people say 'how do you know theres no diamonds or carpets around port macquaire?' The answer is easy, ask anyone who lives or has spent anytime around Port and they will tell you the same thing, it's just intergrades.
I've been to Port mac many many times and have only ever seen intergrades.
As for pyshical lines between the species they probably isn't any but that doesn't mean something isn't stopping diamonds an coastals getting to Port.
To my knowledge there is only one person who breeds the genuine Port mac (intergrades) carpets, that is Greg Hollis, i'm sure Jamie can back me up on this. I don't know if Greg is still breeding them.
As far as i'm concerned the only people who can lay claim to having genuine Port Macs are people who have brought from Greg and IMO it's pretty easy to tell as most of Gregs animals have the same look to them.
It's a shame that people lable hybrids as intergrades because they are pretty much stopping any chance of the real thing being bred in any great numbers, this is the very reason i have never tried to find a mate for my Port mac because people from other states who have never been to Port Macquaire or ever seen a real Port Mac carpet seem to think they know the difference and tell people the wrong thing, something which isn't their fault or they don't believe what is KNOWN about about them.
Port mac carpets are very pretty pythons and it's a real shame that those poeple who have animals from Greg can't breed and sell them without people getting the wrong idea or trying to breed them with hybrids.
As someone else said you CAN NOT make an intergrade in captivity end of story, the only way you can breed intergrades is to have animals from a known line from Port Mac or you have caught your own animals from that area.
Carpets and Diamonds aren't the only species that do this, Tremains line of Platinum blonde macs are and intergraded varient between stimsoni and macs, another really nice natural varient.
Here is a pic of a Port mac carpet bred by Greg Hollis, he is about 8yrs old and i have had him since he was about 2 weeks old......nasty bloody thing though
Sorry about the small pic, will have to get some new pics of him, he's just a tricky one to play with lol.
scotchbo
Very Well-Known Member
i think to many people to are to quick to pass it of as a hybrid i hope they find out it's pure just so people who don't know what there talking about might say opps my bad lol and stop pouncing on the hybrid button everyone did it to me when i posted my coastal and then i found it is pure and no one said a word after that
Snake Catcher Victoria
Almost Legendary
i still reckon its a coastal,
scotchbo
Very Well-Known Member
thank's dugadugabowbow u hit the nail on the head lol
SnakeWrangler
Very Well-Known Member
Ignoring the fact that you or anyone else cannot say it was thousands of years ago because no one knows how long ago it was, if the offspring of a diamond / coastal are the basis for this particular "integrade", it means that it is a hybrid, a hybrid is a hybrid wether it is a naturally occurring one or not. In fact, if you bred a coastal with a diamond in captivity and then for "thousands of years" the offpsring were interbred, you would end up with the same thing.
To ensure my opinion on the matter is properly understood I will clarify what I believe about this. If I cross a coastal with a diamond, the result IS NOT the same as an integrade. It takes a lot of isolation to produce a consistent integrade like what can be found in that area.
I can guarantee that if you were to stand at the center point of Port Mac and walk in a straight line towards where coastals or diamonds are, at some point you will start to see integrades in the same general area as coastals or diamonds, there are no dead zones between the ranges of these animals and there are no physical barriers stopping a snake from one range crossing into another range. Interbreeding would be occurring at the boundaries of these ranges.
The problem is that to admit that there is natural hybridisation going on would then strengthen the argument set forth by pro hybrid keepers.
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